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Submission deadline: Tuesday, July 31st, 11:00 PM GMT
Rules and Banned List
Be sure to review the rules and banned list(s) by clicking below.
Cards on the PHM Banned List are always banned, and cards on the Land Rule Banned List are banned as well when the round uses a Land Rule.
Contents
1. Overview
2. Game Rules
3. Hand Construction Rules
4. Entry
5. Perfect Hand Magic League (PHML)
6. Scoring
7. Variant Format Rules
1. Overview
Perfect Hand Magic (PHM) is a competitive strategy game for two or more players. It can be played using pencil and paper; however, it's most commonly played via an online forum. To play the game, each player secretly chooses a specified number of Magic cards which form their hand. Once all players have chosen hands, the hands are revealed and scored.
The object of the game is to choose the hand that will score the most points. The score for each hand is determined by the result that it would achieve if it were used to play two games of Magic – one match – against each competing hand; the rules for these theoretical games are covered in Section 2 – Game Rules. During each theoretical game, the player of each hand employs the strategy that maximizes the score for their hand, taking into account the strategy of their opponent(s).
A hand scores 3 points for each game that it would win, 0 points for each game that it would lose, and 1 point for each game that would end in a draw. However, a hand scores only 2 points for any match that would have a symmetrical result, regardless of whether the result would be two drawn games or a win for each hand.
The composition of a hand is limited only by a short banned list and a few restrictions on the game states that it can enable; these restrictions are covered in Section 3 – Hand Construction Rules.
2. Game Rules
2.1. Except for the changes described in these rules, games follow the rules for a normal game of Magic.
2.1a. Changes to the Comprehensive Rules or the Oracle text of a card take effect at the following times:
i. Changes that would take effect during the prerelease for a set take effect during the first round for which cards from that set may be submitted instead.
ii. Changes that would take effect at any other time take effect during the first round for which those rules have been in effect since the start of the round instead.
2.1b. Ignore any part of an instruction that isn't covered by these rules or by the rules of Magic.
2.2. A player's opening hand contains that player's chosen cards.
2.3. Players' libraries begin the game empty.
2.3a. A player doesn't lose the game as a result of being unable to draw a card.
2.4. An effect that would produce a random result produces the result that least benefits the owner of the source of that effect instead.
2.5. Each player is the starting player for one game in each match.
2.6. Players know the identities of all face-down cards and all cards in hidden zones, and players know which decisions have been made by other players.
2.7. If a game would continue indefinitely, then the game is a draw.
2.8. If a loop containing at least one optional action would be repeated indefinitely during a turn, then any player may propose a number of times for that loop to repeat instead. If a player does, then each other player may propose a different number and the loop is repeated for the greatest number of times proposed instead. No player is required to make a choice that would end a loop that crosses multiple turns.
2.9. Cards can't be brought into the game from outside the game.
3. Hand Construction Rules
3.1. A player may not choose an opening hand that would enable them to achieve any of the following results before an opponent's second turn would end, such that that opponent could make no sequence of decisions that would not result in at least one of these results:
i. Win the game.
ii. Take an infinite number of turns.
iii. Cause a card to leave an opponent's hand.
Ignore this rule in the following cases:
3.1a. That player's hand would be legal if that player's opponents' cards had no rules text.
3.1b. That player's hand would be legal if that player's opponents had no maximum hand size.
3.1c. That player could achieve one of these results only during a game that was restarted after an opponent's second turn had begun.
3.1d. All cards that would leave an opponent's hand during the resolution of an effect would be put onto the battlefield by that effect.
3.1e. All cards that would leave an opponent's hand during the resolution of an effect would be in that opponent's hand once that effect resolved.
3.2. A hand may contain any number of copies of any card legal in Vintage.
3.2a. An unreleased card is treated as though it's legal in Vintage if it will become legal in Vintage upon release and if the release notes for the set that contains that card were published prior to the start of the round (See rule 4.1).
3.3. A hand may not contain any cards on the PHM Banned List.
4. Entry
4.1. A player plays a round of PHM by submitting a list of their chosen cards to the PHM moderator.
4.2. A player may change their hand until the posted deadline.
4.2a. If a player submits an illegal hand, then the moderator will try to notify that player to change their hand prior to the deadline. If the hand is discovered to be illegal after the deadline has passed – or if the player does not submit a new hand – then the moderator may either disqualify that hand or replace it with a similar hand, in which any cards causing that hand to be illegal have been removed or replaced.
4.2b. The moderator also will try to notify a player if that player's hand doesn't enable that player to win the game against any possible hand.
4.3. A player may name their hand. If he or she doesn't, then the moderator may name it. The moderator may also rename a player's hand at their discretion.
5. Perfect Hand Magic League (PHML)
5.1. PHM League play consists of four rounds of PHM.
5.2. Each round, a player earns League points according to the following formula:
League Points = Points Scored / Number of Opponents x 100 (rounded to the nearest integer)
5.3. The player with the most League points at the end of League play is the PHM League winner.
5.3a. If multiple players have the most League points at the end of the League, then the PHM moderator may allow those players to play additional rounds until only one of those players has the most League points or until a specified number of additional rounds has been played.
6. Scoring
6.1. A table of match results is posted at the end of each round. Each row lists one player's result against each other player. A player's points and League points are tallied at the end of their row.
6.2. A player may earn bonus League points as specified by the PHM moderator.
6.3. Each player is responsible for determining the match results for their hand.
6.3a. Players are encouraged to determine or verify additional match results.
6.3b. An undetermined match result is counted as a loss for both players in that match.
6.3c. A player may challenge any result until the moderator announces that the result is final.
7. Variant Format Rules
7.1. Perfect Hand Magic has been played with hands typically containing between one and seven cards. Additionally, the Game Rules and Hand Construction Rules have been adapted to create hundreds of variant formats. Five commonly-played variants are described in Sections 7.3-7.7.
7.2. The rules of a variant format overwrite any other applicable rules.
7.2a. Some variant formats generate continuous effects. A continuous effect generated by a variant format is treated as having the earliest timestamp within a layer or sublayer. If continuous effects generated by multiple variant formats would apply in the same layer or sublayer, assign timestamps to those effects in the order that the variant formats are listed in the rules or name of the round.
7.2b. Some variant formats require a player to make some number of decisions in addition to or instead of submitting a hand. A player's submission must comply with the Hand Construction Rules, taking into account any decisions made at this time.
7.2c. Some variant formats require players to make decisions "before the start of each game". For these decisions, follow the "Active Player, Nonactive Player order" rule, replacing "active player" with "starting player".
7.3. Land Rule Variant.
7.3a. There are three versions of the land rule variant.
i. This is the basic land rule (LR). Any player may play a basic land of their choice from outside the game any time he or she could normally play a land. A hand may not contain any cards on the Land Rule Banned List.
ii. This is the extra land rule (ELR). Any player may play a basic land of their choice from outside the game any time he or she could normally play a land. Any player may play an additional land on each of their turns from their hand. A hand may not contain any cards on the Land Rule Banned List.
iii. This is the draw land rule (DLR). If a player would draw a card from an empty library, that player puts a basic land of their choice from outside the game into their hand instead. The starting player doesn't skip the draw step of their first turn. A hand may not contain any cards on the Land Rule Banned List.
