Establishing an early read on another player. By interacting with a player directly, one can generate reads. This is especially vital in the early phase of a mafia game.
So, did he ever provide you with an explanation that made sense as town?
I believe in town consensus in actions directly affecting a player. So you check with everyone for every vote you make then?
This is a ridiculous response. While your vote would have counted for 2, it was still only a vote. There was no reason not to test loran, despite his objections. If you were truly that worried about it, you would have voted for him.
This is entirely baseless. One does not have to think up of a reason why in order to pursue something. The act of pursuing in itself is generating information based on reactions upon it.
For you to consider it could be a gambit, the natural reaction would be for anyone to consider why type of gambit it could be. Gambits have a purpose. If you cannot discern of any reason for a gambit to be enacted, then it is likely not a gambit. This is simple logic, which you are quite capable of presenting. Your refusal to admit that this is a valid point and is NOT baseless doesn't help your case.
Also, you are attempting to establish a groundless logic. You are invoking my experience as the basis of the rationale that what I was doing is scummy. Yet you never considered what I was doing was a higher level play which you have yet to grasp in getting reads out of other players.
Seriously, Dagger?I have not grasped the benefits of asking questions of people to generate information? You've lost it, my friend.
Your supporting point is also erroneous. You are citing loran's towniness as the basis that what I was doing was a scum's action. Yet, I could also say the act of not doubting loran's claim was something a scum will do because a scum knew that to be the truth. Does that make my action any more a scum's than yours?
Show me where I once said anything about loran's towniness. I dare you.
You are using a leading question. Look it up. Fishing is a negative connotation whose usage implies a scum's action.
It does have a negative connotation, yes, but fishing is not necessarily scummy. Fishing after chastising another for fishing is hypocritical, though. Still not necessarily scummy, but I asked you this because I wanted your response. Your response was to deflect it onto me as a scummy action (as asking leading questions is scummy, which tells me all I need to know.
Let me tell you this loud and clear, or in this case, bolded to my heart's content:
A new scum is unwilling to vote another player because they fear attention from that player.
Are you going to dispute the above bolded statement?
Noob town do that, too, Dagger, and you know it. For you to automatically assume, as you did do through all of that interaction, that he was doing it for scummy reasons is disingenuous.
Then you should know that was an attempt on my part to get further reads on kill-joy.
Or an attempt to paint him as scummy. Either fits.
This is nonsensical. I expected better reasoning than this.
There is no such thing as "this is the part where RVS ended" or "beyond this post, every vote must be considered seriously".
Of course there's not. But there is a need to provide reasons or pursue those that you are voting for. You kept your vote on me while pursuing information from other players.
You are working on the assumption I am scum, and then attempting to slant every post I made to prove that.
I am convinced you are scum and attempting to show others how that is the case. Therefore, I have to show the scummy intentions behind your posts.
You have much to learn, grasshopper. In mafia, you hunt scums by their mindset.
Which is what I am doing with you right now.
Tragic. I am going to repeat again. Mindset. That's the one true way to hunt scums. Every other methods are inferior imitations.
Mindset is not easily determined, Dagger, and you know it. There could be town reasons for the things he said/did as well. You CHOSE to interpret the scum mindset.
Ah. What if it WAS a joke?
Then you would have shown it was a joke. The pseudo-smilie you added to the end of it is your way of showing concern.
I knew it was mindset. I got the same vibes from Iso. It doesn't have to specifically match what loran had in mind. In case you are still unsure, it's mindset. Mindset.
I could create a drinking game of taking a shot every time you said mindset, but then I'd be drunk by now.
Regardless, this does not answer the question I asked you, Dagger. Why did you not vote the first time you mentioned something about his mindset?
This here proves my point.
You have no idea really why I could be scum. Your entire rationale was based on spinning every post I made previously to match the image in your mind I am scum.
That is horrendous scumhunting.
Attacking your attackers is scummy, too.
Ah, let me quote for you again:
A new scum is unwilling to vote another player because they fear attention from that player.
I can quote stuff again for you, too.
New town are scared to attract attention, too. This is not reason enough to consider him scummy.
Another leading statement. You used the term "appeasing". I am by nature humorous. But apparently you missed that in all our interactions so far.
Preposterous. I probably know better than everyone here how humorous you can be as we've often chatted outside of mafia. That doesn't negate the FACT that you had been attempting to appease loran since he said you were scum.
Well then, let's used your own rationale against you.
Can you think of any feasible reason why I would say ""If I say I cannot find it..." as a scum?
Then if you cannot think of any reason I could say it as a scum, does that mean I am not scum?
I'll give you this point.
Again. Let's use your own reasoning against you. Since you apparently believed those were all indications of someone being scum.
Why didn't you just accuse me as I did Iso? Why is "Should I accuse you of the same accusation ..." necessary?
I didn't use it because it's a bull**** point.
Because a noob town by meaning is a person who can never learn no matter how much experience he or she has playing mafia, perpetually horrendous at it and the bane of any game. I think the term you are looking for is a newb town.
Education aside, it is a scum's reluctance because... dare I quote it again?
A new scum is unwilling to vote another player because they fear attention from that player.
lol
Ah. That is premature thinking until you know my alignment for certain. And you will be sorely disappointed.
Doubtful. Even if I am wrong, you've played horrendously this game and brought this case only on yourself.
For instance, I was not disappointed when we lynched Cyan in Ogre and he flipped town. Because the evidence I had on him made more sense for scum than town. **** happens. Townies get lynched. But not for no reason.
Exactly because of the reasons I have highlighted earlier during my "tooth and nail" fight. If you still cannot comprehend the reasons, that means you either skipped over those entirely in your rereading of me or you still have much to learn.
Then allow me to refute those reasons again. Seppel is quite well known for throwing votes simply to garner reactions from the other players. This is the reason I did not find him scummy for his vote. As I stated back then. I was wrong, but that doesn't change the fact that it's something Seppel does regularly. To automatically assume he was scum for it would have been preposterous.
It's ridiculous because you blasted that wagon for reaching lynch -2 but then ignored the person who put the vote to lynch -2 in the first place. Why didn't you attack Seppel for being scummy then if you thought so badly of the wagon?
Look above.
And yea, you were in my scum list, in case you somehow missed that again in your reread of me. I never thought putting your name under a "scum" heading in my list would be subtle.
Well, you provided no reasons in any of your lists, so I have no idea why you had me listed as scum. But you never once said I was scummy for "ignoring" (in quotes because I didn't ignore it. I decided it was not a scumtell)
Because it sounds logical and I totally agree with it?
WHY?
Attacking loran's ability at scumhunting rather than the points themselves. That is crumbling under pressure.
He had already attacked the points themselves. He felt loran ignored that, so he moved further.
It grates me to see people misusing terms. Like you know, willy-nilly using the term "fishing" as if it's the ultimate mafia holy grail in attacking another player.
He didn't misinterpret ****. His comments had nothing to do with the term "moderating".
The point in saying that is that you are wrong. That the way you play mafia is wrong. That such a playing method will come back and bite you.
Of course, I have seen you do as such before. Which still makes it wrong. Yet you seemed to rely on it. And it still is not going to stop me from saying you are wrong in relying on such.
And now that Seppel turns up scum, will you actually learn your lesson?
Probably not. This method works for me. I am attempting to improve on my reads, but you bet your ass the next time Seppel and I are town together and I'm sure of it, I will barn him to kingdom come.
