Oh yeah, ZDS. I'm also very curious to know what you were talking about when you asked Manders whether she thought KJ and Zionite might have been busing each other (#469)?
@Town : Seriously, what is your definition of a "cult-like" scum team? Tell me how one can arrive to the definition "cult-like" and not have some sort of recruitment mechanic?
My best guess is that they (it?) can recruit and kill each night. Which would really only be balanced if we only had to take out the original scum(s).
Okay then mister smarty pants ball buster, then you come up with something.
I don't really want to speculate on how the mafia works, and EP's notes on it in post #4 are the relevant bit: Only the leader knows who all the mafia are and he controls them. They might be able to kill, they might be able to recruit they might be able to do both to some extent depending on their starting size, but such speculation isn't very useful, especially without seeing what happens in N1.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I don't really want to speculate on how the mafia works, and EP's notes on it in post #4 are the relevant bit: Only the leader knows who all the mafia are and he controls them. They might be able to kill, they might be able to recruit they might be able to do both to some extent depending on their starting size, but such speculation isn't very useful, especially without seeing what happens in N1.
Okay what I get from it is not only do the town have to scumhunt, but the scum have to scumhunt too. So we scumhunt for scum hunting scum. Excellent.
I got up early for you guys. I should still be sleeping.
Oh, and it took so long cuz after I lost the post last time, I REALLY didn't feel like doing it again. Sorry it took so long.
Let's ignore the fact that you're trying to state what you believe Manders' mindset is as fact and just go straight to the jump in logic that is never justified nor explained.
The way she's defending Iso, who I doubt any sane person will ACTUALLY lynch today given his claim that his PR will change tomarrow. So it's probably not because she actually thinks he might be lynched just based on speculation that he might be faking. So, then, what other reason does she have to defend him so vehemently?
So the conclusion I came to is that she thinks he's scum, with her, possibly based on her personal knowledge of him.
Note: I don't like how you're saying that I didn't justify my thinking there, as if I needed to do it right then. As always, if anyone want's to know my thinking on something, they can ask.
As for your whole [spoiler=The "Super Nice" PR In Action], it's a bunch of crap, but it was good for a laugh.
Like I said before, Mander's stated that her PR requires her to act super-nice. (Her actual claim was that it required her to be "overly friendly", which I interpret as the same thing.)
I recalled posts where she wasn't acting in a friendly manner, as would be required by a PR of the nature claimed, and I pointed them out.
You're putting words in my mouth that were never written. I said that what he posted sounds so scummy that I can't see any self-aware scum posting something that atrocious. The mindset that went behind it is what I see being impossible to be scum. I'm going the level below what's posted to what a player is thinking when they post something. That's the layer at which you will catch scum.
Potato, potahto. I understood what you were saying. It's still terrible reasoning, and mildly WIFOMy.
Thank you for trying to shift blame. This is not an argument this is deflection.
Not so much.Why, oh why does it feel like you're trying to paint me.
You said I am hiding behind my PR. Not that I am hiding something, but that I am hiding behind my PR.
Back up this statement with quotes showing me what makes you think that right now. Either that, or admit that you made it up to cast suspicion on me.
Neither. It was gut, mostly based on your tone in the beginning of the game. Like I've already said.
And? What part of that makes me scum?
I didn't want scum knowing anything about the intricacies of my PR.
That's not why I thought you were scum. I'll go back later and find the quote where I said you were scum, after I've posted this at some point, so that I can give people something to respond to.
For whatever reason, I didn't link his PR to the faked one in Amnesia. Probably because I eliminated that PR as an actual PR since, you know, IT WAS FAKED.
See above.
Which is largely irrelevent, as you didn't know that till after the game. You spent the entire game thinking he had that PR. But it's whatever.
Do you not recognize the hypocrisy here? You have no reason to believe I'm faking, either. You just decided to attack me for my PR.
I recognize why it LOOKS hypocritical. You've messed up on your PR with no visible repercussions. Iso hasn't.
As for him not being inconsistent, you apparently remember Amnesia. How many days did it take me to fulfill my moniker due to needing to post just one question in each post? Oh, right, I never ****ing did it because I ended up having to replace out.
I forget to do **** when I have a restriction. Doesn't mean I'm lying or scum.
This is true. Just curious: Why were you so open about your PR that game, but not this one?
No. YOU claimed that my PR is to act "super nice". I said I had specific instructions on what I have to say in every post. Specifically, I have to start each post with, "Oh, hi <insert player's name>" and include "hahaha" at least once a post.
I never said I had to post super nice, and I've told you before you were wrong in your assumption. You are ignoring what I say when it goes against your plan.
You said "overly friendly". That's how I interpretted it.
The post in which Arcadic made this vote seems pretty hollow - the awkward repetitions of 'fishing' just sounds like a buzzword without any conviction it.
I agree with this completely.
Even after the whole 'why are we talking about PRs?' thing, KJ still fixes upon this...
Awkward phrasing is awkward. Why do you feel the need to pressure him? surely that would be the reason to vote, not the pressure in itself.
I don't think there was. It's a large part of why I think he's scum.
Well, that's just bull - how is this PR hiding anything?
I thought she was using it to hide something. Gut feeling. I've explained this before.
You've made your reasoning on Manders clear, but why the others? Particularly Atlseal.
Zionite for the blatant reasonless vote, Atl is more of a gut read. He seems like he's trying to paint me. Also worth noting, I have him 4th cuz he's the one I'm least sure of.
The first time a strike method of missing her PR is mentioned...
Here, he makes a point of pointing out that I mentioned a "3-strikes" method for missing a PR. Never explains the relevence at all.
Manders is denying KJ's blatant fishing attempts.
Claims that I am fishing, which he later says is for role-related info. I don't see how asking someone to explain their post restriction will lead me to information about their role.
Fishing for more information about her PR.
Declaring her actions as not-helpful when presenting her with questions?
More accusations of fishing.
It seems to me your grasping at anything you can to make manders' look bad.
It seems to me your grasping at anything you can to make manders' kill-joy look bad.
1. More role fishing about the PR. Note that he has yet to question any of the other players with PRs at this time. Also assumes that the PR is incosequential to whatever abilitiys she might have.
2. I fail to see how her reactions have anything to do with her PR. Your looking for a reason to back off here, and this reason is bad.
vote kill-joy.
More accusations of fishing, followed by attempts to paint me.
Nope, but i was struggling to phrase my feelings about KJ's play so far. I think i showed why i dislike KJ's actions and why i felt the need to vote him, just did it rather poorly.
This is in response to atlseal's question of "Do you feel your last post was a particularly strong one.
He claims he struggled putting his feelings about me into words, however the post in question has a lot of conviction.
However, he fails to respond to my response in post 204. There's a chance he didn't see it, but if he did,
We don't KNOW jack about his PR changing. I mean, this is Iso, Town Liar. His behavior does speak for itself, he's only answering questions he wants to.
Interesting here how he tries to say that Iso may be lying about his PR changing. I see no rush for lynching him, especially since if his PR changes to something like Guard's fake PR in KittieTrek where he can't communicate, we can reopen this discussion tomarrow.