7.3b. For all versions of the land rule variant, except as allowed by its owner, a basic land can't be caused to leave the battlefield, change control, or gain another card type by an effect of a source controlled by an opponent of its owner before its owner's second turn would end.
7.5. Life Rule (LF).
7.5a. If neither player would win otherwise, then the player who maintains the higher life total wins the game.
7.5b. Irrespective of rule 7.5a, a player must choose an opening hand that enables them to win both games of a match against at least one hand, such that the player of the losing hand could make no sequence of decisions that would not result in that player losing the game. The losing hand must conform with the Hand Construction Rules but need not consider this rule.
7.6. Backbuild.
7.6a. Players exchange hands before the start of each match. Each player must choose an opening hand that enables them to win both games of a match against a specified hand or specified hands, such that the player of any specified hand could make no sequence of decisions that would not result in the player of that specified hand losing the game. Ignore rule 3.1.
7.7. (Bonus).
7.7a. A player earns bonus points if their hand meets specified requirements.
PHM Banned List_________________Land Rule Banned List
Note you may submit two hands for this challenge, since the "hands" are so small. For obvious reasons those hands won't be graded against each other, and you'll receive the score of your best preforming hand (rather than adding scores together or something).
you'll receive the score of your best preforming hand
Err, wait. Isn't whichever of our hands is the best-scoring one predicated on whichever of our opponent's hands is the best-scoring one (and therefore the one that they use?)
You'll grade both hands against all other hands (as if two people submitted them), but your "score" for the purposes of the PHM league will be the score of whatever hand of yours did best.
On that note, I've been entirely slacking on grading past challenges. I would be incredibly thankful if anyone picked up my slack and graded some of the previous rounds, but if not I'll stop being a lazy bum allocate some time later on this week to grade.
You'll grade both hands against all other hands (as if two people submitted them), but your "score" for the purposes of the PHM league will be the score of whatever hand of yours did best.
So hypothetically it might be better to submit only one hand (or two identical hands), just so a given opponent's stronger hand doesn't score against your weaker hand?
1a. 0-6
1b. 0-6
2a. 0-6
2b. 0-6
3a. 6-0
3b. 4-1. Putrid Leech kills turn 7, but would lose life 4 times to do so, and can't delay lest Bolas flips->kills->reanimate. With 8 life loss, Bolas also kills on turn 7. On the play I win, on the draw I can't race and so have to offer the trade.
4a. X
4b. X
5a. 0-6
5b. 0-6
6a. 0-6
6b. 6-0, Vraska gets discarded
7a. 0-6
7b. 6-0
8a. 6-0. Even if you discard, I still get the first swing in the 4 damage race.
8b. 6-0
4b | |
1a. 6-0. I sit back until I have 36 lands and one shot you. (This goes for any singular black/white creature)
1b. 6-0. I goldfish kill on turn 8, Mesa does not kill nearly that quickly.
2a. 0-6.
2b. 6-0. See 1a.
3a. 3-3. On the play I kill Turn 11 and you kill turn 12, on the draw you shut down the Stillmoon faster and win.
3b. 6-0, see 1a.
4a. X
4b. X
5a. 0-6
5b. 0-6
6a. 6-0, see 1b.
6b. 3-3. On the play I ignore Vraska and kill you T8 before she can ult. On the draw I thow an attack at Vraska for 5, which puts her back three turns, then swing at you well before you can kill me. Whoops wrong Vraska. We both goldfish on T8 and can't interact, so player who goes first wins.
7a. 0-6
7b. 2-2. The 2/Xs stare at each other angrily.
Vs 1a) Guul Draz Assassin
Win: Can make tokens too fast for Assassin to keep up.
Vs 1b) Sacred Mesa
Draw: Snap!
Vs 2a) Mayor of Avabruk
Loss: Agree with Convoy_Avenger: Didn't allow for the play of holding back the Mayor and sending in tokens to kill 3 blockers at a time
Vs 2b) Kiku, Night’s Flower
Win: Can make tokens too fast for Kiku to keep up
Vs 3a) Voidstone Gargoyle
Draw: Gargoyle shuts off my ability to produce more tokens. But I have at least 3, which meas I can block & kill Gargoyle.
Vs 3b) Putrid Leach
Win: Can make tokens too fast for Leach to keep up
Vs 4a) Nicol Bolas, the Ravager
Win: Can make tokens too fast for Bolas to keep up
Vs 4b) Stillmoon Cavalier
Loose: Prot White means I can’t chump block. Can’t race either.
Vs 5a) Hammer of Purphoros
Loose: Hammer tokens too big for me
Vs 5b) Kargan Dragonlord
Loose: Dragonlord tramples
Vs 7a) Mayor of Avabruk
Loss: Agree with Convoy_Avenger: Didn't allow for the play of holding back the Mayor and sending in tokens to kill 3 blockers at a time
Vs 7b) Phyrexian Revoker
Lose: I can’t make tokens
Vs 8a) Metrognome
Win: Can make tokens too fast for Gnomes to keep up
Vs 8b) Nether Spirit
Win: Can make tokens too fast for Spirit to keep up
Vs 1a) Guul Draz Assassin
Win: Vraska’s -3 kills Assassin, ultimate for the win..
Vs 1b) Sacred Mesa
Loose: Loose: Too many tokens, too quickly
Vs 2a) Mayor of Avabruk
Loose: Tokens beat down Vraska
Vs 2b) Kiku, Night’s Flower
Win: Vraska’s -3 kills Kiku, ultimate for the win..
Vs 3a) Voidstone Gargoyle
Loose: Gargoyle shuts down Vraska
Vs 3b) Putrid Leach
Win: Vraska’s -3 kills Leach, ultimate for the win..
Vs 4a) Nicol Bolas, the Ravager
Loose: Discard Vraska
Vs 4b) Stillmoon Cavalier
Draw: Stillmoon attacks Vraska and both die.
Vs 5a) Hammer of Purphoros
Loose: Vraska either dies to 1 token per turn, then you just make more tokens to kill me…
OR Vraska’s -3 kills Hammer, but existing Golem kills her, then kills me.
Vs 5b) Kargan Dragonlord
Win: Vraska’s -3
Vs 7a) Mayor of Avabruk
Loose: Tokens beat down Vraska
Vs 7b) Phyrexian Revoker
Lose: I can’t activate loyalty abilities
Vs 8a) Metrognome
Win: Vraska -3 the Card, then +1’s or -3 kill remaining Gnome.
Vs 8b) Nether Spirit
Draw: Vraska ticks up by 2 every 2 turns, Spirit attacks for 2 every 2 turns. Neither of us can progress.