I am much less trusting of my reads on him now, though. Chances are I won't trust him for awhile.
Yes. Yes, it does. I can make statements like that. Because when I make statements like that, I am confident in its validity. To cite an example, for The Family Mafia, in less than 40 posts, I could say with certainty joboman and Skander were both town and MH was scum. That sort of confidence comes from experience. So yes, I can vote someone just because of that.
You were talking earlier about how I wasn't like a town Dagger. But do you know what is a town Dagger and how he acts? Apparently you don't.
I know town Dagger, in Family Mafia, where he was convinced I was scum, still didn't vote for me as soon as he knew it.
Very vague. I've never played against the player I'm currently using (that I remember of), and thus I've no idea what level of experience I should categorize him or her. But I would guess "Okay".
Negative. We need to lynch twice by today, one way or another.
I believe with a 95% certainty that WoD is scum. If you all want to lynch scum today, you all should probably type down Unvote, Vote: Wrath_of_Dog
I am so certain that I can probably tell you I don't care to hear his claim at all. Just hang him from the nearest tree and we can call it a day.
Judging in the context of this very post itself, I think your request is a bit hypocritical.
Actually, I'll support the mass nameclaim. While I realize that my role will make sense with regards to my role name, trying to deduce the former from the latter will probably be an exercise in amusement for the rest of you from my perspective. So, why not?
I think I've an idea of what joboman is going for anyway. I could be wrong, but meh.
TB still needs to tell me why he unvoted Jobo after hearing Jobo's claim and how does said claim factored into his scum read of Jobo.
Now then,
I am seeing the following players as town:
Jobo, Skander - since the very beginning
Ced - town read - but Ced comes into play with the very irritating ability to continually gives me a town read regardless of his alignment, proven far more times than I care to count, so... meh, we'll stick with town for now -_-
Tacky, WOD, DV/Bilb - should be town
RO - should be town, but less sure than the above 3
That gives me 4 potential scums:
MH, SO - most likely scums, refined by PoE
TB - less certain than the above two
Ace - should probably die before the game ends
I'll give it a +1/-1 margin of error here.
~~~
I'll claim one aspect of my role as well. I can vig a player at night if they only have a single life left. I'm suggesting we "nullify" two players by day, and I kill whomever I think is most likely to be scum at night. In the event my kill fails, we could always lynch both again the very next day. The disadvantage is that we go to night without knowing a player's full alignment, causing a loss of tempo, something of which might be critical going into the first night. Your pick.
Vote: MandersHex
I didn't even quote all the instances he said I was scum. Just the first two. Yet he still never voted for me until several hundred posts later. This lends credence to my theory that he is opportunistic scum who was trying to appease loran by voting with him.
Two things here:
1. You are citing again the difference in our experiences to gives your own points validity as compared to mine. Don't. If you are going to tout that I have more experience, then you should accept that I know better in this area than you and that I am far more correct as compared to you. You obviously don't think so, and citing as such is just a poor attempt at making your points somehow more valid.
2. You used the term "blatantly false statement" without actually explaining why it was a false statement that was so blatant that anyone can see it. Unless... unless your entire supporting point was that I have greater experience as compared to you?
You said that I never provided evidence of why I thought Iso was town. I'm saying I absolutely did, in the post that you said it didn't happen. Therefore, your statement was blatantly false.
Also, it doesn't matter whether I see you as a town or not. If you are wrong, I am going to speak out. If you are right, I am going to agree with you. I am not going to smile and nod my head at whatever you say just because I am seeing you as town.
And yet you chastise me for doing so and say that it's a bad playstyle.
Get lynched.
Then that's the issue of me actually seeing you as town. You were not always in my town list. You were in my scum list as well at one point in time.
That said, I know I am town. You are attacking me. I don't immediately see you as scum. Now, why would the reverse be different? Are you having some sort of different expectation about a mafia game?
You'll have to explain your question clearer.
Oh? It is the former. What if it is the former?! What gave you the right to pick one over the other without even asking for my opinion first?!
If it is the former, then a simple mistake it is. I have the right to say that I believe it is the latter because it is open to interpretation.
Spin? It was a question directed towards him. I even added a "?". Clearly I expected a response, from which I can further clarify my read on him.
Yes, spin. It was pretty obvious when he first asked it that he was wondering because they are lurking. You made it out to be scummy.
My bad, clearly I need to clarify for those uninformed. "Reading as town or scum" means scumlist. I hope that is not so vague anymore?
Your hope has failed.
I am so delighted I touched on this very issue in the previous post. I hope that address your concerns?
No, you really didn't.
You clearly missed the memo where other players stated he seemed scummy as well. And you clearly still are under the impression you knew Iso best as a player better than he did himself. Last of all, you clearly need to be reminded that being town does not make one almighty to the extent of beyond reproach.
If it is proven that a player as town (which it pretty much is with Iso) then that does put them beyond reproach. Yes, you can point out faulty logic and whatnot, but you cannot consider them scum for it.
Never say it did. In fact, it went the other way.
I didn't say you did. I'm just saying you didn't lie about your role.
I don't need reasons. Those are my reads over the course of the game. I don't make notes.
For example, you voted me before you even make a case on me. Or Iso continued to vote me even though his case was debunked. Or jskura voted with no reason as well other than an agree. Clearly you need a reminder on how a mafia game is always played in reality as compared to an ideal situation.
Making a town/scum list without reasons for the placement of the players is scummy. For you to try to brush it off now is deplorable.
This is a completely nonsensical statement. The list was made after said two players were fervently being pushed for information. Obviously I have clarified my read on those two players, which was why I was able to make such a list in the first place.
Bull****, Dagger. You said you're reluctant to pursue them, yet that's precisely what you had done for most of the day.
Oh yes, the point actually does stand. Be it may that you have your own reason, the fact remains that there were two votes following Seppel's request.
Let's use your analogy of the lynch -2 wagon thingy on kill-joy, just to rub it in. Just because you voted for your own reason, it was still 2 votes after Seppel's, and not 1.
Doesn't.
He was acting like a town then, with a town mindset. I don't actually have a specific post to quote. One cannot point at a post and say "There! This post proves conclusively that he is town!". No such nonsense in mafia. People might attribute certain posts to scum. Far rarer for town. And part of my grilling of kill-joy clarified my own read of him to be leaning town during then. You know, the part where I repeatedly ask him to vote him, etc. etc.
#303.
Because of the fact that I didn't actually think Tanarin was scum, and thus didn't deserve pressuring? And all that nonsense Seppel spouted about Tanarin being a role cop was countermand to other possible roles I could see Tanarin having?
And yet you provide no reasons for why you didn't think he was scum. You just say so.
The list was pretty consistent with my previous. Any major changes I did to the list had been explained.
No, they hadn't. And, your previous list didn't have reasons, either.
Clearly you need to play in more games if you think people create scumlist with reasons for everything. Or wait, are you only just applying it to me in this specific game?
Absolutely not. Anyone provides a scumlist without reasons, and I am on it like white on rice.
I provide reasons for my primary scum suspects. I provide reasons for any changes to the scumlist. However, what I am thinking is you are expecting something more for reasons as far as reasons go.
What I am expecting is something along the lines of "player X is town because Y reasons", etc.
Something like your case on me, am I right? AM i Right?
No, you are not.
