MTG Salvation

Quote from DRey

Hey guys, there's a discussion I had with council that want to share to the public. Recently I've discovered that moderators have the ability to "see" invisible members and investigate gimmick accounts. I feel this goes against the spirit of mafia because it gives them an unfair advantage against normal players. (ex: guy says he was without internet and not reading for the last few days, the mod sees he's invisible all the time in the thread therefore knows he's lying and scum lies more than town...).

That being said I don't think mods should be disallowed to play mafia games (of course) my first idea was to "turn off" those moderators powers just in the mafia subforum but the council already explained that's impossible so I want to ask if anyone has another solution to this "issue" if you even consider it a problem...

I mean, anyone can check when you were last on even if you are invisible through iTrader. Does that need to go as well?

Quote from DRey

Hey guys, there's a discussion I had with council that want to share to the public. Recently I've discovered that moderators have the ability to "see" invisible members and investigate gimmick accounts. I feel this goes against the spirit of mafia because it gives them an unfair advantage against normal players. (ex: guy says he was without internet and not reading for the last few days, the mod sees he's invisible all the time in the thread therefore knows he's lying and scum lies more than town...).

That being said I don't think mods should be disallowed to play mafia games (of course) my first idea was to "turn off" those moderators powers just in the mafia subforum but the council already explained that's impossible so I want to ask if anyone has another solution to this "issue" if you even consider it a problem...

If a mod is using the tools he has for other purposes for gaining an advantage in mafia, there are far more problems with the moderator than there is with the tools. That doesn't mean accidents don't happen. Part of being a global is checking for returning banned members and any gimmicks they have. I have accidentially discovered who a few gimmicks were because of the process. They were not in any games i was in at the time, so it was no harm no foul. When cyouni was using the NMA gimmick in Atlseal's mafia, i didn't use my tools to look up if he was a gimmick, nor did i ever elude to him being a gimmick in the game.

Bottom line, if a mod is trying to use tools the public does not have to win at mafia, they should be rethinking how important it is to win a game of mafia. Just like anyone wanting to make side-bets or use stalking tools that are open to everyone should take a step back when even thinking about using them to win a friendly game of mafia.

I fully agree with Arcadic's post.

In addition, I think that if you are worried about fairness, the best you can do is to go visible yourself.

I just noticed the change to the Mafia Hosting Signups + Player Rules thread OP. It looks disorganized compared to the former.

I'm all for change, but I know there is a better way to handle the structure of the OP. I'm just not sure what that something is yet.

Yeah, I accidentally broke the spoiler tags, so I'm currently in the process of fixing them. That was my mistake. I'm going to try to clean it up tomorrow.

JEEZ VOID THANKS FOR CALLING ATTENTION TO MY FAILURES.

There are many, many ways for unscrupulous people to attempt to cheat at mafia if they are so inclined. When that happens, we'll deal with it, but trying to prevent every possible way that someone *could* cheat probably isn't terribly useful.

You guys got the message wrong, I never mentioned cheating or anything like that, that totally not the point.

My point is: I feel it's an unfair advantage when a subset of players can see invisible players while the others cannot, and it's not a case of trying to cheat or anything like, the info is just there impossible to miss.

In fact I think this fact may have hurt me in the past simply because I had no idea of this...

TLDR: I think it's a good idea to require all moderators to play as a gimmick from now on, btw I know this won't prevent people from getting the info if they truly want, but I simply don't care. I trust salvation mods more than average people and I don't think anyone plays mafia with the intention to cheat anyway. But when the info is on your face it's impossible to not use it.

@GD I didn't understand what you said, sorry.

Quote from DRey

TLDR: I think it's a good idea to require all moderators to play as a gimmick from now on,

I, for one, never want the extra work of using a gimmick. And I can guarantee that I wouldn't remember to log into a gimmick the moment I wanted to view the mafia forum anyway.

btw I know this won't prevent people from getting the info if they truly want, but I simply don't care. I trust salvation mods more than average people and I don't think anyone plays mafia with the intention to cheat anyway. But when the info is on your face it's impossible to not use it.