2a) Mayor of Avabruck - 6-0, I delay casting for a turn to prevent a flip, then get big enough to kill Mayor before he causes me any problems.
2b) Kiku, Night's Flower - 6-0. I kill it before it kills me
Danxor3
3a) Voidstone Gargoyle - 6-0 I'm a 4/4 by the time it comes down, so I can just race.
3b) Putrid Leech - 6-0 I race it successfully
ManyCookies
4a) Nicol Bolas, the Ravager - 6-0, I race it successfully
4b) Stillmoon Cavalier - oof. 0-6
Anachronity
5a) Hammer of Purphoros - 3-3 I kill your tokens as fast as you can make them, or you chump for days
5b) Kargan Dragonlord - 6-0, I kill him on turn 3, before he's out of range
Sizel
6a) Sacred Mesa - 0-6 Just starts chumping me
6b) Vraska the Unseen - 0-6, I'm surprised Vraska didn't do better.
Superbajt
7a) Mayor of Avabruck - 6-0, see above
7b) Phyrexian Revoker - 3-3, stare at each other
Feyd_Ruin
8a) Metrognome - wtf is this card? 3-3, trade for days.
8b) Nether Spirit - 6-0, I get to attack every other turn, he doesn't come back quickly enough to be a threat. (I kill him EoT, attack, he comes back, I do nothing, kill him EoT, attack, etc)
1b) Sacred Mesa (re-do)
5 Wins - 7 Loses - 2 Draw
2a) Mayor of Avabruck - 0-6. This one is actually complicated, and I thought Mesa did win, but Mayor eventually just has too many things that can attack with. Loses on turn 9.
2b) Kiku, Night's Flower - 6-0 Can't keep up
Danxor3
3a) Voidstone Gargoyle - 0-6 - Gargoyle just beats this hand, straight up. Need to sac a pegasus every turn, and can't activate to make more.
3b) Putrid Leech - 6-0 I race it successfully
ManyCookies
4a) Nicol Bolas, the Ravager - 6-0, I race it successfully
4b) Stillmoon Cavalier - 0-6. Pro white is good.
Anachronity
5a) Hammer of Purphoros - 0-6 - Same deal with Mayor, just becomes overwhelming to the point I can't make enough chumpers
5b) Kargan Dragonlord - 0-6 Firebreathing Trampler is good
Sizel
6a) Sacred Mesa - 2-2
6b) Vraska the Unseen - 2-2. OTP, Mesa makes enough tokens to finish Vraska off after destroying Mesa, OTD, Vraska can kill it, and have enough loyalty left to survive the swing back.
Superbajt
7a) Mayor of Avabruck - 0-6 see above
7b) Phyrexian Revoker - 0-6, stops Mesa
Feyd_Ruin
8a) Metrognome - wtf is this card? 6-0, I make tokens faster
8b) Nether Spirit - 6-0, I win that race
Convoy_Avenger
1a) Guul Draz Assassin: Assassin slits the throats of all my metal men, but can't attack without my board building up. ~ 2-2
1b) Sacred Mesa: 6-0; see below
NTheo
2a) Mayor of Avabruck: Mayor wins OTP because he flips in time for next turn. Loses OTD because my hammer delays him flipping for a turn. ~ 3-3
2b) Kiku, Night's Flower: Kiku draws it OTP, but loses OTD because my golems have haste. ~ 4-1
Danxor3
3a) Voidstone Gargoyle: I swing first, so you can't race me. If you block with the Gargoyle then I can just make more golems. ~ 6-0
3b) Putrid Leech: after turn 4 OTD I can chump until the leech kills you, or build up and swing if you stop attacking. ~ 6-0
Sizel
6a) Sacred Mesa: 6-0; see below
6b) Vraska the Unseen: As stated, Vraska blows up my hammer and dies to a golem, or just dies to many golems. ~ 6-0
1a) Guul Draz Assassin: Assassin ganks the Dragonlord before he can grow up big and strong. ~ 0-6
1b) Sacred Mesa: 6-0; see below
NTheo
2a) Mayor of Avabruck: Dragonlord comes out the turn after the mayor to delay him, and then outraces. ~ 6-0
2b) Kiku, Night's Flower: Kiku kills the angry man on the dragon. ~ 0-6
Danxor3
3a) Voidstone Gargoyle: Dragonlord is already at least a 4/4 flyer when the Gargoyle comes down. ~ 6-0
3b) Putrid Leech: Leech isn't fast enough. ~ 6-0
ManyCookies
4a) Nicol Bolas, the Ravager: Bolas isn't fast enough to discard the Dragonlord, and can't transform before I win. ~ 6-0
4b) Stillmoon Cavalier: The Dragonlord is not white or black, and easily races. ~ 6-0
Sizel
6a) Sacred Mesa: 6-0; see below
6b) Vraska the Unseen: As stated, Vraska kersplodes the boy and his dragon. ~ 0-6
Superbajt
7a) Mayor of Avabruck: see above ~ 6-0
7b) Phyrexian Revoker: Revoker keeps the Dragonlord from leveling, and so we draw with a 2/1 and a 2/2. ~ 2-2
Feyd_Ruin
8a) Metrognome: Dragonlord outraces the gnome apocalypse. ~ 6-0
8b) Nether Spirit: Dragonlord flies over the recurring blocker. ~ 6-0
OTD...
yT3: play Mesa
mT3: play Hammer
yT4: upkeep, make pegasus in response and sac it. Play land.
mT4: land, make golem, swing 3 (y: 17). EOT you make a pegasus.
yT5: sac pegasus, land, pass.
mT5: land, make golem, swing 6 (y: 11). EOT you make 2 pegasus tokens.
yT6: sac pegasus, land (6 lands), pass (1 pegasus).
mT6: land, make golem, swing 9; you make 2 tokens and triple-block, taking 6 (y: 5). EOT you make another pegasus.
yT7: sac pegasus, land (7), pass.
mT7: land, make golem, swing 9; you make 3 tokens, but need to block with two (y: 2). EOT you have 1 pegasus.
yT8: sac pegasus, land (8), pass.
mT8: land, make golem, swing 12; you need to full chump.
yT9: upkeep, make and sac pegasus. land (9; 7 untapped), pass.
mT9: land, golem, swing 15. GG ~ 6-0
if you try to chump block repeatedly instead of trading 3-to-1, then you lose one more pegasus each turn than the previous, while you only make an additional pegasus per turn every two turns.
if you try to race then you only get in 7 damage before losing.
OTD...
mT2: play Dragonlord
yT3: play Mesa
mT3: level up to 3, swing 2 (y: 18).
yT4: pegasus and sac on upkeep, land (2 untapped), pass.
mT4: level up to 7, swing 4, you make a pegasus and chump.
yT5: pegasus and sac on upkeep, land (3 untapped), pass.
mT5: level up to 8, swing 12 trample (y: 6). EOT you make a pegasus.
yT6: sac pegasus, land (6 untapped), pass.
mT6: swing 14 trample. GG ~ 6-0
I don't want to be mean, but come on. This one isn't even close.