In that case, I don't have the time for such bulky posts. Even your single case on me took you how long? After days and days and one delaying reason after another. And you expect me to do it for players I am reading as town as well?
Absolutely not. That would be absurd.
And why are you acting like you don't know what I mean? You know damn good and well what I mean when I say lists with reasons.
Firstly, you said you trust Dagger the least of all of the players in the game presently.
But I'm your 3rd least trusted player.
I started the case on Dagger.
If I'm one of your least trusted players, then why are you taking a case I started and using it for your nonvote-vote?
This is inconsistent. And now you're saying there's a lot to read, considering the possibility that Manders is scum after she has basically been cleared.
No.
Unvote, vote Roja
You haven't been adding up lately. Best start explaining.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Let me tell you this loud and clear, or in this case, bolded to my heart's content:
A new scum is unwilling to vote another player because they fear attention from that player.
Are you going to dispute the above bolded statement?
There is a lot to go though (since there has been a back and forth..) I'm posting what catches my eye.
Dagger I am not sure I can agree with your bolded statement here. I would like to think that "a new scum in unwilling to vote another player because they fear attention from EVERYONE ELSE."
My assumption is that they are trying to fit in, and if they go aganst "the town" (everyone else.) that would put more attention onto them then they going against who they are trying to peg as scum.
Then again I can only speak from my experiance as scum that one time.
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Firstly, you said you trust Dagger the least of all of the players in the game presently.
But I'm your 3rd least trusted player.
I started the case on Dagger.
If I'm one of your least trusted players, then why are you taking a case I started and using it for your nonvote-vote?
This is inconsistent. And now you're saying there's a lot to read, considering the possibility that Manders is scum after she has basically been cleared.
No.
Unvote, vote Roja
You haven't been adding up lately. Best start explaining.
You do realize your trust level will change once Dagger flips scum? However until that happens Im not sure how much I can trust you. If Dagger happens to not be scum, YOU as you said started the case against him and thus something I would be looking on... (again.)
I dont have all the time in the world to do the work I should be doing. (Im only posting now because im able to work from home thus allowing me to look on here while "working".) It's a fact of life and if that makes me scum then that makes you a bad player for thinking that.
Wait. And why the hell do you trust Dancing Mad more than loran?
Now see here I think you are trying to make me look bad.
You just said above about why I doubt Manders as she is "cleared". Didn't Taneran also get cleared in that same situation?
I thought he was town before that instance and thought that Manders wasn't so before then. That is why they are ranked the way they are. Tanaran is cleared and I trust, I really trust Loran and kill joy. And while I think manders can be scum she is cleared via the same reason as Tanarin is.
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I'm not trying to make you look bad. I'm trying to get answers. Your answer is inconsistent.
You're saying that Dancing Mad (Tanarin at the time) is cleared because he had the specific town's win condition known when he claimed. And Manders REALIZED that and cleared him for it. So by your logic, if Manders is scum, so is Dancing Mad. That means that Manders should be right next to Dancing Mad in your trust list, not after loran. Why do you trust kill-joy so much?
More importantly, why didn't you include the possibility that jskura could be scum, or ANYWHERE on your list, for that matter?
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I'm not trying to make you look bad. I'm trying to get answers. Your answer is inconsistent.
You're saying that Dancing Mad (Tanarin at the time) is cleared because he had the specific town's win condition known when he claimed. And Manders REALIZED that and cleared him for it. So by your logic, if Manders is scum, so is Dancing Mad. That means that Manders should be right next to Dancing Mad in your trust list, not after loran. Why do you trust kill-joy so much?
I told you why they are on the list and why Tanarin is higher then Manders. I'm allowed to rank them how I want too. I'm not blindingly trusting Manders. Just like im not blindling trusting you.
Kill-joy hasen't said anything I really haven't disagreed with. And I don't find him suspicitious.
More importantly, why didn't you include the possibility that jskura could be scum, or ANYWHERE on your list, for that matter?
OMG THAT TOTALLYS MEANS I OUTTED US AS SCUM OH CRAP!
Or I clearly forgot to put him on my list. (Tell you how much he posts huh?)
However if you note from my other comments about him, he would be one up over Dagger on my trust/scum list.
What aspect of my day 1 play? And what are your thoughts on my play today? Because I could clear myself now if I chose to, I just have no reason to, presently.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
But nowhere did I see that intention was done with that of a scum's drive. Unless you are claiming rolecop is entirely a scum's role and never town's?
@ Blue bolded: Going against Seppel's theory that there was at least 1 scum in the 3 players with drawbacks. Safe to say, if Dagger is scum, then those 3 truly are town, meaning Reya would be our last scum. (Yes, the last scum is likely in either Roja or Reya. Could be The_Doctor, but I'm not feeling that.)
"This bit you quoted here actually lends some credence to the idea that Dagger is telling the truth about being a town 'RBer'."
Quote from Manders »
@ bolded: Dagger is fighting tooth and nail against my statements that the Iso wagon was terrible due to the speed of it. His insistence that Seppel's vote should not be counted because it was purely for reactions is even more terrible. Why?
Do you think, if two people had come in and hammered Iso, that the mod would have cared that one was not meant to get him lynched? Absolutely not. Iso would have been lynched, and I find it ridiculously opportunistic for Dagger to push this point against me. The fact that he's doing it subtly makes it even more opportunistic, imo. (By subtly, I mean, he never said I was scum for considering Seppel's vote in my calculations, but he is definitely implying it.
"On the other hand, attacking you over disagreeing with an Iso wagon is two strikes (with you being town and Iso probably being town)."
Quote from Dancing Mad »
The Doctor votes Dagger with the line that "[he] has no issues with the Dagger wagon," and while he addresses some of what Dagger says, I don't get why he's voting him. Is it just POE?
"Yes. I saw no redeeming qualities for Dagger, and if there was a wagon on him, I most certainly did not disagree."
Quote from Dancing Mad »
By this logic, anyone who claims town roleblocker is lying? I'm as fond of Occam's Razor as anyone else, but you are misapplying it here.
"No, just that they are much more likely to be to be lying. As I said, I saw nothing that lended credence to Dagger being town. If there is a player that is on neither end of the scum<->town scale and that player is a roleblocker and the roleblock was used without thought, they automatically are shifted toward the scum side."
Quote from Roja »
Tanarin/DM, Loran, Kill-joy, Manders, The_Doctor, Iso, Reya and Dagger
"Questions:
1) Why is Reya second from the bottom?
2) Did you ever pseudo-vote Dagger?
3) Will you confirm one more time that you do not have a vote?
On that last point, Mod, we are sorely in need of a vote count."
Quote from Manders »
This part could be used to show that he's concerned with others clearing their triggers, thus verifying his role is probably what he says it is atm. Problem is, his role in no way clears him as town.
"I don't think anyone is doubting that he is what he claims, as it makes the puzzle pieces fit quite nicely."
Quote from Manders »
He has provided no reasons for the bolded reads.
"Wow, you just reminded me. He requested that I be a cop target. Think about that for a moment. With the amount of 'clearing' that we've been doing this game, why would a scum suggest that one of the few remaining unknowns be targeted by the cop? I cannot believe that Dagger would purposefully paint himself or his teammates further into a corner."
Quote from Dagger »
You are working on the assumption I am scum, and then attempting to slant every post I made to prove that.
"Agreed."