I beg to differ. He's made up plenty that would parallel this. Not to say i believe he is lying, but nothing is out of the real of possibiliy when Iso posts.
Says he doesn't necessarily believe Iso is lying, but the tone of the first sentence seems to indicate exactly that. If he doesn't believe he's lying, what's the rush?
Is this votecount right? KJ is at l-3 with 4 people voting him?
I see nothing but town tells coming from that TCM post. He's showing actual involvement in a key issue currently in the game and actually posting about it. That town TCM behavior, not scum.
Like my KJ vote more and more the less he posts.
Here he calls me out for lurking this game. I've already pointed out that as of that post, he only have 5 posts to my 20. His reasoning is terrible, and obviously wrong.
@manders
My experience with TIK TCM says he doesn't pay as much attention when he's scum. Its entirely possible my sample does not match yours, but so far i am only seeing typical TIK town stuff.
Claims I'm omgusing him, which I didn't. Also doesn't respond to my post calling his lie about my "lurking".
Pretty offensive here, why so actively pushing people's buttons. Aren't you the same player who self-classified himself as useless before day 3?
Seppel's not even defending Iso. He's attempting to show Eco that Iso isn't worth ignoring just because of the difficulty of communication. Eco in no way was saying anything Iso's done was a strike against him. I happen to agree with Eco and Seppel here, Iso's not worth reading when he does things like but when he actually tries to make a point, he's readable.
This post is what i am refering to, along with my post calling him out for his diminished activity around the time he became a target. I've never seen such blatant OMGUS. This post showed me that KJ feels like he has something to protect and his words and actions above aim to throw that suspicsion anywhere he can.
Here he says that it's my dimisnished activity that piqued his interest. I guess "the less and less he posts" can be interpretted as such. Null tell. However, his accusation of mudslinging (again) and his speculation of my reasoning makes me like him less.
I am still enjoying my vote on KJ. His complete lack of contribution since the above post is very scummy. I also would consider voting zionite for his over-reaction to the Iso PR situation with Eco, Iso and Seppel.
He would consider voting Zionite over the Iso PR situation, but the pressure vote from zion does nothing for him? Also, this means he think he's scummy... which is interesting because...
His tone here with him seems casual. Doesn't read like he suspects him of anything.
Sure, you could possibly call his over-reaction normal. You cannot call him listing the 3-4 people voting him as scummy a normal town reaction.
@Town : Seriously, what is your definition of a "cult-like" scum team? Tell me how one can arrive to the definition "cult-like" and not have some sort of recruitment mechanic?
Then he goes on to say that making a 3-4 person scum list is scummy, when there's likely 3-4 scum this game.
Asking about recruitment, null.
Further reading:
Ced's 290
Questions for Arcadic:
How is mentioning a strike method relevent?
How does asking about a PR = fishing for role info?
How is listing 3-4 people as scum scummy?
What do you think of Zionite's pressure vote on me?
[/spoiler]
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Go check out Doha Mafia. It had a cult-like scumteam, and the "recruitment mechanic" in that game was essentially unpredictable. You're implying that the recruitment mechanic directly benefits from the scum knowing who the townies are (i.e. literally a cult), but the rules seems to imply that the potential scum are "locked in" and already have lone scum roles.
I.e., you're suggesting knowledge of something I can't derive from info we have.
I'm very familiar with Doha, i read it for about 1000 pages before giving up on the town. What's the primary difference between Doha and this? The mod has told us the mafia is "cult-like".
I don't see the parallel of Mafia can't talk to each other and cult. Possibly because there have been 0 games i've participated in with a cult. When i hear cult, i think recruitment, the thing that unbalances a cult. A "cult-like" scumteam to me says that they can somehow add more members. It also says to me that the number of alive mafia/cultists can change. I may be assuming something i don't know anything about, but i think its safer to assume the possiblity of a person's alignment changing than the mafia's setup simply being a king and some blind pawns.
[FONT=georgia]
I don't know why you think his reactions are over-reactions; they are not.
Second, let me point out he was voting Manders before she OMGUSed him (iirc), and is entirely right to find scummy Zionite's "pressure" vote and your hypocritical accusation of lurking.
Your over-reacting to my lurking accusation. It was nothing of the sort. I was calling KJ out about his drop in activity after being a hot topic of conversation, not that he was lurking. And accusation that stuck pretty well.
Why should I have to answer any of this in the first place? It's a bull**** question that doesn't mean anything anyway. Like, seriously, you're going to determine whether I'm faking or not? What purpose would there be in faking this particular PR? Does it allow me to not provide content? Does it allow me to actively lurk?
Hahaha, no. It doesn't do any of those. It makes me look like an overly-friendly person. But, hey! Guess what? I ALREADY AM!!
So, are you trying to say that you think I'm scum because I didn't give you a straight answer on this?
Hahahaha
I never said it was in my PM, which you are operating under the impression of, that I have to act overly friendly. I said my PR makes it look like I am. You continuously pushing this is just terrible.
And the fact that you suddenly, once again, have no feelings I'm scum, is just icing on the cake. You've NEVER had a behavioral reason to think I am scum. Only your paranoid-ass "ZOMG SHE COULD BE FAKING". Same situation as Xander and Batman. Which is why it's just as much BS with you as him.
This post from manders doesn't have any contradiction
Zionite, you're jumping way too fast to conclusion
TCM, aside of Seppel and Iso you're going after on your tunnel
For reasons that IMO fall in the case of "null tell"
What are your thoughts on Kill-Joy and Zionite?
With your "simple logic" could you give me your light?
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
The first time a strike method of missing her PR is mentioned...
Here, he makes a point of pointing out that I mentioned a "3-strikes" method for missing a PR. Never explains the relevence at all.
Manders is denying KJ's blatant fishing attempts.
Claims that I am fishing, which he later says is for role-related info. I don't see how asking someone to explain their post restriction will lead me to information about their role.
Fishing for more information about her PR.
Declaring her actions as not-helpful when presenting her with questions?
More accusations of fishing.
2+3.
1. More role fishing about the PR. Note that he has yet to question any of the other players with PRs at this time. Also assumes that the PR is incosequential to whatever abilitiys she might have.
2. I fail to see how her reactions have anything to do with her PR. Your looking for a reason to back off here, and this reason is bad.
vote kill-joy.
More accusations of fishing, followed by attempts to paint me.
Nope, but i was struggling to phrase my feelings about KJ's play so far. I think i showed why i dislike KJ's actions and why i felt the need to vote him, just did it rather poorly.
This is in response to atlseal's question of "Do you feel your last post was a particularly strong one.
He claims he struggled putting his feelings about me into words, however the post in question has a lot of conviction.
However, he fails to respond to my response in post 204. There's a chance he didn't see it, but if he did,
We don't KNOW jack about his PR changing. I mean, this is Iso, Town Liar. His behavior does speak for itself, he's only answering questions he wants to.
Interesting here how he tries to say that Iso may be lying about his PR changing. I see no rush for lynching him, especially since if his PR changes to something like Guard's fake PR in KittieTrek where he can't communicate, we can reopen this discussion tomarrow.
I beg to differ. He's made up plenty that would parallel this. Not to say i believe he is lying, but nothing is out of the real of possibiliy when Iso posts.