If you don't want to score your rounds then at the very least you shouldn't blindly declare yourself the winner...
I'm pretty sure you also lose to Mayor of Avabruck.
EDIT: you also lose to Voidstone OTD
OTD...
yT3: play Mesa
mT3: play Hammer
yT4: upkeep, make pegasus in response and sac it. Play land.
mT4: land, make golem, swing 3 (y: 17). EOT you make a pegasus.
yT5: sac pegasus, land, pass.
mT5: land, make golem, swing 6 (y: 11). EOT you make 2 pegasus tokens.
yT6: sac pegasus, land (6 lands), pass (1 pegasus).
mT6: land, make golem, swing 9; you make 2 tokens and triple-block, taking 6 (y: 5). EOT you make another pegasus.
yT7: sac pegasus, land (7), pass.
mT7: land, make golem, swing 9; you make 3 tokens, but need to block with two (y: 2). EOT you have 1 pegasus.
yT8: sac pegasus, land (8), pass.
mT8: land, make golem, swing 12; you need to full chump.
yT9: upkeep, make and sac pegasus. land (9; 7 untapped), pass.
mT9: land, golem, swing 15. GG ~ 6-0
if you try to chump block repeatedly instead of trading 3-to-1, then you lose one more pegasus each turn than the previous, while you only make an additional pegasus per turn every two turns.
if you try to race then you only get in 7 damage before losing.
OTD...
mT2: play Dragonlord
yT3: play Mesa
mT3: level up to 3, swing 2 (y: 18).
yT4: pegasus and sac on upkeep, land (2 untapped), pass.
mT4: level up to 7, swing 4, you make a pegasus and chump.
yT5: pegasus and sac on upkeep, land (3 untapped), pass.
mT5: level up to 8, swing 12 trample (y: 6). EOT you make a pegasus.
yT6: sac pegasus, land (6 untapped), pass.
mT6: swing 14 trample. GG ~ 6-0
I don't want to be mean, but come on. This one isn't even close.
If you don't want to score your rounds then at the very least you shouldn't blindly declare yourself the winner...
I'm pretty sure you also lose to Mayor of Avabruck.
EDIT: you also lose to Voidstone OTD
yeesh, Shouldn't have taken his scoring for granted.
If you don't want to score your rounds then at the very least you shouldn't blindly declare yourself the winner...
This is an entirely unnecessary accusation of bad faith, given Sizel has otherwise graded well in the past and made no particular brag about their (supposed) strong score. Lord knows I've made far sillier mistakes grading against 5-6 decks, let alone 14.
1A: 2-2 : Can kill every time I make. If you don't, I win, so you do.
1B: 0-6 : You create faster.
2A: 0-6 : Flip and out class the tokens
2B: 2-2 : Can kill every time I make. If you don't, I win, so you do.
3A: 0-6 : Outclass one token, stop the rest
3B: 6-0 : Time for 2+ tokens. Block+Attack, or Overrun.
4A: 0-6 : Don't flip. 4/4 beats 4x 1/1.
4B: 0-6 : Fly over 4+/1 races.
5A: 0-6 : Tokens faster and bigger
5B: 0-6 : Fly over, bigger, faster, stronger.
6A: 0-6 : You create faster.
6B: 0-6 : You hit the gnome with no more than 1 token out.
7A: 0-6 : Flip and out class the tokens
7B: 0-6 : Name gnome
8A: xxx
8B: xxx
8B: Nether Spirit
1A: 2-2 : Kill it, or swing into blocker every turn
1B: 0-6 : Pesky little pegusi
2A: 0-6 : Flip & overrun
2B: 2-2 : Kill it every turn to stall
3A: 0-6 : Gargoyle Races
3B: 2-2 : Infiblock
4A: 0-6 : No flip, 4/4 flyer races
4B: 0-6 : Pro-black / flying
5A: 0-6 : Tokens overrun
5B: 0-6 : Flying
6A: 0-6 : Pesky little pegusi
6B: 6-0 : You can't petrify a spirit! >_<
7A: 0-6 : Flip & overrun
7B: 4-1 : Either I swing first or hold a tie block
8A: xxx
8B: xxx
1A: 0-6 : Too Slow
1B: 4-1 : On Play (Mesa comes down on 3, 1 token on 4, turn 5 Gargolye locks out), on Draw, 3 tokens and Gargoyle stare at each other
2A: 0-6 : Too Slow
2B: 6-0 : Lockout and win
4A: 0-6 : Too slow/small
4B: 3-3 : Agreed on tradsies
5A: 0-6 : Too Slow
5B: 0-6 : Too Slow
6A: 4-1 : On Play (Mesa comes down on 3, 1 token on 4, turn 5 Gargolye locks out), on Draw, 3 tokens and Gargoyle stare at each other * This is a disagreement
6B: 6-0 : Turns off Vraska
7A: 0-6 : Too Slow
7B: 6-0 : On Draw he gets in 3 swings before I am down 20hp to 14, then I get in my 7th swing first
8A: 6-0 : Turns off and kills
8B: 6-0 : Bigger and outraces
This is an entirely unnecessary accusation of bad faith, given Sizel has otherwise graded well in the past and made no particular brag about their (supposed) strong score. Lord knows I've made far sillier mistakes grading against 5-6 decks, let alone 14.
I mean, unless they thought the horses were all 3/3's or something. It's pretty clear they didn't even consider the card they were against except insofar as whether or not that card prevented Sacred Mesa from making tokens altogether.
If you want to skim through the other hands and pick out the ones that are easy to determine on the spot then that's fine. But then you should come back later for the other ones. A lot of people take a prior declared score like that for granted, as evidenced by @Convoy_Avenger and many previous rounds I've been in.
The wording was overly harsh in hindsight, and I apologize for that, but it's not an unreasonable request.
Convoy, I would love to take a just win, but I don't.
Yes Sacred Mesa does slowly kill Pegasus's but on the play, you get out 1 on turn 4, then on turn 5 you make 2 more and choose to sacrifice the Mesa instead of a Pegasus, so you then achieve stall.
Convoy, I would love to take a just win, but I don't.
Yes Sacred Mesa does slowly kill Pegasus's but on the play, you get out 1 on turn 4, then on turn 5 you make 2 more and choose to sacrifice the Mesa instead of a Pegasus, so you then achieve stall.
Superbajt
7a) Mayor of Avabruck
7b) Phyrexian Revoker
My thinking for this hand was: Mayor is incredibly fast and resilient threat; It should sweep a majority of opponents. I chose Revoker as a second card, to deny a win to some powerful artifacts and planeswalkers I didn't think of. I knew it would lose to majority of field, but I thought that it could surprise some dangerous opponents. Well, apart from mirror, all cards that Mayor did not 6-0d, Revoker at least 2-2d. Turns out there was nothing really scary I'm really happy with this result.