"Ok, so after Manders' more or less resposting of all of Dagger's posts, his responses to her accusations, and my own enlightenment on certain points, Dagger now gets put on my town side. Unvote: Dagger"
Quote from Manders »
Quote from Dagger »
You have much to learn, grasshopper. In mafia, you hunt scums by their mindset.
Which is what I am doing with you right now.
Quote from Manders »
Mindset is not easily determined, Dagger, and you know it. There could be town reasons for the things he said/did as well. You CHOSE to interpret the scum mindset.
"*Cough, cough* Pot, meet kettle."
"I will also be honest and say that at this point in Manders' reply, I didn't feel like going through any more of her response to Dagger's response. If there were any good points made in there, I'd like someone to bring them to my attention. Thank you."
Quote from Roja »
Goodness tons of TL;DR..
Wild thought: Manders, Iso and Seppel scum? Like wouldn't they think that to be a dream team.
Reading the points now..
"Hey folks, remember how I said that I didn't have any real people pegged as scum and that it was more process of elimination than anything else? Well, I would like to revise my earlier statement in light of new evidence provided by Roja. Vote: Roja This post is so out of left field in an attempt to discredit, I can see absolutely no town mindset possible here."
Quote from Roja »
You do realize your trust level will change once Dagger flips scum? However until that happens Im not sure how much I can trust you. If Dagger happens to not be scum, YOU as you said started the case against him and thus something I would be looking on... (again.)
"Really? Is that so? Do tell."
Quote from Roja »
OMG THAT TOTALLYS MEANS I OUTTED US AS SCUM OH CRAP!
Or I clearly forgot to put him on my list. (Tell you how much he posts huh?)
However if you note from my other comments about him, he would be one up over Dagger on my trust/scum list.
"Let us try a fun thought exercise. Where would you put yourself on the trust list, and don't just put yourself at the top because you 'know your role'. Imagine that you are any of the other players in the game. Where should we put you?"
I have not forgotten about you all, vote count tonight when I return from work.
<3
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Quote from TheFooFish »
Lies! -I'm Buffy Summers, town tracker. I used my ability on you and saw that you didn't use any abilities before the game started. My flavor is I was sucked through a mysterious space-time portal and I'm here to kill all the vampires, and my tracking ability is a combination of my Slayer and Native American skills.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Lies! -I'm Buffy Summers, town tracker. I used my ability on you and saw that you didn't use any abilities before the game started. My flavor is I was sucked through a mysterious space-time portal and I'm here to kill all the vampires, and my tracking ability is a combination of my Slayer and Native American skills.
What aspect of my day 1 play? And what are your thoughts on my play today? Because I could clear myself now if I chose to, I just have no reason to, presently.
There is no point in outting yourself unless you are really worried about my opinion of you.. Hmm.
Your day 1 of setting up arguements before posting stings quite well with me still.
Clearly your day two play gets better if Dagger turns up scum. But until I see that I cannot say you play better now can I?
"Questions:
1) Why is Reya second from the bottom?
2) Did you ever pseudo-vote Dagger?
3) Will you confirm one more time that you do not have a vote?
On that last point, Mod, we are sorely in need of a vote count."
1. I don't trust Reya, he has said next to nothing allowing me to beleive that he is a member of the town.
2. I thought I did, but don't have the time to look.
3. VOTE DAGGER
"Hey folks, remember how I said that I didn't have any real people pegged as scum and that it was more process of elimination than anything else? Well, I would like to revise my earlier statement in light of new evidence provided by Roja. Vote: Roja This post is so out of left field in an attempt to discredit, I can see absolutely no town mindset possible here."[quote]
Whoa, how is that any different then Manders like 10 posts of "OMG will post later"?
And yea it is a wild thought, what about Manders, Iso, Seppel dream team? Cant you wait to hear about it years later about how awesome they were?
[quote]"Really? Is that so? Do tell."
Because I just don't see it as scum bussing scum. (his orginal post against Dagger that is.)
"Let us try a fun thought exercise. Where would you put yourself on the trust list, and don't just put yourself at the top because you 'know your role'. Imagine that you are any of the other players in the game. Where should we put you?"
Hmm Because of my situation with this game, I have been trying to play better. Having no vote and only a voice is something I find horribly annoying. Yet what I find even more annoying is the fact that someone who has a PR or whatnot is more trustworthy over me who has spent the time and effor into this game. So trust me however you can throw me, I don't have all the time in the world to play, and clearly there are some mental mind trap you caught me in. I'm a townie and have been activly going after scum. Sorry if you see what im doing in a different light.
I know I'm at three votes but I don't know if I'll have time to respond as I have plans.
My trigger for memory is to surive to day three. And that my monkier was Sangria.
Also im not a fan of Manders vote there either..
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Roja, why are you trying so hard to smear Manders and bring her down with you? It's painfully obvious that she's town. I can't see any reason why a member of the town would continue to push this issue.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Oh good god, I ignore the thread for 3 days and get this? Yikes.
Several things of note: 1. JSkura still hasn't posted and I still request a prod.MOD! --> I actually spoke to the mod on AIM and he said he did, but well, just putting this on the record.
2. @Manders - Oh good god this is why I've abandoned full PBPAs and your version is killing me. Please don't spoil quoted posts and then don't use the colors so much, they burn my eyes (especially the neon blue). Don't use bold so much either. Agh My Eyes! (The Goggles do nothing).
3. Interesting wagon on Roja here. I vaguely recall thinking I saw some things that made me feel Roja was town, but I can't recall them. So my vote remains off for now.
4. ISO - I think I've brought up this point before, but once again, re: 1453, it is not a point in any way shape or form for a person to agree with scum accusations at one player (such against Dagger) made by a player (such as yourself) who they also suspect may be scum. The best way to evaluate arguments is to evaluate the ARGUMENTS themselves, not the PLAYER making said argument (though if you find the argument to be strong, it may change your opinion of the Arguer for the better). I'm not saying Roja is doing this - but he SHOULD if he's town, which is why that is NOT a scum tell.
In other words, If you suspect Player B is scum, you can still agree with Player B's argument that Player C is scum - even without changing your opinion of Player B. So it's not a tell either way.
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Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I think Roja is town/scum.
I think loran16 is town/scum.
I think Tanarin is town/scum.
I think MandersHex is town/scum.
I think Iso is town/scum.
I think pinkfloyd is town/scum.
I think The_Doctor is town/scum.
I think kill-joy is town/scum.
I think Reya Cookiebringer is town/scum.
I think Dagger is town/scum.
I think Seppel is town/scum.
W may only be paid with white mana. U may only be paid with blue mana. B may only be paid with black mana. R may only be paid with red mana. G may only be paid with green mana. C may only be paid with colorless mana. 1 may be paid with white, blue, black, red, green, or clolorless mana.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Not good enough. Vote Jskura. That's vote #1. Who wants to join me?
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Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I'm way more comfy with a Dagger lynch, but Roja's fine I guess. All his stuff about how we shouldn't activate jskara because he's a Pandora's box looked really scummy to me. IIRC he was throwing a bunch of WIFOM aside from that as well.
I'd be 454556778945255x happier with Dagger being lynched though.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
How is it not good enough? He told us his feelings on who is town, who is scum etc.
If you want to ask him something to answer, do it. I will not be voting him today though.
He didn't tell us anything! He gave a town scum list with no justifications. Zero. Zilch. You wouldn't accept that from any other player and you shouldn't for him.