Says he doesn't necessarily believe Iso is lying, but the tone of the first sentence seems to indicate exactly that. If he doesn't believe he's lying, what's the rush?
Is this votecount right? KJ is at l-3 with 4 people voting him?
I see nothing but town tells coming from that TCM post. He's showing actual involvement in a key issue currently in the game and actually posting about it. That town TCM behavior, not scum.
Like my KJ vote more and more the less he posts.
Here he calls me out for lurking this game. I've already pointed out that as of that post, he only have 5 posts to my 20. His reasoning is terrible, and obviously wrong.
@manders
My experience with TIK TCM says he doesn't pay as much attention when he's scum. Its entirely possible my sample does not match yours, but so far i am only seeing typical TIK town stuff.
Claims I'm omgusing him, which I didn't. Also doesn't respond to my post calling his lie about my "lurking".
Pretty offensive here, why so actively pushing people's buttons. Aren't you the same player who self-classified himself as useless before day 3?
Seppel's not even defending Iso. He's attempting to show Eco that Iso isn't worth ignoring just because of the difficulty of communication. Eco in no way was saying anything Iso's done was a strike against him. I happen to agree with Eco and Seppel here, Iso's not worth reading when he does things like but when he actually tries to make a point, he's readable.
This post is what i am refering to, along with my post calling him out for his diminished activity around the time he became a target. I've never seen such blatant OMGUS. This post showed me that KJ feels like he has something to protect and his words and actions above aim to throw that suspicsion anywhere he can.
Here he says that it's my dimisnished activity that piqued his interest. I guess "the less and less he posts" can be interpretted as such. Null tell. However, his accusation of mudslinging (again) and his speculation of my reasoning makes me like him less.
7.
I am still enjoying my vote on KJ. His complete lack of contribution since the above post is very scummy. I also would consider voting zionite for his over-reaction to the Iso PR situation with Eco, Iso and Seppel.
He would consider voting Zionite over the Iso PR situation, but the pressure vote from zion does nothing for him? Also, this means he think he's scummy... which is interesting because...
His tone here with him seems casual. Doesn't read like he suspects him of anything.
9.
Sure, you could possibly call his over-reaction normal. You cannot call him listing the 3-4 people voting him as scummy a normal town reaction.
@Town : Seriously, what is your definition of a "cult-like" scum team? Tell me how one can arrive to the definition "cult-like" and not have some sort of recruitment mechanic?
Then he goes on to say that making a 3-4 person scum list is scummy, when there's likely 3-4 scum this game.
1. It's called making a note. One would notice that you made the first accusation of a strike method THEN manders said she had a strike method. If you truly belived manders was faking it, you'd have noticed she mention the strikes long after you did.
2. You didn't ask about her PR, you asked if breaking her PR would have her lose something. That's fishing for if she has any abilities other than the restriction.
3. Attempting to paint you? I called your actions terrible.
4. KJ twists my words and actions to seem like i want to lynch Iso, where instead i am simply showing that Iso is a Liar and that regardless of his actions he is un-trustworthy.
5. Again, you read what you wanted to read. IE: Something to attack. Your activity had fallen right when you became the topic of conversation and my notice of that caused you to ZOMGUS me onto your scumlist. Because, you know, you've said something about me being scummy before that list. (he hadn't)
6. This case is BS. No actually, its just more deflection from the pressure he's getting.
7. How does Iso even come into play with my seeing Zionite as scummy. It doesn't it's all about Eco and Seppel and has little to do with Iso.
8. Sarcasm
Your Head
9. When its the 4 people who are voting you, Its scummy OMGUS.
What do you think of Zionite's pressure vote on me?
Meh. Its yet another thing that makes me dislike zionite but its a null tell on your alignment.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
How can you possibly chastise someone for not having a read on Ace at this stage of the game?!
With my categoeires, it actually differs a lot. The o with lynching would imply Ace is avoiding the thread for a reason, where not bei gok would imply (the now obvious decision) that Ace should be replaced, and his role should not be lynched.
Why do you ignore the possibility that he is faking it and is town?
Because there is no reason town would spam the thread up this much with useless faces, unless he was scum? And if your statement is in fact correct, I have had quite enough of his gambits shooting the town in the foot.
I doubt I defended Seppel, but feel free.
You actually did. You stated he should be left alone because he would contribute later, pretty much turning a blind eye to my actual reason for putting a vote on him. Despite you being correct on this (as I feel he is contributing more), that should not excuse his earliar bad posts.
That being said, since he is no longer doing what I voted him for, Unvote Seppel.
For a start, it defeats the entire purpose of what TCM was asking for - forcing you to take a stance. But, unlike TIM (IIRC), who at least put it bluntly that he wasn't sure where to put them, you instead put them in two different (and contradictory) lynch tiers, rather than raise the issue that you couldn't categorise them.
Thank you, Ced. What he did would be similiar to some smart ass 7th grader filling in the space between two circles.
These types of posts really need to cease. I am speaking as a somebody sick of long games, so keep this part of the post seperate from what you think my alignment is. This isn't the sole reason, but when I see posts like this from you two, and notice you have the highest post counts, that really irks me. Back to the game
Hahahaha, no. The only reason that's even a factor is because of how vehenmently he overreacted to it. If he had just stated that he didn't buy the PR, that would be fine.
But if I didn't buy the posting restriction, wouldn't it make sense that I thought he was scum because he was faking? Your conclusion if true, will only make me dislike Iso.
But, no. He sought to lynch him solely based on the fact that Iso has/claims to have this PR. That is what drew him negative attention.
What exactly do you propose I do, call him scummy for the green winky face he made to you but not Flew or Ace (that was sarcasm, but you get my point).
The only reasoning I can give to Iso's posting, to me, is how frequently he is posting. As a town player, all he has to do is at the end of the day, quote everything he wants to respond to, and do so. His one person quoting, one smiley is doing nothing but clogging the thread.
I never said it was in my PM, which you are operating under the impression of, that I have to act overly friendly. I said my PR makes it look like I am. You continuously pushing this is just terrible.
I got to side with KJ here. I read that as you being "required" to be overfriendly, hence why every single one of your posts started with "Oh hi person X".
And the fact that you suddenly, once again, have no feelings I'm scum, is just icing on the cake. You've NEVER had a behavioral reason to think I am scum. Only your paranoid-ass "ZOMG SHE COULD BE FAKING". Same situation as Xander and Batman. Which is why it's just as much BS with you as him.
It is not BS, and the fact that you alluded to Iso might be faking as town really bothers me the more I think about it.
TCM, aside of Seppel and Iso you're going after on your tunnel
Not tunneling. I would hardly say I made a case on Seppel, more or less I voted for him to actually post relevence. I dareso whether or not it worked, he is doing so. Iso's situation, I would compare to Super Sentai where I think everyone just wants to see Iso change, much like several people wanted to see DCD vig, but anyway, I digress.
For reasons that IMO fall in the case of "null tell"
What are your thoughts on Kill-Joy and Zionite?
KJ I still feel is geniune. My only doubt from him was that he "disappeared" from the thread, which I saw as avoiding attracting further attention, but his last post against Manders makes me feel better about him.