NTheo
2a) Mayor of Avabruck - 2
2b) Kiku, Night's Flower - 0 Keep in hand to prevent flip, then you have anough time to kill first Alpha, then one or two wolves.
Danxor3
3a) Voidstone Gargoyle - 6
3b) Putrid Leech - 6 (you can't attack while I have two creatures, or I double block and kill Leech leaving me with win; I can wait and create enough creatures)
ManyCookies
4a) Nicol Bolas, the Ravager - 6
4b) Stillmoon Cavalier - 6 (killing by going wide)
Anachronity
5a) Hammer of Purphoros - 3
5b) Kargan Dragonlord - 6 (Too wide, too fast)
The Dragonlord and the Mayor both win by T6, but the Dragonlord comes out the turn after the mayor to delay him from transforming for 1 turn, OTP or OTD. This lets the Dragonlord race the Mayor and go 6-0.
Disagree with @Sizel regarding Sacred Mesa.
That's some awfully lazy scoring...
Many apologies: It was rushed, rather than lazy, but yeah - you're right.
Sorry to anyone else too - I'll try to edit my post if I spot disagreements as I'm catching up on the thread.
Edit: I think it's Dragonlord, Hammer and Mayor (twice)...
1CH LR
Land Rule: Basic Land Rule
Format Rule:
None! You may submit two hands for this round.
Convoy_Avenger
1a) Guul Draz Assassin
1b) Sacred Mesa
NTheo
2a) Mayor of Avabruck
2b) Kiku, Night's Flower
Danxor3
3a) Voidstone Gargoyle - Lockdown
3b) Putrid Leech - Beatdown
ManyCookies
4a) Nicol Bolas, the Ravager
4b) Stillmoon Cavalier
Anachronity
5a) Hammer of Purphoros
5b) Kargan Dragonlord
Sizel
6a) Sacred Mesa
6b) Vraska the Unseen
Superbajt
7a) Mayor of Avabruck
7b) Phyrexian Revoker
Feyd_Ruin
8a) Metrognome
8b) Nether Spirit
How to Submit
If you have any questions, just ask!
You can send a private message, or you can post in this thread. If you want to ask a question by private message, please note in your subject line that you haven't included your submission, because I want to respond to you quickly, and I don't review any submissions until I've chosen my own. I want to play, too!
Submission deadline: Tuesday, July 31st, 11:00 PM GMT
Rules and Banned List
Cards on the PHM Banned List are always banned, and cards on the Land Rule Banned List are banned as well when the round uses a Land Rule.
1. Overview
2. Game Rules
3. Hand Construction Rules
4. Entry
5. Perfect Hand Magic League (PHML)
6. Scoring
7. Variant Format Rules
1. Overview
Perfect Hand Magic (PHM) is a competitive strategy game for two or more players. It can be played using pencil and paper; however, it's most commonly played via an online forum. To play the game, each player secretly chooses a specified number of Magic cards which form their hand. Once all players have chosen hands, the hands are revealed and scored.
The object of the game is to choose the hand that will score the most points. The score for each hand is determined by the result that it would achieve if it were used to play two games of Magic – one match – against each competing hand; the rules for these theoretical games are covered in Section 2 – Game Rules. During each theoretical game, the player of each hand employs the strategy that maximizes the score for their hand, taking into account the strategy of their opponent(s).
A hand scores 3 points for each game that it would win, 0 points for each game that it would lose, and 1 point for each game that would end in a draw. However, a hand scores only 2 points for any match that would have a symmetrical result, regardless of whether the result would be two drawn games or a win for each hand.
The composition of a hand is limited only by a short banned list and a few restrictions on the game states that it can enable; these restrictions are covered in Section 3 – Hand Construction Rules.
2. Game Rules
2.1. Except for the changes described in these rules, games follow the rules for a normal game of Magic.
ii. Changes that would take effect at any other time take effect during the first round for which those rules have been in effect since the start of the round instead.
2.1b. Ignore any part of an instruction that isn't covered by these rules or by the rules of Magic.
2.2. A player's opening hand contains that player's chosen cards.
2.3. Players' libraries begin the game empty.
2.4. An effect that would produce a random result produces the result that least benefits the owner of the source of that effect instead.
2.5. Each player is the starting player for one game in each match.
2.6. Players know the identities of all face-down cards and all cards in hidden zones, and players know which decisions have been made by other players.
2.7. If a game would continue indefinitely, then the game is a draw.
2.8. If a loop containing at least one optional action would be repeated indefinitely during a turn, then any player may propose a number of times for that loop to repeat instead. If a player does, then each other player may propose a different number and the loop is repeated for the greatest number of times proposed instead. No player is required to make a choice that would end a loop that crosses multiple turns.
2.9. Cards can't be brought into the game from outside the game.
3. Hand Construction Rules
3.1. A player may not choose an opening hand that would enable them to achieve any of the following results before an opponent's second turn would end, such that that opponent could make no sequence of decisions that would not result in at least one of these results:
ii. Take an infinite number of turns.
iii. Cause a card to leave an opponent's hand.
Ignore this rule in the following cases:
3.1b. That player's hand would be legal if that player's opponents had no maximum hand size.
3.1c. That player could achieve one of these results only during a game that was restarted after an opponent's second turn had begun.
3.1d. All cards that would leave an opponent's hand during the resolution of an effect would be put onto the battlefield by that effect.
3.1e. All cards that would leave an opponent's hand during the resolution of an effect would be in that opponent's hand once that effect resolved.
3.2. A hand may contain any number of copies of any card legal in Vintage.
3.3. A hand may not contain any cards on the PHM Banned List.
4. Entry
4.1. A player plays a round of PHM by submitting a list of their chosen cards to the PHM moderator.
4.2. A player may change their hand until the posted deadline.
4.2b. The moderator also will try to notify a player if that player's hand doesn't enable that player to win the game against any possible hand.
4.3. A player may name their hand. If he or she doesn't, then the moderator may name it. The moderator may also rename a player's hand at their discretion.
5. Perfect Hand Magic League (PHML)
5.1. PHM League play consists of four rounds of PHM.
5.2. Each round, a player earns League points according to the following formula:
5.3. The player with the most League points at the end of League play is the PHM League winner.
6. Scoring
6.1. A table of match results is posted at the end of each round. Each row lists one player's result against each other player. A player's points and League points are tallied at the end of their row.
6.2. A player may earn bonus League points as specified by the PHM moderator.
6.3. Each player is responsible for determining the match results for their hand.
6.3b. An undetermined match result is counted as a loss for both players in that match.
6.3c. A player may challenge any result until the moderator announces that the result is final.
7. Variant Format Rules
7.1. Perfect Hand Magic has been played with hands typically containing between one and seven cards. Additionally, the Game Rules and Hand Construction Rules have been adapted to create hundreds of variant formats. Five commonly-played variants are described in Sections 7.3-7.7.
7.2. The rules of a variant format overwrite any other applicable rules.
7.2b. Some variant formats require a player to make some number of decisions in addition to or instead of submitting a hand. A player's submission must comply with the Hand Construction Rules, taking into account any decisions made at this time.