I do agree with this however, which is why I've been considering turning off my own invisible mode, to level the playing field a bit.

Isn't everyone discouraged from using other user's online status as an in-game argument regardless? If a mod goes after an invisible user for being online but not posting, how is that different than if he/she went after a visible user this way?

I would probably leave Sally entirely if GM's site went up, but even though I suck at mafia, I like it too much to abandon it completely.

Mostly, I'm staying because I'd actually miss Iso and Cyan; they amuse the hell out of me.

Quote from Cyouni

If you're really that desperate to keep it hidden, just log out and read the threads you want as a guest. Same effect.

If this were Reddit, I'd upvote this comment, make twenty more accounts, and upvote it twenty more times.

This isn't Reddit, so I guess just /barn.

While I feel like it's a non-issue, (and, as Arcadic said, if you're abusing your mod powers to win at a friendly game of mafia you really have a bigger problem), I'll still be using gimmicks in mafia from now on, once my current games finish.

It's the easiest way to preserve the experience for myself.

Quote from Rick Santorum

While I feel like it's a non-issue, (and, as Arcadic said, if you're abusing your mod powers to win at a friendly game of mafia you really have a bigger problem), I'll still be using gimmicks in mafia from now on, once my current games finish.

It's the easiest way to preserve the experience for myself.

If you're going to use gimmicks forever, I would appreciate you putting your original account in your sig or something, so we all know who you are. Alternatively, something like naming the account "Playerxgimmick" or something would work.

Personally, I view threads on invisible because I view from work and while I might be sitting in a thread, it doesn't mean I'm actually doing anything and I hate it when someone calls you out in their post and then tries to use that against you when you don't reply immediately. If someone did that to me while I was invisible, I would report them to the council for unsportsmanlike behavior. Until that happens, its a non-issue.

Quote from Ecophagy

If you're going to use gimmicks forever, I would appreciate you putting your original account in your sig or something, so we all know who you are. Alternatively, something like naming the account "Playerxgimmick" or something would work.

Just this one. It would be awfully confusing to make new ones over and over...

And this account is already linked to my real account.

Magical Girl mafia is (finally) over with a Town Win.

DV, after calming down, did a fine job in the game, and I recommend he be removed from the probation list.

DragonHeart, on the other hand, was a complete menace, made at least 2 other players uncomfortable enough that they felt it worth PMing me about, and made one of the most blatant PM quotes I think I have ever seen. I know that my word isn't law or even close to it, but if it were up to me, I'd have him placed on probation indefinitely, and not be allowed to sign up for any further games for the rest of the calendar year.

Quote from Charm_Master3125

DragonHeart, on the other hand, was a complete menace, made at least 2 other players uncomfortable enough that they felt it worth PMing me about, and made one of the most blatant PM quotes I think I have ever seen. I know that my word isn't law or even close to it, but if it were up to me, I'd have him placed on probation indefinitely, and not be allowed to sign up for any further games for the rest of the calendar year.

He already told me that he doesn't like the MTGS Mafia subforum culture, and that he won't be playing here any more.

I can certainly get behind DV coming off the probation list.

Quote from Iso

Yeah, I accidentally broke the spoiler tags, so I'm currently in the process of fixing them. That was my mistake. I'm going to try to clean it up tomorrow.

JEEZ VOID THANKS FOR CALLING ATTENTION TO MY FAILURES.

Doesn't appear to be done yet.

Yeah, been busy with work and accidentally'd into 3 games at once when I had no intention of playing more than 2 at a time for a while.

Quote from Ecophagy

I can certainly get behind DV coming off the probation list.

I cannot.

He did just up and vanish for a good chunk of the game. Not sure if intentional lurking or otherwise.

I mean he was kind of suspended.

I will also support D_V coming off the probation list.

Quote from Tordeck

I cannot.

I'm confused as to why you care.

I, too, support DV coming off the probation list, as I always have. He put himself on there years (goddamn, really? It's been years?!) ago for a momentary lapse in judgement and sportsmanlike conduct, then proceeded to police himself. He's done his time.