Zionite I am a bit in the middle with. I don't like his garbage vote on me earlier, but every Zionite I have played with has thought me scum in everygame (except in Flame Warriors when his 2nd incarnation was gunning for Iso, and he was only right in basic 28).
I wouldn't stop his lynch, but I would definitly explore other options first. If Manders were to be lynched and flipped scum, I could definitly see his last post as a bus attempt.
With your "simple logic" could you give me your light?
Hahaha, I'm sorry, but I can't decipher what you're trying to say in your post that quotes Cedwick voting for Mommy Dearest here a million times. Unless you're saying we should all do that? But you're not doing that, so I don't think that's right.
You're grasping at straws. How was he supposed to know there was a difference between "my PR makes me look friendly" and "my PR makes me look friendly because it says so in my PM"?
Um...deductive reasoning? Did you even read the rest of that post that he left out? I'm ranting at him that it's bull**** that he's asking me about specifics on my PR and stating that I will not be providing them.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Hahaha, I'm sorry, but I can't decipher what you're trying to say in your post that quotes Cedwick voting for Mommy Dearest here a million times. Unless you're saying we should all do that? But you're not doing that, so I don't think that's right.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Because there is no reason town would spam the thread up this much with useless faces, unless he was scum? And if your statement is in fact correct, I have had quite enough of his gambits shooting the town in the foot.
Yes, there is a reason town would fake a PR. For the lulz, as shown by Guardman in Kitteh Trek and MYSELF in Red Dwarf Mafia. You need to recognize this is a possibility. Your failure to do so is very disheartening.
You actually did. You stated he should be left alone because he would contribute later, pretty much turning a blind eye to my actual reason for putting a vote on him. Despite you being correct on this (as I feel he is contributing more), that should not excuse his earliar bad posts.
These types of posts really need to cease. I am speaking as a somebody sick of long games, so keep this part of the post seperate from what you think my alignment is. This isn't the sole reason, but when I see posts like this from you two, and notice you have the highest post counts, that really irks me. Back to the game
You know what? Go look at it all in context. He thought I was taking away from something that he did in the game. Those posts are completely on topic and valid content. So stop being mean.
But if I didn't buy the posting restriction, wouldn't it make sense that I thought he was scum because he was faking? Your conclusion if true, will only make me dislike Iso.
I'm pretty sure you already dislike Iso, and I'm pretty sure he doesn't care.
Regardless, I don't think he's faking. I'm unable to discern if he's scum or town until he can talk for real.
What exactly do you propose I do, call him scummy for the green winky face he made to you but not Flew or Ace (that was sarcasm, but you get my point).
The only reasoning I can give to Iso's posting, to me, is how frequently he is posting. As a town player, all he has to do is at the end of the day, quote everything he wants to respond to, and do so. His one person quoting, one smiley is doing nothing but clogging the thread.
Who died and made you God of Judging Content?
Seriously, I'm sick and tired of Iso and I constantly being accused of just spamming the thread and being told we need to post less because other people in the game don't post as much as we do. NOT. OUR. PROBLEM. Every person in this game knew that Iso and I post a lot when they decided to join it. So get over it.
I got to side with KJ here. I read that as you being "required" to be overfriendly, hence why every single one of your posts started with "Oh hi person X".
It was. It's not anymore. He's been providing a higher ratio of content to spam for a fair amount of time now. He just gets no credit for it because he spammed for so long.
He quotes my vote nine times between a couple of identical Arcadic quotes. I don't think that number is a coincidence (lynch threshold is 9 right now).
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Ced is voting for ZDS and I see decent arguments for voting ZDS but at the same time I don't see any conviction behind Ced's post. It's like he's talking to ZDS and not actually trying to get us to see what he's seeing.
A deficiency in potassium causes fatigue, irritability, and hypertension (increased blood pressure). Overdose of potassium from natural sources is nearly impossible.
1) Where is your vote?
2) Where is my vote?
3) Someone took my vote away.
4) Why isn't everyone voting ZDS?
5) Why isn't everyone voting someone else?
6) None of the above.
1) Where is your vote?
2) Where is my vote?
3) Someone took my vote away.
4) Why isn't everyone voting ZDS?
5) Why isn't everyone voting someone else? 6) None of the above.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Oh yeah, ZDS. I'm also very curious to know what you were talking about when you asked Manders whether she thought KJ and Zionite might have been busing each other (#469)?
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I'm going to speculate for just a moment, then I'm going to ignore what I'm saying. Assuming the mafia can recruit and kill each night, that probably means we just have to take down the sculmt leader unless things are absolutely bezonkers. But having said that, if we're hunting only one scum right now, that explains why I have so many town reads.
Now I'm going to ignore what I said, and play this as if it were a normal game of mafia, and just enjoy the ride until the inevitable crash and burn reminiscent of Doha, Return to Amistaria, and Starcraft.
I'm going to speculate for just a moment, then I'm going to ignore what I'm saying. Assuming the mafia can recruit and kill each night, that probably means we just have to take down the sculmt leader unless things are absolutely bezonkers. But having said that, if we're hunting only one scum right now, that explains why I have so many town reads.
Now I'm going to ignore what I said, and play this as if it were a normal game of mafia, and just enjoy the ride until the inevitable crash and burn reminiscent of Doha, Return to Amistaria, and Starcraft.
- It has to do with Iso having a very good reason to fake this particular PR until he can start recruiting tonight. (note: this only is true if the scum leader is currently the only scum, which we have no way to be sure is the case; don't expect me to turn this into a serious argument any time soon :p)
Go check out Doha Mafia. It had a cult-like scumteam, and the "recruitment mechanic" in that game was essentially unpredictable. You're implying that the recruitment mechanic directly benefits from the scum knowing who the townies are (i.e. literally a cult), but the rules seems to imply that the potential scum are "locked in" and already have lone scum roles.
I.e., you're suggesting knowledge of something I can't derive from info we have.
Why do you single out the people you do and ignore the others who say the same thing?
It's different for many reasons - a role can prove crucial to the outcome of a game, and can save a player from being lynched in going some way to proving alignment.
A PR does not.
I'm not reading your breadcrumbs. What you are is not important to me role-wise. Only alignment-wise.
IF I HAD THE ABILITY TO REMOVE PRS I WOULD WANT ISO TO JUST ADMIT HE IS FAKING SO I DID'NT WASTE MY ABILITY!
Oh, ffs, for the last time, Shalako:
ISO'S. PR. WILL. BE. DIFFERENT. TOMORROW. PERIOD.
When was the last time you saw a PR change day to day?
Then why did you/are you voting for him now?
Read why I said I was voting him.
It's called trying to interpret what he's saying. You should try it sometime.
Quote from ZeDorkSlipeur »
There is absolutely no way your read on his post comes from anywhere other than your vivid imagination. Stop saying it's Iso's argument; it's yours and only yours.
- "Danger zone" is the name I gave to the blurry zone that I had Shal and have Arcadic in.
Highway to the Dangerzone!