7.2c. Some variant formats require players to make decisions "before the start of each game". For these decisions, follow the "Active Player, Nonactive Player order" rule, replacing "active player" with "starting player".
7.3. Land Rule Variant.
ii. This is the extra land rule (ELR). Any player may play a basic land of their choice from outside the game any time he or she could normally play a land. Any player may play an additional land on each of their turns from their hand. A hand may not contain any cards on the Land Rule Banned List.
iii. This is the draw land rule (DLR). If a player would draw a card from an empty library, that player puts a basic land of their choice from outside the game into their hand instead. The starting player doesn't skip the draw step of their first turn. A hand may not contain any cards on the Land Rule Banned List.
7.3b. For all versions of the land rule variant, except as allowed by its owner, a basic land can't be caused to leave the battlefield, change control, or gain another card type by an effect of a source controlled by an opponent of its owner before its owner's second turn would end.
7.5. Life Rule (LF).
7.5b. Irrespective of rule 7.5a, a player must choose an opening hand that enables them to win both games of a match against at least one hand, such that the player of the losing hand could make no sequence of decisions that would not result in that player losing the game. The losing hand must conform with the Hand Construction Rules but need not consider this rule.
7.6. Backbuild.
7.7. (Bonus).
Beast Within________________________Beacon of Creation
Chancellor of the Annex_____________Black Lotus
Channel_____________________________Energy Field
Dark Depths_________________________Lion's Eye Diamond
Emrakul, the Aeons Torn_____________Maralen of the Mornsong
Fastbond____________________________Nezumi Shortfang
Flash_______________________________Red Sun's Zenith
Force of Will_______________________White Sun's Zenith
Ghost Quarter
Laboratory Maniac
Leyline of Anticipation
Leyline of Singularity
Leyline of the Meek
Magus of the Moon
Meddling Mage
Pact of Negation
Show and Tell
Strip Mine
The Rack
Trinisphere
Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
Wasteland
Channel_____________________________Black Lotus
Fastbond____________________________Lion's Eye Diamond
Flash
Show and Tell
Disruption
Beast Within________________________Balancing Act
Chancellor of the Annex_____________Energy Field
Force of Will
Leyline of Anticipation
Leyline of Singularity
Pact of Negation
Trinisphere
Lands
Ghost Quarter
Strip Mine
Wasteland
Win Conditions
Barren Glory________________________Beacon of Creation
Dark Depths_________________________Maralen of the Mornsong
Emrakul, the Aeons Torn_____________Nezumi Shortfang
Laboratory Maniac___________________Red Sun's Zenith
Leyline of the Meek_________________White Sun's Zenith
Magus of the Moon
Meddling Mage
The Rack
Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
Format Ideas?
Additional Resources
Follow me to be notified when weekly Perfect Hand Magic results are posted
Note you may submit two hands for this challenge, since the "hands" are so small. For obvious reasons those hands won't be graded against each other, and you'll receive the score of your best preforming hand (rather than adding scores together or something).
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- Rabid Wombat
On that note, I've been entirely slacking on grading past challenges. I would be incredibly thankful if anyone picked up my slack and graded some of the previous rounds, but if not I'll
stop being a lazy bumallocate some time later on this week to grade.Follow me to be notified when weekly Perfect Hand Magic results are posted
- Rabid Wombat
Follow me to be notified when weekly Perfect Hand Magic results are posted
4a | |
1a. 0-6
1b. 0-6
2a. 0-6
2b. 0-6
3a. 6-0
3b. 4-1. Putrid Leech kills turn 7, but would lose life 4 times to do so, and can't delay lest Bolas flips->kills->reanimate. With 8 life loss, Bolas also kills on turn 7. On the play I win, on the draw I can't race and so have to offer the trade.
4a. X
4b. X
5a. 0-6
5b. 0-6
6a. 0-6
6b. 6-0, Vraska gets discarded
7a. 0-6
7b. 6-0
8a. 6-0. Even if you discard, I still get the first swing in the 4 damage race.
8b. 6-0
4b | |
1a. 6-0. I sit back until I have 36 lands and one shot you. (This goes for any singular black/white creature)
1b. 6-0. I goldfish kill on turn 8, Mesa does not kill nearly that quickly.
2a. 0-6.
2b. 6-0. See 1a.
3a. 3-3. On the play I kill Turn 11 and you kill turn 12, on the draw you shut down the Stillmoon faster and win.
3b. 6-0, see 1a.
4a. X
4b. X
5a. 0-6
5b. 0-6
6a. 6-0, see 1b.
6b. 3-3.
On the play I ignore Vraska and kill you T8 before she can ult. On the draw I thow an attack at Vraska for 5, which puts her back three turns, then swing at you well before you can kill me.Whoops wrong Vraska. We both goldfish on T8 and can't interact, so player who goes first wins.7a. 0-6
7b. 2-2. The 2/Xs stare at each other angrily.
8a. 6-0, I way outrace this with flying.
8b. 6-0
Does Vraska not kill the Cavalier?
Protection doesn't save him, as the +1 is not Targeted?
6a) Sacred Mesa
6 wins, 2 draws, 6 loses.
Vs 1a) Guul Draz Assassin
Win: Can make tokens too fast for Assassin to keep up.
Vs 1b) Sacred Mesa
Draw: Snap!
Vs 2a) Mayor of Avabruk
Loss: Agree with Convoy_Avenger: Didn't allow for the play of holding back the Mayor and sending in tokens to kill 3 blockers at a time
Vs 2b) Kiku, Night’s Flower
Win: Can make tokens too fast for Kiku to keep up
Vs 3a) Voidstone Gargoyle
Draw: Gargoyle shuts off my ability to produce more tokens. But I have at least 3, which meas I can block & kill Gargoyle.
Vs 3b) Putrid Leach
Win: Can make tokens too fast for Leach to keep up
Vs 4a) Nicol Bolas, the Ravager
Win: Can make tokens too fast for Bolas to keep up
Vs 4b) Stillmoon Cavalier
Loose: Prot White means I can’t chump block. Can’t race either.
Vs 5a) Hammer of Purphoros
Loose: Hammer tokens too big for me
Vs 5b) Kargan Dragonlord
Loose: Dragonlord tramples
Vs 7a) Mayor of Avabruk
Loss: Agree with Convoy_Avenger: Didn't allow for the play of holding back the Mayor and sending in tokens to kill 3 blockers at a time
Vs 7b) Phyrexian Revoker
Lose: I can’t make tokens
Vs 8a) Metrognome
Win: Can make tokens too fast for Gnomes to keep up
Vs 8b) Nether Spirit
Win: Can make tokens too fast for Spirit to keep up
6b) Vraska the Unseen
5 wins, 2 draws, 7 loses.
Vs 1a) Guul Draz Assassin
Win: Vraska’s -3 kills Assassin, ultimate for the win..