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Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
He didn't tell us anything! He gave a town scum list with no justifications. Zero. Zilch. You wouldn't accept that from any other player and you shouldn't for him.
Damn, it didnt send. I was going to post something in response to this from class, but it didnt go through.
Basically I was going to say that no one said you're wrong, but I just think we need to take a different approach to it. Ultimatums and threats tend to have two results: The person walls themselves more yielding less results, or they panic, making the results you get pointless
We will catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
Sorry, something rather urgent came up and I've been busy. I'll be back tomorrow.
On jskura: I would like jskura to explain why he thinks Dagger is scum. If he does that, I would be satisfied waiting until day 2 to get more from him. I'm not looking for a PBPA; all I want is a paragraph (in smiley alphabet) or so, with quotes/links to posts if necessary. It wouldn't take that long.
Roja, why are you trying so hard to smear Manders and bring her down with you? It's painfully obvious that she's town. I can't see any reason why a member of the town would continue to push this issue.
Here let me help you. Check out Manders last post here:
Honestly, I'm fine with lynching Dagger or Roja. Both are behaving scummy as hell for reasons already provided by me or others.
What does need to happen is Dancing Mad needs to contribute, and we need to end this Day.
As it seems more are happier lynching Roja than Dagger,
Unvote; Vote: Roja
First, she lists no real reasons why she is voting for me. Only the fact that she is copying other people's reasons. (She did state reasons for Dagger but I shouldn't be bunched into that.)
Second she STILL feels Dagger is scum after her huge PBPA posts against him and yet she just tosses her vote in my direction.
Third what annoys me is how she wants Dancing Mad to say more completely giving jskrua a free pass.
Sorry if you feel that I am "smearing" Manders Iso, however she isn't playing all saintlike.
So would I. But apparently that's not going to happen today.
So you just roll over and vote whatever is easier? Let me ask you this do you think Dagger and I are on the same team? And then after you answer that I want to know why you think that way.
As for the Jskura post I agree that it isn't enough. We get it that there are some "issues" but he can do much better.. Even if i'm lynched today, we need more info out of Jskura before giving him a free pass.
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So you just roll over and vote whatever is easier? Let me ask you this do you think Dagger and I are on the same team? And then after you answer that I want to know why you think that way.
The halting of the Dagger wagon, I think speaks loads on his alignment. I'm willing to let him slide for now, because you're being mounds scummier presently. I'm not voting for "who's easier". I'm voting for who I think is scum.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Sorry, something rather urgent came up and I've been busy. I'll be back tomorrow.
On jskura: I would like jskura to explain why he thinks Dagger is scum. If he does that, I would be satisfied waiting until day 2 to get more from him. I'm not looking for a PBPA; all I want is a paragraph (in smiley alphabet) or so, with quotes/links to posts if necessary. It wouldn't take that long.
This would be good.
@Kill-Joy, no ultimatums are actually quite fine, you just have to be willing to act on your threats for them to have force. JSkura seems to think I'm not serious. I''m showing him otherwise.
Dancing_Mad, if you would, please threaten JSkura also if he doesn't post what you want in his next post? No need to actually vote him yet, but if, as I suspect, he comes back with nothing, serious pressure should be applied.
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Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
"My apologies. I had not realized it has been almost a week since I last posted. However, nothing of note really happened between my last post and now, so can you really blame me?"
Quote from Roja »
Whoa, how is that any different then Manders like 10 posts of "OMG will post later"?
And yea it is a wild thought, what about Manders, Iso, Seppel dream team? Cant you wait to hear about it years later about how awesome they were?
"The difference is that you seem to be considering (even if it's on a minute level) that Manders and Iso are scum-buddies with Seppel."
Quote from Roja »
Hmm Because of my situation with this game, I have been trying to play better. Having no vote and only a voice is something I find horribly annoying. Yet what I find even more annoying is the fact that someone who has a PR or whatnot is more trustworthy over me who has spent the time and effor into this game. So trust me however you can throw me, I don't have all the time in the world to play, and clearly there are some mental mind trap you caught me in. I'm a townie and have been activly going after scum. Sorry if you see what im doing in a different light.
"So, as to my original question. Where do you think we should put you on your list?"
Quote from Roja »
Also im not a fan of Manders vote there either..
"Give it a rest. Manders is almost certainly town."
Quote from Iso »
I thought Roja was town at first, too, but :/
"What does 'but :/' stand for?"
Quote from kill-joy »
I'm way more comfy with a Dagger lynch, but Roja's fine I guess. All his stuff about how we shouldn't activate jskara because he's a Pandora's box looked really scummy to me. IIRC he was throwing a bunch of WIFOM aside from that as well.
I'd be 454556778945255x happier with Dagger being lynched though.
"So, if what Roja's done looked so scummy to you, what makes you that much more comfortable lynching Dagger?"
Quote from Roja »
First, she lists no real reasons why she is voting for me. Only the fact that she is copying other people's reasons. (She did state reasons for Dagger but I shouldn't be bunched into that.)
Second she STILL feels Dagger is scum after her huge PBPA posts against him and yet she just tosses her vote in my direction.
Third what annoys me is how she wants Dancing Mad to say more completely giving jskrua a free pass.
Sorry if you feel that I am "smearing" Manders Iso, however she isn't playing all saintlike.
"Let me ask you this: do you believe that Manders and Seppel could have been on the same team? And then after you answer that, I want to know how you are able to explain the discrepancy between Seppel's reaction to Tanarin's win-con claim w/ a Manders backup with Manders knowing the town win condition."
In this case, "recent events have led me to believe otherwise, contrary to my initial read." I don't like being wrong, so I felt a meh face was in order in this situation.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
"So, if what Roja's done looked so scummy to you, what makes you that much more comfortable lynching Dagger?"
For a few reasons.
1) On a scale of 1-10, Dagger's scum likelyhood to me is about 7.5. I've felt this way for a while.
Currently Roja is about a 7, and I haven't really noticed his scumminess until recently.
2) Dagger has more potential for harm, as far as I can tell. He shuts down people's abilities. That can be bad if he hits someone who can't restart their ability very easily.
Summarizing: I've felt Dagger is scummier for longer, and he can do more harm than Roja. But Roja is still scummy, and if people are beginning to doubt Dagger's scumminess (I still don't agree with the people that are necessarily) then we can go for the next best person in my view which would be Roja.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I'm completely for a Dagger lynch tomorrow, for what it's worth. The stalling of his wagon doesn't appear to be caused by a scumbuddy, as loran and Dancing Mad are basically confirmed town. So Dagger's obviously getting bussed here.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
"The difference is that you seem to be considering (even if it's on a minute level) that Manders and Iso are scum-buddies with Seppel."
So? I have a gut feeling and im not letting it go.
"So, as to my original question. Where do you think we should put you on your list?"
More trustable then Reya, Jksura, Dagger, Iso and Manders. Less by yourself, Dancing Mad, Kill joy and Loran.
"Give it a rest. Manders is almost certainly town."
Thats what I'm told. But I really don't see her playing that way.
"Let me ask you this: do you believe that Manders and Seppel could have been on the same team? And then after you answer that, I want to know how you are able to explain the discrepancy between Seppel's reaction to Tanarin's win-con claim w/ a Manders backup with Manders knowing the town win condition."
Anything is possible. I dont have time to go back and re-read.
Currently Roja is about a 7, and I haven't really noticed his scumminess until recently.
Explain please.