Arcadic: For your information, Kill-joy's activity has dropped at the same moment in Boardgame as well (he is HK-457 in there). Granted, he also was under pressure there. Still, for what it's worth, he is completely right. There are many possible reasons not related to his alignment for why he isn't posting much, and you calling him out on lurking when you post so sporadically is very bad form.
Could we not talk about ongoing games.
(Also last part is an Ad Hom.)
This post from manders doesn't have any contradiction
Zionite, you're jumping way too fast to conclusion
TCM, aside of Seppel and Iso you're going after on your tunnel
For reasons that IMO fall in the case of "null tell"
What are your thoughts on Kill-Joy and Zionite?
With your "simple logic" could you give me your light?
It helps if you put the quotes in the correct order, and don't forget to put the post where you said Arcadic was scum but voted kill-joy in between them.
Yes, there is a reason town would fake a PR. For the lulz, as shown by Guardman in Kitteh Trek and MYSELF in Red Dwarf Mafia. You need to recognize this is a possibility. Your failure to do so is very disheartening.
That bolded is a bloody great reason to fake a nonspeaking PR.:rolleyes:
Seriously, it isn't. I can't find Red Dwarf, but from my brief read of the end of Kitteh Trek, I side strongly with Wrath of Dog, and would have been outraged to be on the town, knowing Guardman was faking. And you can bet your ass I would call him on that (and be right). It was just lolsy that D-rey was scared enough to admit wanting him dead, and he saw through that PR as mafia.
Oh, yeah, I remember that now.
I was right, hahaha.
I wasn't seriously considering a Seppel wagon. And believe it or not, it wasn't his response I was interested in (although he did make me feel better).
You know what? Go look at it all in context. He thought I was taking away from something that he did in the game. Those posts are completely on topic and valid content. So stop being mean.
In the name of science. Totally on topic. How exactly did you expect him to respond? If you were truly cooperating him, you would have asked him a specific question, instead of just going "wat"?
I'm pretty sure you already dislike Iso, and I'm pretty sure he doesn't care.
I think you give him far too much credit as the best scum hunter here, but I don't dislike him. I can't say there is anyone on this site I dislike.
Who died and made you God of Judging Content?
No one...? But seeing every other post as a smiley is irking. I think that's would he should do, but I can't make him
Seriously, I'm sick and tired of Iso and I constantly being accused of just spamming the thread and being told we need to post less because other people in the game don't post as much as we do. NOT. OUR. PROBLEM. Every person in this game knew that Iso and I post a lot when they decided to join it. So get over it.
/rant
No? However, when you consider Smiley McGee has over 100 posts, it does make me think you should tone it down, just a tad.
Then read it again.
I didn't allude ****, I straight up said that he could be town faking a PR.
I don't like that you even think this is an option.
Seriously, it isn't. I can't find Red Dwarf, but from my brief read of the end of Kitteh Trek, I side strongly with Wrath of Dog, and would have been outraged to be on the town, knowing Guardman was faking. And you can bet your ass I would call him on that (and be right). It was just lolsy that D-rey was scared enough to admit wanting him dead, and he saw through that PR as mafia.
There you go.
But no one knew Guardman was faking until the game was over.
I wasn't seriously considering a Seppel wagon. And believe it or not, it wasn't his response I was interested in (although he did make me feel better).
In the name of science. Totally on topic. How exactly did you expect him to respond? If you were truly cooperating him, you would have asked him a specific question, instead of just going "wat"?
I didn't understand what his problem with my post was, so I asked him, "wat?" He responded, and I explained. The "In the name of science" bit is a joke because = :science
I don't like that you even think this is an option.
I don't care. It is an option, whether you like it or not. I don't believe this is the case (you know, since I don't think he's faking) but I will recognize it as a possibility.
Yes, there is a reason town would fake a PR. For the lulz, as shown by Guardman in Kitteh Trek and MYSELF in Red Dwarf Mafia. You need to recognize this is a possibility. Your failure to do so is very disheartening.
This is getting ridiculous. You're going to tell me that if you knew Iso was faking his PR, you would not want him lynched? You're seriously comparing faking a PR consisting of actual words with one consisting of smilies? Your admiration for/personal friendship with/pity for Iso (pick one) is causing you to be completely irrational. There is no good reason for a townie to fake such a restrictive, annoying, and distracting PR.
This is getting ridiculous. You're going to tell me that if you knew Iso was faking his PR, you would not want him lynched? You're seriously comparing faking a PR consisting of actual words with one consisting of smilies? Your admiration for/personal friendship with/pity for Iso (pick one) is causing you to be completely irrational. There is no good reason for a townie to fake such a restrictive, annoying, and distracting PR.
Hahahaha, irrational?! You know, I fail to give a damn what any of you think. I've already said I don't believe he's faking it, so why does this bother anyone that I believe TOWN FAKE PRs?
Hahahaha, when did I say it was a good reason? But it is a reason with evidence of it happening in the past.
You wouldn't adamantly defend him if you didn't think it was good reason. If you thought he is faking for a bad reason, why would you let him live?
There you go.
As annoying as faking a role such as MMM, at least you can still communicate with words. Hell, you could even claim if you wanted to.
But no one knew Guardman was faking until the game was over.
Does that make any difference whether the town noticed or not that he was purposefully being unhelpful? The point is that he was being unhelpful, and would have been safe lynched if I had anything to do with it.
Whose response were you interested in?
1). An Attempt to see if he would start posting more content posts.
2). How you would respond after I moved off the beloved Iso (I say that with love, not sarcasm).
I didn't say he was the best scum hunter. I said he was good, and he is.
I distinctly remember you saying when asked why is keeping Iso alive different than any other player, you saying a varient of this.
Mmm, no. Seriously, we both deal with people complaining about how much we post in just about every game we play in, and it's bull****.
Not trying to play the mob mentality, but there is probably a ring to truth if you are both constantly dealing with people complaining about in-game spam...
I don't care. It is an option, whether you like it or not. I don't believe this is the case (you know, since I don't think he's faking) but I will recognize it as a possibility.
Why even bring it up then? It seems like if he is faking, your trying to cover that up for him.
Hahahaha, irrational?! You know, I fail to give a damn what any of you think. I've already said I don't believe he's faking it, so why does this bother anyone that I believe TOWN FAKE PRs?
Because frankly, they shouldn't. Especially not for the "lulz"...
1. It's called making a note. One would notice that you made the first accusation of a strike method THEN manders said she had a strike method. If you truly belived manders was faking it, you'd have noticed she mention the strikes long after you did.
I did notice. Again, I don't see where the strike method is relevent.
2. You didn't ask about her PR, you asked if breaking her PR would have her lose something. That's fishing for if she has any abilities other than the restriction.
No, I asked about "negative effects". Like modkills. I was wondering if it would result in a modkill.
3. Attempting to paint you? I called your actions terrible.
You're twisting EVERYTHING i do to make it look scummy. That's painting.
4. KJ twists my words and actions to seem like i want to lynch Iso, where instead i am simply showing that Iso is a Liar and that regardless of his actions he is un-trustworthy.
I read it as you were advocating a lynch on him because you thought he was faking the PR.