Vs 1b) Sacred Mesa
Loose: Loose: Too many tokens, too quickly
Vs 2a) Mayor of Avabruk
Loose: Tokens beat down Vraska
Vs 2b) Kiku, Night’s Flower
Win: Vraska’s -3 kills Kiku, ultimate for the win..
Vs 3a) Voidstone Gargoyle
Loose: Gargoyle shuts down Vraska
Vs 3b) Putrid Leach
Win: Vraska’s -3 kills Leach, ultimate for the win..
Vs 4a) Nicol Bolas, the Ravager
Loose: Discard Vraska
Vs 4b) Stillmoon Cavalier
Draw: Stillmoon attacks Vraska and both die.
Vs 5a) Hammer of Purphoros
Loose: Vraska either dies to 1 token per turn, then you just make more tokens to kill me…
OR Vraska’s -3 kills Hammer, but existing Golem kills her, then kills me.
Vs 5b) Kargan Dragonlord
Win: Vraska’s -3
Vs 7a) Mayor of Avabruk
Loose: Tokens beat down Vraska
Vs 7b) Phyrexian Revoker
Lose: I can’t activate loyalty abilities
Vs 8a) Metrognome
Win: Vraska -3 the Card, then +1’s or -3 kill remaining Gnome.
Vs 8b) Nether Spirit
Draw: Vraska ticks up by 2 every 2 turns, Spirit attacks for 2 every 2 turns. Neither of us can progress.
1a) Guul Draz Assassin
8 Wins - 3 loses - 3 Draws
2a) Mayor of Avabruck - 6-0, I delay casting for a turn to prevent a flip, then get big enough to kill Mayor before he causes me any problems.
2b) Kiku, Night's Flower - 6-0. I kill it before it kills me
Danxor3
3a) Voidstone Gargoyle - 6-0 I'm a 4/4 by the time it comes down, so I can just race.
3b) Putrid Leech - 6-0 I race it successfully
ManyCookies
4a) Nicol Bolas, the Ravager - 6-0, I race it successfully
4b) Stillmoon Cavalier - oof. 0-6
Anachronity
5a) Hammer of Purphoros - 3-3 I kill your tokens as fast as you can make them, or you chump for days
5b) Kargan Dragonlord - 6-0, I kill him on turn 3, before he's out of range
Sizel
6a) Sacred Mesa - 0-6 Just starts chumping me
6b) Vraska the Unseen - 0-6, I'm surprised Vraska didn't do better.
Superbajt
7a) Mayor of Avabruck - 6-0, see above
7b) Phyrexian Revoker - 3-3, stare at each other
Feyd_Ruin
8a) Metrognome - wtf is this card? 3-3, trade for days.
8b) Nether Spirit - 6-0, I get to attack every other turn, he doesn't come back quickly enough to be a threat. (I kill him EoT, attack, he comes back, I do nothing, kill him EoT, attack, etc)
1b) Sacred Mesa (re-do)
5 Wins - 7 Loses - 2 Draw
2b) Kiku, Night's Flower - 6-0 Can't keep up
Danxor3
3a) Voidstone Gargoyle - 0-6 - Gargoyle just beats this hand, straight up. Need to sac a pegasus every turn, and can't activate to make more.
3b) Putrid Leech - 6-0 I race it successfully
ManyCookies
4a) Nicol Bolas, the Ravager - 6-0, I race it successfully
4b) Stillmoon Cavalier - 0-6. Pro white is good.
Anachronity
5a) Hammer of Purphoros - 0-6 - Same deal with Mayor, just becomes overwhelming to the point I can't make enough chumpers
5b) Kargan Dragonlord - 0-6 Firebreathing Trampler is good
Sizel
6a) Sacred Mesa - 2-2
6b) Vraska the Unseen - 2-2. OTP, Mesa makes enough tokens to finish Vraska off after destroying Mesa, OTD, Vraska can kill it, and have enough loyalty left to survive the swing back.
Superbajt
7a) Mayor of Avabruck - 0-6 see above
7b) Phyrexian Revoker - 0-6, stops Mesa
Feyd_Ruin
8a) Metrognome - wtf is this card? 6-0, I make tokens faster
8b) Nether Spirit - 6-0, I win that race
That's some awfully lazy scoring...
Convoy_Avenger
1a) Guul Draz Assassin: Assassin slits the throats of all my metal men, but can't attack without my board building up. ~ 2-2
1b) Sacred Mesa: 6-0; see below
NTheo
2a) Mayor of Avabruck: Mayor wins OTP because he flips in time for next turn. Loses OTD because my hammer delays him flipping for a turn. ~ 3-3
2b) Kiku, Night's Flower: Kiku draws it OTP, but loses OTD because my golems have haste. ~ 4-1
Danxor3
3a) Voidstone Gargoyle: I swing first, so you can't race me. If you block with the Gargoyle then I can just make more golems. ~ 6-0
3b) Putrid Leech: after turn 4 OTD I can chump until the leech kills you, or build up and swing if you stop attacking. ~ 6-0
ManyCookies
4a) Nicol Bolas, the Ravager: I race you. ~ 6-0
4b) Stillmoon Cavalier: my golems are neither white nor black. ~ 6-0
Sizel
6a) Sacred Mesa: 6-0; see below
6b) Vraska the Unseen: As stated, Vraska blows up my hammer and dies to a golem, or just dies to many golems. ~ 6-0
Superbajt
7a) Mayor of Avabruck: see vs. NTheo above. ~ 3-3
7b) Phyrexian Revoker: My hammer license is revoked. ~ 0-6
Feyd_Ruin
8a) Metrognome: I also thought about discard, but this seems a bit drastic. ~ 6-0
8b) Nether Spirit: same story. ~ 6-0
this looks like the better hand.
1a) Guul Draz Assassin: Assassin ganks the Dragonlord before he can grow up big and strong. ~ 0-6
1b) Sacred Mesa: 6-0; see below
NTheo
2a) Mayor of Avabruck: Dragonlord comes out the turn after the mayor to delay him, and then outraces. ~ 6-0
2b) Kiku, Night's Flower: Kiku kills the angry man on the dragon. ~ 0-6
Danxor3
3a) Voidstone Gargoyle: Dragonlord is already at least a 4/4 flyer when the Gargoyle comes down. ~ 6-0
3b) Putrid Leech: Leech isn't fast enough. ~ 6-0
ManyCookies
4a) Nicol Bolas, the Ravager: Bolas isn't fast enough to discard the Dragonlord, and can't transform before I win. ~ 6-0
4b) Stillmoon Cavalier: The Dragonlord is not white or black, and easily races. ~ 6-0
Sizel
6a) Sacred Mesa: 6-0; see below
6b) Vraska the Unseen: As stated, Vraska kersplodes the boy and his dragon. ~ 0-6
Superbajt
7a) Mayor of Avabruck: see above ~ 6-0
7b) Phyrexian Revoker: Revoker keeps the Dragonlord from leveling, and so we draw with a 2/1 and a 2/2. ~ 2-2
Feyd_Ruin
8a) Metrognome: Dragonlord outraces the gnome apocalypse. ~ 6-0
8b) Nether Spirit: Dragonlord flies over the recurring blocker. ~ 6-0
OTD...