2) Dagger has more potential for harm, as far as I can tell. He shuts down people's abilities. That can be bad if he hits someone who can't restart their ability very easily.
So you believe that we are both telling the truth about our roles and such is the reason why you choose to stay with Dagger?
Summarizing: I've felt Dagger is scummier for longer, and he can do more harm than Roja. But Roja is still scummy, and if people are beginning to doubt Dagger's scumminess (I still don't agree with the people that are necessarily) then we can go for the next best person in my view which would be Roja.
You haven't explained anything that I have done to make you feel that I am scum. Just that you are going with the crowd.
I'm completely for a Dagger lynch tomorrow, for what it's worth. The stalling of his wagon doesn't appear to be caused by a scumbuddy, as loran and Dancing Mad are basically confirmed town. So Dagger's obviously getting bussed here.
I have people I'll be asking questions tomorrow.
I cannot wait for your 180 tomorrow when I come up town. So explain me this Iso, Why exactly are you letting Dagger "live" another Day? Why are you putting it off? What have I done so "scummy" that makes me out worse then Dagger?
And what about the babble with Loran and DM being confirmed town? Like welcome to day two when that has already been established.
Hey guys, If I get lynched today check out Iso tomorrow please. He clearly makes no sence to me and trying his hardest to A. blend in and B. Remove the person talking bad about him.
Also Manders you never did explain your vote for me?
OH I KNOW YOU LIKE BOLDING LARGE LETTERS RIGHT?
MANDERS WHY THE VOTE ON ME!!??? YOU SEEMED TO LEAVE THAT PART OUT.
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I'm completely for a Dagger lynch tomorrow, for what it's worth. The stalling of his wagon doesn't appear to be caused by a scumbuddy, as loran and Dancing Mad are basically confirmed town. So Dagger's obviously getting bussed here.
I have people I'll be asking questions tomorrow.
Actually im posting twice so that hopefully someone will notice this post from Iso..
He is suggesting that DM or Loran are stalling but it's "ok" that they are town. Playing them down in a negative light but "allowing it"..
Also the delay of Daggers demise since he had his mega post about Dagger (ok not mega but it was a pointy finger accusation post.)
And that last part.. He is ending the day KNOWING he will be living tomorrow.. I mean why hold on asking questions if they are worth asking?
If it is something relivent then shouldn't it be mentioned now... when he is ALIVE. I mean WHY EVEN SAY IT?
VOTE ISO
I know it doesn't count but man you are comming of really scummy of all of this.
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And that last part.. He is ending the day KNOWING he will be living tomorrow.. I mean why hold on asking questions if they are worth asking?
If it is something relivent then shouldn't it be mentioned now... when he is ALIVE. I mean WHY EVEN SAY IT?
So, did he ever provide you with an explanation that made sense as town?
I believe in town consensus in actions directly affecting a player.
So you check with everyone for every vote you make then?
This is a ridiculous response. While your vote would have counted for 2, it was still only a vote. There was no reason not to test loran, despite his objections. If you were truly that worried about it, you would have voted for him.
For you to consider it could be a gambit, the natural reaction would be for anyone to consider why type of gambit it could be. Gambits have a purpose. If you cannot discern of any reason for a gambit to be enacted, then it is likely not a gambit. This is simple logic, which you are quite capable of presenting. Your refusal to admit that this is a valid point and is NOT baseless doesn't help your case.
Seriously, Dagger? I have not grasped the benefits of asking questions of people to generate information? You've lost it, my friend.
Show me where I once said anything about loran's towniness. I dare you.
It does have a negative connotation, yes, but fishing is not necessarily scummy. Fishing after chastising another for fishing is hypocritical, though. Still not necessarily scummy, but I asked you this because I wanted your response. Your response was to deflect it onto me as a scummy action (as asking leading questions is scummy, which tells me all I need to know.
Noob town do that, too, Dagger, and you know it. For you to automatically assume, as you did do through all of that interaction, that he was doing it for scummy reasons is disingenuous.
Or an attempt to paint him as scummy. Either fits.
Of course there's not. But there is a need to provide reasons or pursue those that you are voting for. You kept your vote on me while pursuing information from other players.
I am convinced you are scum and attempting to show others how that is the case. Therefore, I have to show the scummy intentions behind your posts.
Which is what I am doing with you right now.
Mindset is not easily determined, Dagger, and you know it. There could be town reasons for the things he said/did as well. You CHOSE to interpret the scum mindset.
Then you would have shown it was a joke. The pseudo-smilie you added to the end of it is your way of showing concern.
I could create a drinking game of taking a shot every time you said mindset, but then I'd be drunk by now.
Regardless, this does not answer the question I asked you, Dagger. Why did you not vote the first time you mentioned something about his mindset?
Attacking your attackers is scummy, too.
I can quote stuff again for you, too.
New town are scared to attract attention, too. This is not reason enough to consider him scummy.
Preposterous. I probably know better than everyone here how humorous you can be as we've often chatted outside of mafia. That doesn't negate the FACT that you had been attempting to appease loran since he said you were scum.
I'll give you this point.
I didn't use it because it's a bull**** point.
lol
Doubtful. Even if I am wrong, you've played horrendously this game and brought this case only on yourself.
For instance, I was not disappointed when we lynched Cyan in Ogre and he flipped town. Because the evidence I had on him made more sense for scum than town. **** happens. Townies get lynched. But not for no reason.
Then allow me to refute those reasons again. Seppel is quite well known for throwing votes simply to garner reactions from the other players. This is the reason I did not find him scummy for his vote. As I stated back then. I was wrong, but that doesn't change the fact that it's something Seppel does regularly. To automatically assume he was scum for it would have been preposterous.
Look above.
Well, you provided no reasons in any of your lists, so I have no idea why you had me listed as scum. But you never once said I was scummy for "ignoring" (in quotes because I didn't ignore it. I decided it was not a scumtell)
WHY?
He had already attacked the points themselves. He felt loran ignored that, so he moved further.
He didn't misinterpret ****. His comments had nothing to do with the term "moderating".
Probably not. This method works for me. I am attempting to improve on my reads, but you bet your ass the next time Seppel and I are town together and I'm sure of it, I will barn him to kingdom come.
I am much less trusting of my reads on him now, though. Chances are I won't trust him for awhile.
I know town Dagger, in Family Mafia, where he was convinced I was scum, still didn't vote for me as soon as he knew it.
You said that I never provided evidence of why I thought Iso was town. I'm saying I absolutely did, in the post that you said it didn't happen. Therefore, your statement was blatantly false.
And yet you chastise me for doing so and say that it's a bad playstyle.
Get lynched.
You'll have to explain your question clearer.
If it is the former, then a simple mistake it is. I have the right to say that I believe it is the latter because it is open to interpretation.
Yes, spin. It was pretty obvious when he first asked it that he was wondering because they are lurking. You made it out to be scummy.
Your hope has failed.
No, you really didn't.
If it is proven that a player as town (which it pretty much is with Iso) then that does put them beyond reproach. Yes, you can point out faulty logic and whatnot, but you cannot consider them scum for it.
I didn't say you did. I'm just saying you didn't lie about your role.
Making a town/scum list without reasons for the placement of the players is scummy. For you to try to brush it off now is deplorable.
Bull****, Dagger. You said you're reluctant to pursue them, yet that's precisely what you had done for most of the day.
Doesn't.
#303.