5. Again, you read what you wanted to read. IE: Something to attack. Your activity had fallen right when you became the topic of conversation and my notice of that caused you to ZOMGUS me onto your scumlist. Because, you know, you've said something about me being scummy before that list. (he hadn't)
And yet, at least one other person also saw what I saw. If I was trying to attack you, as you say, then what was ZDS doing when he said my points were valid? Was he attacking you too?
Also, However, I admitted to possibly misreading it. And yet you're attempting to use it against me?
6. This case is BS. No actually, its just more deflection from the pressure he's getting.
I'm not deflecting.
7. How does Iso even come into play with my seeing Zionite as scummy. It doesn't it's all about Eco and Seppel and has little to do with Iso.
8. Sarcasm
7. Ok, misread that too then.
8. Yea, my sarcasm detector is a bit off. Need to work on that.
Your Head
9. When its the 4 people who are voting you, Its scummy OMGUS.
They did so scummily. But I'm over two of them. You or Zionite need to get lynched.
What do you think of Zionite's pressure vote on me?
Meh. Its yet another thing that makes me dislike zionite but its a null tell on your alignment.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
My best guess is that they (it?) can recruit and kill each night. Which would really only be balanced if we only had to take out the original scum(s).
I'm just enjoying the ride.
I don't really want to speculate on how the mafia works, and EP's notes on it in post #4 are the relevant bit: Only the leader knows who all the mafia are and he controls them. They might be able to kill, they might be able to recruit they might be able to do both to some extent depending on their starting size, but such speculation isn't very useful, especially without seeing what happens in N1.
Hahaha, oh right, and you created a super non-busted game last time.
HYPOCRITE.
ZDS is now my second pick for scum. And I'm about tired of waiting for kill-joy, guys.
Tired of corporate corruption ruining your favorite MtG site?
Come join ours!!
We even have Mafia!!
EWP: Oh...nevermind then.
Okay what I get from it is not only do the town have to scumhunt, but the scum have to scumhunt too. So we scumhunt for scum hunting scum. Excellent.
Oh, and it took so long cuz after I lost the post last time, I REALLY didn't feel like doing it again. Sorry it took so long.
The way she's defending Iso, who I doubt any sane person will ACTUALLY lynch today given his claim that his PR will change tomarrow. So it's probably not because she actually thinks he might be lynched just based on speculation that he might be faking. So, then, what other reason does she have to defend him so vehemently?
So the conclusion I came to is that she thinks he's scum, with her, possibly based on her personal knowledge of him.
Note: I don't like how you're saying that I didn't justify my thinking there, as if I needed to do it right then. As always, if anyone want's to know my thinking on something, they can ask.
Like I said before, Mander's stated that her PR requires her to act super-nice. (Her actual claim was that it required her to be "overly friendly", which I interpret as the same thing.)
I recalled posts where she wasn't acting in a friendly manner, as would be required by a PR of the nature claimed, and I pointed them out.
Potato, potahto. I understood what you were saying. It's still terrible reasoning, and mildly WIFOMy.
Not so much.Why, oh why does it feel like you're trying to paint me.
Neither. It was gut, mostly based on your tone in the beginning of the game. Like I've already said.
That's not why I thought you were scum. I'll go back later and find the quote where I said you were scum, after I've posted this at some point, so that I can give people something to respond to.
Which is largely irrelevent, as you didn't know that till after the game. You spent the entire game thinking he had that PR. But it's whatever.
I recognize why it LOOKS hypocritical. You've messed up on your PR with no visible repercussions. Iso hasn't.
This is true. Just curious: Why were you so open about your PR that game, but not this one?
You said "overly friendly". That's how I interpretted it.
I agree with this completely.
Even after the whole 'why are we talking about PRs?' thing, KJ still fixes upon this...
I don't think there was. It's a large part of why I think he's scum.
I thought she was using it to hide something. Gut feeling. I've explained this before.
Zionite for the blatant reasonless vote, Atl is more of a gut read. He seems like he's trying to paint me. Also worth noting, I have him 4th cuz he's the one I'm least sure of.
Arcadic:
[spoiler=ARCADIC POSTS]
RVS, null.
Here, he makes a point of pointing out that I mentioned a "3-strikes" method for missing a PR. Never explains the relevence at all.
Claims that I am fishing, which he later says is for role-related info. I don't see how asking someone to explain their post restriction will lead me to information about their role.
More accusations of fishing.
It seems to me your grasping at anything you can to make
manders'kill-joy look bad.More accusations of fishing, followed by attempts to paint me.
This is in response to atlseal's question of "Do you feel your last post was a particularly strong one.
He claims he struggled putting his feelings about me into words, however the post in question has a lot of conviction.
However, he fails to respond to my response in post 204. There's a chance he didn't see it, but if he did,
He still hasn't, btw.
Interesting here how he tries to say that Iso may be lying about his PR changing. I see no rush for lynching him, especially since if his PR changes to something like Guard's fake PR in KittieTrek where he can't communicate, we can reopen this discussion tomarrow.
Says he doesn't necessarily believe Iso is lying, but the tone of the first sentence seems to indicate exactly that. If he doesn't believe he's lying, what's the rush?
Null questioning of the votecount
Here he calls me out for lurking this game. I've already pointed out that as of that post, he only have 5 posts to my 20. His reasoning is terrible, and obviously wrong.
Claims I'm omgusing him, which I didn't. Also doesn't respond to my post calling his lie about my "lurking".
Some points on Iso, which I think are Null.
Still pushing me. With a bs case.
Here he says that it's my dimisnished activity that piqued his interest. I guess "the less and less he posts" can be interpretted as such. Null tell. However, his accusation of mudslinging (again) and his speculation of my reasoning makes me like him less.
He would consider voting Zionite over the Iso PR situation, but the pressure vote from zion does nothing for him? Also, this means he think he's scummy... which is interesting because...
His tone here with him seems casual. Doesn't read like he suspects him of anything.
Then he goes on to say that making a 3-4 person scum list is scummy, when there's likely 3-4 scum this game.
Asking about recruitment, null.
Further reading:
Ced's 290
Questions for Arcadic:
How is mentioning a strike method relevent?
How does asking about a PR = fishing for role info?
How is listing 3-4 people as scum scummy?
What do you think of Zionite's pressure vote on me?
[/spoiler]
So with that I will Unvote, Vote Arcadic
Agreed.
Disagreed.
Lurking isn't a scumtell for me. I do it everytime I get bogged down with HW. It's regrettable, but there ya go.
I hadn't posted really in ANY thread at that point. So, what makes you think I was avoiding JUST THIS THREAD when I hadn't done any posting anywhere?
You're town Seppel? We have two Seppels? Say it ain't so!
(LOL post number is my area code.:P)
So, Ace? Why Ace? I haven't seen you say anything about him all game.
Really Ok with lynching
Arcadic
Zionite
Kinda ok with lynching
Atlseal
Not gonna lynch
Anyone else.
Notes: I'm over the whole Manders PR thing. I feel like it's developed into a pointless argument and I'm moving on.
:raise::confused::-/
:science::confused:
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Quote, right now, where I said my PR required that I behave overly friendly.
Hahaha, I bet you can't!! Which will just add to the case of you making **** up to throw at me.
Cause you're scum.
Tired of corporate corruption ruining your favorite MtG site?