Two years?

That's enough.

If DV would like to request removal from the probation list, I'm not aware of any reason that shouldn't happen at this juncture.

I'll remove him from the list.

Edit: I also support removing Reya from the list, he's completed a few games and not replaced out since he was put on the list.

How long as Reya been on the list?

By the way, thanks for all your hard work, Iso.

Sure thing.

Reya's been on the list since fall/winter of last year, IIRC.

I support both DV and Reya coming off the probahtion list.

Quote from Iso

Sure thing.

Reya's been on the list since fall/winter of last year, IIRC.

Then I see no reason to leave him on there.

Need another reviewer for a different set up (yeah, I know I write a lot of setups). I'm actually not sure what type of set up this is. I would hesitate to call it normal, but I'm not sure if its FTQ worthy. Maybe Specialty? As usual with me, there are no vanilla roles. There is an added mechanic based on items. I need someone with a good head for balance to help me with this. I have left 1 role unwritten that I would like the reviewer to collaborate with me on to make the game more balanced/fun. Let me know in thread or via PM if you're interested in reviewing.

Need a reviewer for my mini.

The game's title is MTGS Mafia Redux 2.

I would prefer someone with experience, for two reasons. One, I could use some ideas for the last couple of roles. And two, while the setup ain't, uh, Xyre-hard, I'm not the best judge of that anymore, so I could use some feedback on balance and complexity as well.

Quote from Xyre

Need a reviewer for my mini.

The game's title is MTGS Mafia Redux 2.

I would prefer someone with experience, for two reasons. One, I could use some ideas for the last couple of roles. And two, while the setup ain't, uh, Xyre-hard, I'm not the best judge of that anymore, so I could use some feedback on balance and complexity as well.

I shouldn't but it intrigues me. Send it my way.

Just for anyone interested in watching the train wreck, GoodGamery is running a spiffy 2-Headed Giant mafia game!

9 roles, each pair of heads shares a single gimmick account. It's pretty amusing so far.

Quote from rianalnn

Just for anyone interested in watching the train wreck, GoodGamery is running a spiffy 2-Headed Giant mafia game!

9 roles, each pair of heads shares a single gimmick account. It's pretty amusing so far.

That...is an awesome concept. Nice to see GG back in action.

What is the quickest way for a newbie to get into a game? I've played a bunch of times IRL for about 6 months now. Werewolf at GPs are pretty addicting.

I was wondering if there was a large MTGS signup queue, or if each game had their own sign up sheet.

Normals are rather complex to suggest them to a new player. A player in basic 68 just requested replacement, which would probably be your fastest way into a game, however the game is nearly over. PM MandersHex if you're interested in joining that game.

Yah, it would be, except I'd have to read like xxx pages worth of stuff... I'll be better off just hanging around waiting for a basic game (thanks for the heads up) to start.

Eddie

I've decided to update everyone on the status of my Mafia site.

Right now it's in the open Beta phase as I am still fiddling with a few things here and there, but the groundwork is done for the most part. At this point though I want to open it up and bring people in so people have a chance to see the forum, test it out, and start laying the community groundwork so once it gets to a good state we can hit the ground running.

So welcome to Mafia, The Gathering Darkness: http://forums.mtgdarkness.com/

Please direct all comments or suggestions towards this thread: http://forums.mtgdarkness.com/showthread.php?t=34235

Well, Guardman, I would if I didn't keep getting this message:

You did not enter the correct format for the The answer is fairly obvious field. Please read the field description for the expected format.

Strange, I had no issues at all.

Quote from Iso

Well, Guardman, I would if I didn't keep getting this message:

You did not enter the correct format for the The answer is fairly obvious field. Please read the field description for the expected format.

This.

I will let Guardman know over on MtgDarkness

EDIT: Message sent.

EDIT 2: I believe Pinkfloyd's game has been abadoned. It went into Night on the 13th and nothing has happened since.

I think I figured out the problem. I was trying to make it easier to register and one of the fields I thought I deleted just became invisible. Try it now.

Signed up. Looks nice.