And yet you provide no reasons for why you didn't think he was scum. You just say so.
No, they hadn't. And, your previous list didn't have reasons, either.
Absolutely not. Anyone provides a scumlist without reasons, and I am on it like white on rice.
What I am expecting is something along the lines of "player X is town because Y reasons", etc.
No, you are not.
Absolutely not. That would be absurd.
And why are you acting like you don't know what I mean? You know damn good and well what I mean when I say lists with reasons.
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Wild thought: Manders, Iso and Seppel scum? Like wouldn't they think that to be a dream team.
Reading the points now..
Firstly, you said you trust Dagger the least of all of the players in the game presently.
But I'm your 3rd least trusted player.
I started the case on Dagger.
If I'm one of your least trusted players, then why are you taking a case I started and using it for your nonvote-vote?
This is inconsistent. And now you're saying there's a lot to read, considering the possibility that Manders is scum after she has basically been cleared.
No.
Unvote, vote Roja
You haven't been adding up lately. Best start explaining.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
There is a lot to go though (since there has been a back and forth..) I'm posting what catches my eye.
Dagger I am not sure I can agree with your bolded statement here. I would like to think that "a new scum in unwilling to vote another player because they fear attention from EVERYONE ELSE."
My assumption is that they are trying to fit in, and if they go aganst "the town" (everyone else.) that would put more attention onto them then they going against who they are trying to peg as scum.
Then again I can only speak from my experiance as scum that one time.
You do realize your trust level will change once Dagger flips scum? However until that happens Im not sure how much I can trust you. If Dagger happens to not be scum, YOU as you said started the case against him and thus something I would be looking on... (again.)
I dont have all the time in the world to do the work I should be doing. (Im only posting now because im able to work from home thus allowing me to look on here while "working".) It's a fact of life and if that makes me scum then that makes you a bad player for thinking that.
Now see here I think you are trying to make me look bad.
You just said above about why I doubt Manders as she is "cleared". Didn't Taneran also get cleared in that same situation?
I thought he was town before that instance and thought that Manders wasn't so before then. That is why they are ranked the way they are. Tanaran is cleared and I trust, I really trust Loran and kill joy. And while I think manders can be scum she is cleared via the same reason as Tanarin is.
You're saying that Dancing Mad (Tanarin at the time) is cleared because he had the specific town's win condition known when he claimed. And Manders REALIZED that and cleared him for it. So by your logic, if Manders is scum, so is Dancing Mad. That means that Manders should be right next to Dancing Mad in your trust list, not after loran. Why do you trust kill-joy so much?
More importantly, why didn't you include the possibility that jskura could be scum, or ANYWHERE on your list, for that matter?
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I told you why they are on the list and why Tanarin is higher then Manders. I'm allowed to rank them how I want too. I'm not blindingly trusting Manders. Just like im not blindling trusting you.
Kill-joy hasen't said anything I really haven't disagreed with. And I don't find him suspicitious.
OMG THAT TOTALLYS MEANS I OUTTED US AS SCUM OH CRAP!
Or I clearly forgot to put him on my list. (Tell you how much he posts huh?)
However if you note from my other comments about him, he would be one up over Dagger on my trust/scum list.
My doubt of you has nothing to do with Dagger's case. It's your day 1 play. Thats why I don't have trust in you.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
"This bit you quoted here actually lends some credence to the idea that Dagger is telling the truth about being a town 'RBer'."
"On the other hand, attacking you over disagreeing with an Iso wagon is two strikes (with you being town and Iso probably being town)."
"Yes. I saw no redeeming qualities for Dagger, and if there was a wagon on him, I most certainly did not disagree."
"No, just that they are much more likely to be to be lying. As I said, I saw nothing that lended credence to Dagger being town. If there is a player that is on neither end of the scum<->town scale and that player is a roleblocker and the roleblock was used without thought, they automatically are shifted toward the scum side."
"Questions:
1) Why is Reya second from the bottom?
2) Did you ever pseudo-vote Dagger?
3) Will you confirm one more time that you do not have a vote?
On that last point, Mod, we are sorely in need of a vote count."
"I don't think anyone is doubting that he is what he claims, as it makes the puzzle pieces fit quite nicely."
"Wow, you just reminded me. He requested that I be a cop target. Think about that for a moment. With the amount of 'clearing' that we've been doing this game, why would a scum suggest that one of the few remaining unknowns be targeted by the cop? I cannot believe that Dagger would purposefully paint himself or his teammates further into a corner."
"Agreed."
"Ok, so after Manders' more or less resposting of all of Dagger's posts, his responses to her accusations, and my own enlightenment on certain points, Dagger now gets put on my town side. Unvote: Dagger"
"*Cough, cough* Pot, meet kettle."
"I will also be honest and say that at this point in Manders' reply, I didn't feel like going through any more of her response to Dagger's response. If there were any good points made in there, I'd like someone to bring them to my attention. Thank you."
"Hey folks, remember how I said that I didn't have any real people pegged as scum and that it was more process of elimination than anything else? Well, I would like to revise my earlier statement in light of new evidence provided by Roja. Vote: Roja This post is so out of left field in an attempt to discredit, I can see absolutely no town mindset possible here."
"Really? Is that so? Do tell."
"Let us try a fun thought exercise. Where would you put yourself on the trust list, and don't just put yourself at the top because you 'know your role'. Imagine that you are any of the other players in the game. Where should we put you?"
<3
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
What does need to happen is Dancing Mad needs to contribute, and we need to end this Day.
As it seems more are happier lynching Roja than Dagger,
Unvote; Vote: Roja
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VOTE COUNT #12
----------------
Roja (3) - Iso, The_Doctor, MandersHex
Dagger (1) - jskura
Reya Cookiebringer (1) - Dagger
----------
With 10 players alive, it takes 6 votes to lynch.
===================================================
Also, jskura has been prodded.
There is no point in outting yourself unless you are really worried about my opinion of you.. Hmm.
Your day 1 of setting up arguements before posting stings quite well with me still.
Clearly your day two play gets better if Dagger turns up scum. But until I see that I cannot say you play better now can I?
1. I don't trust Reya, he has said next to nothing allowing me to beleive that he is a member of the town.
2. I thought I did, but don't have the time to look.
3. VOTE DAGGER
Because I just don't see it as scum bussing scum. (his orginal post against Dagger that is.)
Hmm Because of my situation with this game, I have been trying to play better. Having no vote and only a voice is something I find horribly annoying. Yet what I find even more annoying is the fact that someone who has a PR or whatnot is more trustworthy over me who has spent the time and effor into this game. So trust me however you can throw me, I don't have all the time in the world to play, and clearly there are some mental mind trap you caught me in. I'm a townie and have been activly going after scum. Sorry if you see what im doing in a different light.
I know I'm at three votes but I don't know if I'll have time to respond as I have plans.
My trigger for memory is to surive to day three. And that my monkier was Sangria.
Also im not a fan of Manders vote there either..
Also the "ability" that I started with was: That I have no vote.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Several things of note:
1. JSkura still hasn't posted and I still request a prod. MOD! --> I actually spoke to the mod on AIM and he said he did, but well, just putting this on the record.
2. @Manders - Oh good god this is why I've abandoned full PBPAs and your version is killing me. Please don't spoil quoted posts and then don't use the colors so much, they burn my eyes (especially the neon blue). Don't use bold so much either. Agh My Eyes! (The Goggles do nothing).