Come join ours!!
We even have Mafia!!
Or, ya know, I can.
Unvote, Vote MandersHex
Classic strawman. Lets get some votes, boys.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I'm very familiar with Doha, i read it for about 1000 pages before giving up on the town. What's the primary difference between Doha and this? The mod has told us the mafia is "cult-like".
I don't see the parallel of Mafia can't talk to each other and cult. Possibly because there have been 0 games i've participated in with a cult. When i hear cult, i think recruitment, the thing that unbalances a cult. A "cult-like" scumteam to me says that they can somehow add more members. It also says to me that the number of alive mafia/cultists can change. I may be assuming something i don't know anything about, but i think its safer to assume the possiblity of a person's alignment changing than the mafia's setup simply being a king and some blind pawns.
Your over-reacting to my lurking accusation. It was nothing of the sort. I was calling KJ out about his drop in activity after being a hot topic of conversation, not that he was lurking. And accusation that stuck pretty well.
Did you actually read this post, or are you just digging a tunnel?
My wife was on MTV with this video.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUutIZg2EpU
Hahaha, or, you could quote the whole post:
I never said it was in my PM, which you are operating under the impression of, that I have to act overly friendly. I said my PR makes it look like I am. You continuously pushing this is just terrible.
And the fact that you suddenly, once again, have no feelings I'm scum, is just icing on the cake. You've NEVER had a behavioral reason to think I am scum. Only your paranoid-ass "ZOMG SHE COULD BE FAKING". Same situation as Xander and Batman. Which is why it's just as much BS with you as him.
Die, please.
LOL you're ridiculous.
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Zionite, you're jumping way too fast to conclusion
TCM, aside of Seppel and Iso you're going after on your tunnel
For reasons that IMO fall in the case of "null tell"
What are your thoughts on Kill-Joy and Zionite?
With your "simple logic" could you give me your light?
[The Family] pressed the "lynch" button, thinking it was labeled "lunch" .
:raise::confused:
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2. You didn't ask about her PR, you asked if breaking her PR would have her lose something. That's fishing for if she has any abilities other than the restriction.
3. Attempting to paint you? I called your actions terrible.
4. KJ twists my words and actions to seem like i want to lynch Iso, where instead i am simply showing that Iso is a Liar and that regardless of his actions he is un-trustworthy.
5. Again, you read what you wanted to read. IE: Something to attack. Your activity had fallen right when you became the topic of conversation and my notice of that caused you to ZOMGUS me onto your scumlist. Because, you know, you've said something about me being scummy before that list. (he hadn't)
6. This case is BS. No actually, its just more deflection from the pressure he's getting.
7. How does Iso even come into play with my seeing Zionite as scummy. It doesn't it's all about Eco and Seppel and has little to do with Iso.
8. Sarcasm
Your Head
9. When its the 4 people who are voting you, Its scummy OMGUS.
What do you think of Zionite's pressure vote on me?
Meh. Its yet another thing that makes me dislike zionite but its a null tell on your alignment.
My wife was on MTV with this video.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUutIZg2EpU
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
With my categoeires, it actually differs a lot. The o with lynching would imply Ace is avoiding the thread for a reason, where not bei gok would imply (the now obvious decision) that Ace should be replaced, and his role should not be lynched.
Because there is no reason town would spam the thread up this much with useless faces, unless he was scum? And if your statement is in fact correct, I have had quite enough of his gambits shooting the town in the foot.
You actually did. You stated he should be left alone because he would contribute later, pretty much turning a blind eye to my actual reason for putting a vote on him. Despite you being correct on this (as I feel he is contributing more), that should not excuse his earliar bad posts.
That being said, since he is no longer doing what I voted him for, Unvote Seppel.
Thank you, Ced. What he did would be similiar to some smart ass 7th grader filling in the space between two circles.
These types of posts really need to cease. I am speaking as a somebody sick of long games, so keep this part of the post seperate from what you think my alignment is. This isn't the sole reason, but when I see posts like this from you two, and notice you have the highest post counts, that really irks me. Back to the game
I'll save you the trouble and say that that was not my reasoning for thinking Iso was faking, but I could definity see that making sense.
But if I didn't buy the posting restriction, wouldn't it make sense that I thought he was scum because he was faking? Your conclusion if true, will only make me dislike Iso.
What exactly do you propose I do, call him scummy for the green winky face he made to you but not Flew or Ace (that was sarcasm, but you get my point).
The only reasoning I can give to Iso's posting, to me, is how frequently he is posting. As a town player, all he has to do is at the end of the day, quote everything he wants to respond to, and do so. His one person quoting, one smiley is doing nothing but clogging the thread.
I got to side with KJ here. I read that as you being "required" to be overfriendly, hence why every single one of your posts started with "Oh hi person X".
It is not BS, and the fact that you alluded to Iso might be faking as town really bothers me the more I think about it.
Not tunneling. I would hardly say I made a case on Seppel, more or less I voted for him to actually post relevence. I dareso whether or not it worked, he is doing so. Iso's situation, I would compare to Super Sentai where I think everyone just wants to see Iso change, much like several people wanted to see DCD vig, but anyway, I digress.
KJ I still feel is geniune. My only doubt from him was that he "disappeared" from the thread, which I saw as avoiding attracting further attention, but his last post against Manders makes me feel better about him.
Zionite I am a bit in the middle with. I don't like his garbage vote on me earlier, but every Zionite I have played with has thought me scum in everygame (except in Flame Warriors when his 2nd incarnation was gunning for Iso, and he was only right in basic 28).
I wouldn't stop his lynch, but I would definitly explore other options first. If Manders were to be lynched and flipped scum, I could definitly see his last post as a bus attempt.
What's that supposed to mean?
The GJ way path to no lynching:
E_P is aware of it. I'll hopefully be back soon.
Hahaha, I'm sorry, but I can't decipher what you're trying to say in your post that quotes Cedwick voting for Mommy Dearest here a million times. Unless you're saying we should all do that? But you're not doing that, so I don't think that's right.
Um...deductive reasoning? Did you even read the rest of that post that he left out? I'm ranting at him that it's bull**** that he's asking me about specifics on my PR and stating that I will not be providing them.
I'm not grasping for ****.
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Come join ours!!
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{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Yes, there is a reason town would fake a PR. For the lulz, as shown by Guardman in Kitteh Trek and MYSELF in Red Dwarf Mafia. You need to recognize this is a possibility. Your failure to do so is very disheartening.
Oh, yeah, I remember that now.
I was right, hahaha.
You know what? Go look at it all in context. He thought I was taking away from something that he did in the game. Those posts are completely on topic and valid content. So stop being mean.
I'm pretty sure you already dislike Iso, and I'm pretty sure he doesn't care.
Regardless, I don't think he's faking. I'm unable to discern if he's scum or town until he can talk for real.
Who died and made you God of Judging Content?
Seriously, I'm sick and tired of Iso and I constantly being accused of just spamming the thread and being told we need to post less because other people in the game don't post as much as we do. NOT. OUR. PROBLEM. Every person in this game knew that Iso and I post a lot when they decided to join it. So get over it.
/rant
Then read it again.
I didn't allude ****, I straight up said that he could be town faking a PR.
It was. It's not anymore. He's been providing a higher ratio of content to spam for a fair amount of time now. He just gets no credit for it because he spammed for so long.
I'm sorry to hear...whatever's bothering you. Hurry back now!!
hahahaha, Iso's the cutest!!!
Tired of corporate corruption ruining your favorite MtG site?
Come join ours!!
We even have Mafia!!
:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
A deficiency in potassium causes fatigue, irritability, and hypertension (increased blood pressure). Overdose of potassium from natural sources is nearly impossible.
Iso supports this vote, however.
Are you asking me why I'm not voting ZDS?
You think ZDS is recruiting via votes?
1) Where is your vote?
2) Where is my vote?
3) Someone took my vote away.
4) Why isn't everyone voting ZDS?
5) Why isn't everyone voting someone else?
6) None of the above.
We're related.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Hahaha, really?!
Wait, Anak was him first and he voted me. I DON'T WANT TO BE MAFIA!!!
Tired of corporate corruption ruining your favorite MtG site?
Come join ours!!
We even have Mafia!!
:no::no::no::ria:
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
That could have something to do with it.
[/QUOTE]
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
:gonk::gonk::gonk::gonk::gonk::gonk::gonk::gonk::gonk:
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
How did you make the Second post if you didn't read the intro post?
me to turn this into a serious argument any time soon :p)
[/QUOTE]
Why do you single out the people you do and ignore the others who say the same thing?
[Mafia Stats] Mafia MVP: 1/3 Basic #29,Co-[CCMV]
Ah.
I'm not willing to lynch Iso because he's lying about having a Pr because I've lied about having a Pr.
He said that in Hecatea too.
Trust but verify?
And why don't people want to lynch Iso Today?
I've played with him from the start.
I've always had a good grasp on his team.
He's town.
All the Cult talk.
That's not what I said.
*
Why?
?
Content given divided by time spent away
Stated.
Read why I said I was voting him.
Yes there is.
*
IF I HAD THE ABILITY TO REMOVE PRS I WOULD WANT ISO TO JUST ADMIT HE IS FAKING SO I DID'NT WASTE MY ABILITY!
When was the last time you saw a PR change day to day?
Read why I said I was voting him.
Meta means nothing?
It seems to be the best way to tell if players are scum this game.
Read why I said I was voting him.
But yeah feel free to back pedal.
Towniest Player Rank isn't town telling as much as the game where you were scum and knew I was town.
Show me plz.
K'
Highway to the Dangerzone!
Could we not talk about ongoing games.
(Also last part is an Ad Hom.)
What do you think of Toastboy?
WALL OF KILLJOY TEXT
Don't have time.
Will read later.
Are you serious?
What is wrong with you?
Unvote Vote Flew
[Mafia Stats] Mafia MVP: 1/3 Basic #29,Co-[CCMV]
Apparently I did in fact read it, but forgot in between the second and third posts.
It helps if you put the quotes in the correct order, and don't forget to put the post where you said Arcadic was scum but voted kill-joy in between them.
That bolded is a bloody great reason to fake a nonspeaking PR.:rolleyes:
Seriously, it isn't. I can't find Red Dwarf, but from my brief read of the end of Kitteh Trek, I side strongly with Wrath of Dog, and would have been outraged to be on the town, knowing Guardman was faking. And you can bet your ass I would call him on that (and be right). It was just lolsy that D-rey was scared enough to admit wanting him dead, and he saw through that PR as mafia.
I wasn't seriously considering a Seppel wagon. And believe it or not, it wasn't his response I was interested in (although he did make me feel better).
In the name of science. Totally on topic. How exactly did you expect him to respond? If you were truly cooperating him, you would have asked him a specific question, instead of just going "wat"?
I think you give him far too much credit as the best scum hunter here, but I don't dislike him. I can't say there is anyone on this site I dislike.
No one...? But seeing every other post as a smiley is irking. I think that's would he should do, but I can't make him
No? However, when you consider Smiley McGee has over 100 posts, it does make me think you should tone it down, just a tad.
Then read it again.
I don't like that you even think this is an option.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
Hahahaha, when did I say it was a good reason? But it is a reason with evidence of it happening in the past.
There you go.
But no one knew Guardman was faking until the game was over.
Whose response were you interested in?
I didn't understand what his problem with my post was, so I asked him, "wat?" He responded, and I explained. The "In the name of science" bit is a joke because = :science
I didn't say he was the best scum hunter. I said he was good, and he is.
Mmm, no. Seriously, we both deal with people complaining about how much we post in just about every game we play in, and it's bull****.
I don't care. It is an option, whether you like it or not. I don't believe this is the case (you know, since I don't think he's faking) but I will recognize it as a possibility.
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Come join ours!!
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This is getting ridiculous. You're going to tell me that if you knew Iso was faking his PR, you would not want him lynched? You're seriously comparing faking a PR consisting of actual words with one consisting of smilies? Your admiration for/personal friendship with/pity for Iso (pick one) is causing you to be completely irrational. There is no good reason for a townie to fake such a restrictive, annoying, and distracting PR.
Hahahaha, irrational?! You know, I fail to give a damn what any of you think. I've already said I don't believe he's faking it, so why does this bother anyone that I believe TOWN FAKE PRs?
Tired of corporate corruption ruining your favorite MtG site?
Come join ours!!
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You wouldn't adamantly defend him if you didn't think it was good reason. If you thought he is faking for a bad reason, why would you let him live?
As annoying as faking a role such as MMM, at least you can still communicate with words. Hell, you could even claim if you wanted to.
Does that make any difference whether the town noticed or not that he was purposefully being unhelpful? The point is that he was being unhelpful, and would have been safe lynched if I had anything to do with it.
1). An Attempt to see if he would start posting more content posts.
2). How you would respond after I moved off the beloved Iso (I say that with love, not sarcasm).
I distinctly remember you saying when asked why is keeping Iso alive different than any other player, you saying a varient of this.
Not trying to play the mob mentality, but there is probably a ring to truth if you are both constantly dealing with people complaining about in-game spam...
Why even bring it up then? It seems like if he is faking, your trying to cover that up for him.
Because frankly, they shouldn't. Especially not for the "lulz"...
The GJ way path to no lynching:
I did notice. Again, I don't see where the strike method is relevent.
No, I asked about "negative effects". Like modkills. I was wondering if it would result in a modkill.
You're twisting EVERYTHING i do to make it look scummy. That's painting.
I read it as you were advocating a lynch on him because you thought he was faking the PR.
And yet, at least one other person also saw what I saw. If I was trying to attack you, as you say, then what was ZDS doing when he said my points were valid? Was he attacking you too?
Also, However, I admitted to possibly misreading it. And yet you're attempting to use it against me?
I'm not deflecting.
7. Ok, misread that too then.
8. Yea, my sarcasm detector is a bit off. Need to work on that.
They did so scummily. But I'm over two of them. You or Zionite need to get lynched.
Ok
I find the idea of recruitment itself unlikely, TBH, but it's in the OP so... IDK what that means, really.
You are just jumping everywhere, arent you?
You never said why you want Ace dead. Why do you want him dead?