3. Interesting wagon on Roja here. I vaguely recall thinking I saw some things that made me feel Roja was town, but I can't recall them. So my vote remains off for now.
4. ISO - I think I've brought up this point before, but once again, re: 1453, it is not a point in any way shape or form for a person to agree with scum accusations at one player (such against Dagger) made by a player (such as yourself) who they also suspect may be scum. The best way to evaluate arguments is to evaluate the ARGUMENTS themselves, not the PLAYER making said argument (though if you find the argument to be strong, it may change your opinion of the Arguer for the better). I'm not saying Roja is doing this - but he SHOULD if he's town, which is why that is NOT a scum tell.
In other words, If you suspect Player B is scum, you can still agree with Player B's argument that Player C is scum - even without changing your opinion of Player B. So it's not a tell either way.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I just spent several hours making a post elsewhere. I'm exhausted and my head hurts. You guys will have to wait until I get some sleep.
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Not good enough. Vote Jskura. That's vote #1. Who wants to join me?
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
How is it not good enough? He told us his feelings on who is town, who is scum etc.
If you want to ask him something to answer, do it. I will not be voting him today though.
barn to hell and back.
If anyone else votes for jskura, there will be hell to pay. Just sayin'.
We now need to end this day as soon as possible to prevent anyone else from voting for him.
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{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
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{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I'm way more comfy with a Dagger lynch, but Roja's fine I guess. All his stuff about how we shouldn't activate jskara because he's a Pandora's box looked really scummy to me. IIRC he was throwing a bunch of WIFOM aside from that as well.
I'd be 454556778945255x happier with Dagger being lynched though.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
He didn't tell us anything! He gave a town scum list with no justifications. Zero. Zilch. You wouldn't accept that from any other player and you shouldn't for him.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
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Damn, it didnt send. I was going to post something in response to this from class, but it didnt go through.
Basically I was going to say that no one said you're wrong, but I just think we need to take a different approach to it. Ultimatums and threats tend to have two results: The person walls themselves more yielding less results, or they panic, making the results you get pointless
We will catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.
Make that 4.
On jskura: I would like jskura to explain why he thinks Dagger is scum. If he does that, I would be satisfied waiting until day 2 to get more from him. I'm not looking for a PBPA; all I want is a paragraph (in smiley alphabet) or so, with quotes/links to posts if necessary. It wouldn't take that long.
Here let me help you. Check out Manders last post here:
First, she lists no real reasons why she is voting for me. Only the fact that she is copying other people's reasons. (She did state reasons for Dagger but I shouldn't be bunched into that.)
Second she STILL feels Dagger is scum after her huge PBPA posts against him and yet she just tosses her vote in my direction.
Third what annoys me is how she wants Dancing Mad to say more completely giving jskrua a free pass.
Sorry if you feel that I am "smearing" Manders Iso, however she isn't playing all saintlike.
So you just roll over and vote whatever is easier? Let me ask you this do you think Dagger and I are on the same team? And then after you answer that I want to know why you think that way.
As for the Jskura post I agree that it isn't enough. We get it that there are some "issues" but he can do much better.. Even if i'm lynched today, we need more info out of Jskura before giving him a free pass.
The halting of the Dagger wagon, I think speaks loads on his alignment. I'm willing to let him slide for now, because you're being mounds scummier presently. I'm not voting for "who's easier". I'm voting for who I think is scum.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
This would be good.
@Kill-Joy, no ultimatums are actually quite fine, you just have to be willing to act on your threats for them to have force. JSkura seems to think I'm not serious. I''m showing him otherwise.
Dancing_Mad, if you would, please threaten JSkura also if he doesn't post what you want in his next post? No need to actually vote him yet, but if, as I suspect, he comes back with nothing, serious pressure should be applied.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
jskura is NOT getting a free pass. Back the **** off, all of you.
If you cause him to have to go another day with MMM PR, I will be very upset.
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"The difference is that you seem to be considering (even if it's on a minute level) that Manders and Iso are scum-buddies with Seppel."
"So, as to my original question. Where do you think we should put you on your list?"
"Give it a rest. Manders is almost certainly town."
"What does 'but :/' stand for?"
"So, if what Roja's done looked so scummy to you, what makes you that much more comfortable lynching Dagger?"
"Let me ask you this: do you believe that Manders and Seppel could have been on the same team? And then after you answer that, I want to know how you are able to explain the discrepancy between Seppel's reaction to Tanarin's win-con claim w/ a Manders backup with Manders knowing the town win condition."
In this case, "recent events have led me to believe otherwise, contrary to my initial read." I don't like being wrong, so I felt a meh face was in order in this situation.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
For a few reasons.
1) On a scale of 1-10, Dagger's scum likelyhood to me is about 7.5. I've felt this way for a while.
Currently Roja is about a 7, and I haven't really noticed his scumminess until recently.
2) Dagger has more potential for harm, as far as I can tell. He shuts down people's abilities. That can be bad if he hits someone who can't restart their ability very easily.
Summarizing: I've felt Dagger is scummier for longer, and he can do more harm than Roja. But Roja is still scummy, and if people are beginning to doubt Dagger's scumminess (I still don't agree with the people that are necessarily) then we can go for the next best person in my view which would be Roja.
Hopefully that makes sense.
And, this game continues to drag so hard, so I'm going to ask the mod something.
@ Alpha: Can we get a deadline up in here? I'd really like to get to D3 already.
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I have people I'll be asking questions tomorrow.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
So? I have a gut feeling and im not letting it go.
More trustable then Reya, Jksura, Dagger, Iso and Manders. Less by yourself, Dancing Mad, Kill joy and Loran.
Thats what I'm told. But I really don't see her playing that way.
Anything is possible. I dont have time to go back and re-read.
Explain please.
So you believe that we are both telling the truth about our roles and such is the reason why you choose to stay with Dagger?
You haven't explained anything that I have done to make you feel that I am scum. Just that you are going with the crowd.
I cannot wait for your 180 tomorrow when I come up town. So explain me this Iso, Why exactly are you letting Dagger "live" another Day? Why are you putting it off? What have I done so "scummy" that makes me out worse then Dagger?
And what about the babble with Loran and DM being confirmed town? Like welcome to day two when that has already been established.
Hey guys, If I get lynched today check out Iso tomorrow please. He clearly makes no sence to me and trying his hardest to A. blend in and B. Remove the person talking bad about him.
Also Manders you never did explain your vote for me?
OH I KNOW YOU LIKE BOLDING LARGE LETTERS RIGHT?
MANDERS WHY THE VOTE ON ME!!??? YOU SEEMED TO LEAVE THAT PART OUT.
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Actually im posting twice so that hopefully someone will notice this post from Iso..
He is suggesting that DM or Loran are stalling but it's "ok" that they are town. Playing them down in a negative light but "allowing it"..
Also the delay of Daggers demise since he had his mega post about Dagger (ok not mega but it was a pointy finger accusation post.)
And that last part.. He is ending the day KNOWING he will be living tomorrow.. I mean why hold on asking questions if they are worth asking?
If it is something relivent then shouldn't it be mentioned now... when he is ALIVE. I mean WHY EVEN SAY IT?
VOTE ISO
I know it doesn't count but man you are comming of really scummy of all of this.
Whoa it worked! Nice play!
BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
It's obvious he means tomorrow as in 09/23/11.
Way to out yourself, scum.
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