yT3: play Mesa
mT3: play Hammer
yT4: upkeep, make pegasus in response and sac it. Play land.
mT4: land, make golem, swing 3 (y: 17). EOT you make a pegasus.
yT5: sac pegasus, land, pass.
mT5: land, make golem, swing 6 (y: 11). EOT you make 2 pegasus tokens.
yT6: sac pegasus, land (6 lands), pass (1 pegasus).
mT6: land, make golem, swing 9; you make 2 tokens and triple-block, taking 6 (y: 5). EOT you make another pegasus.
yT7: sac pegasus, land (7), pass.
mT7: land, make golem, swing 9; you make 3 tokens, but need to block with two (y: 2). EOT you have 1 pegasus.
yT8: sac pegasus, land (8), pass.
mT8: land, make golem, swing 12; you need to full chump.
yT9: upkeep, make and sac pegasus. land (9; 7 untapped), pass.
mT9: land, golem, swing 15. GG ~ 6-0
if you try to chump block repeatedly instead of trading 3-to-1, then you lose one more pegasus each turn than the previous, while you only make an additional pegasus per turn every two turns.
if you try to race then you only get in 7 damage before losing.
5b) Kargan Dragonlord
OTD...
mT2: play Dragonlord
yT3: play Mesa
mT3: level up to 3, swing 2 (y: 18).
yT4: pegasus and sac on upkeep, land (2 untapped), pass.
mT4: level up to 7, swing 4, you make a pegasus and chump.
yT5: pegasus and sac on upkeep, land (3 untapped), pass.
mT5: level up to 8, swing 12 trample (y: 6). EOT you make a pegasus.
yT6: sac pegasus, land (6 untapped), pass.
mT6: swing 14 trample. GG ~ 6-0
I don't want to be mean, but come on. This one isn't even close.
If you don't want to score your rounds then at the very least you shouldn't blindly declare yourself the winner...
I'm pretty sure you also lose to Mayor of Avabruck.
EDIT: you also lose to Voidstone OTD
- Rabid Wombat
yeesh, Shouldn't have taken his scoring for granted.
This is an entirely unnecessary accusation of bad faith, given Sizel has otherwise graded well in the past and made no particular brag about their (supposed) strong score. Lord knows I've made far sillier mistakes grading against 5-6 decks, let alone 14.
Agreed. Let's please remain civil.
-Feyd
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1A: 2-2 : Can kill every time I make. If you don't, I win, so you do.
1B: 0-6 : You create faster.
2A: 0-6 : Flip and out class the tokens
2B: 2-2 : Can kill every time I make. If you don't, I win, so you do.
3A: 0-6 : Outclass one token, stop the rest
3B: 6-0 : Time for 2+ tokens. Block+Attack, or Overrun.
4A: 0-6 : Don't flip. 4/4 beats 4x 1/1.
4B: 0-6 : Fly over 4+/1 races.
5A: 0-6 : Tokens faster and bigger
5B: 0-6 : Fly over, bigger, faster, stronger.
6A: 0-6 : You create faster.
6B: 0-6 : You hit the gnome with no more than 1 token out.
7A: 0-6 : Flip and out class the tokens
7B: 0-6 : Name gnome
8A: xxx
8B: xxx
8B: Nether Spirit
1A: 2-2 : Kill it, or swing into blocker every turn
1B: 0-6 : Pesky little pegusi
2A: 0-6 : Flip & overrun
2B: 2-2 : Kill it every turn to stall
3A: 0-6 : Gargoyle Races
3B: 2-2 : Infiblock
4A: 0-6 : No flip, 4/4 flyer races
4B: 0-6 : Pro-black / flying
5A: 0-6 : Tokens overrun
5B: 0-6 : Flying
6A: 0-6 : Pesky little pegusi
6B: 6-0 : You can't petrify a spirit! >_<
7A: 0-6 : Flip & overrun
7B: 4-1 : Either I swing first or hold a tie block
8A: xxx
8B: xxx
No longer staff here.
0 4 0 6 X X 0 3 0 0 4 6 0 6 6 6 | 41
1A: 0-6 : Too Slow
1B: 4-1 : On Play (Mesa comes down on 3, 1 token on 4, turn 5 Gargolye locks out), on Draw, 3 tokens and Gargoyle stare at each other
2A: 0-6 : Too Slow
2B: 6-0 : Lockout and win
4A: 0-6 : Too slow/small
4B: 3-3 : Agreed on tradsies
5A: 0-6 : Too Slow
5B: 0-6 : Too Slow
6A: 4-1 : On Play (Mesa comes down on 3, 1 token on 4, turn 5 Gargolye locks out), on Draw, 3 tokens and Gargoyle stare at each other * This is a disagreement
6B: 6-0 : Turns off Vraska
7A: 0-6 : Too Slow
7B: 6-0 : On Draw he gets in 3 swings before I am down 20hp to 14, then I get in my 7th swing first
8A: 6-0 : Turns off and kills
8B: 6-0 : Bigger and outraces
3B: Putrid Leech
1A: 0-6 : Lose
1B: 0-6 : Lose
2A: 0-6 : Lose
2B: 0-6 : Lose
4A: 0-6 : Lose
4B: 0-6 : Lose
5A: 0-6 : Lose
5B: 0-6 : Lose
6A: 0-6 : Lose
6B: 0-6 : Lose
7A: 0-6 : Lose
7B: 2-2 : Trade / Stall
8A: 0-6 : Lose
8B: 2-2 : Staring contest
If you want to skim through the other hands and pick out the ones that are easy to determine on the spot then that's fine. But then you should come back later for the other ones. A lot of people take a prior declared score like that for granted, as evidenced by @Convoy_Avenger and many previous rounds I've been in.
The wording was overly harsh in hindsight, and I apologize for that, but it's not an unreasonable request.
- Rabid Wombat
@Feyd we disagree on Nether Spirit, see my comment for Assassin (Same applies for Kiku)
@Danxor3 we disagree on Mesa, you actually just win. Mesa doesn't keep the pegasi around.
Yes Sacred Mesa does slowly kill Pegasus's but on the play, you get out 1 on turn 4, then on turn 5 you make 2 more and choose to sacrifice the Mesa instead of a Pegasus, so you then achieve stall.
I never even thought of that line of play. Derp.
7a) Mayor of Avabruck
7b) Phyrexian Revoker
My thinking for this hand was: Mayor is incredibly fast and resilient threat; It should sweep a majority of opponents. I chose Revoker as a second card, to deny a win to some powerful artifacts and planeswalkers I didn't think of. I knew it would lose to majority of field, but I thought that it could surprise some dangerous opponents. Well, apart from mirror, all cards that Mayor did not 6-0d, Revoker at least 2-2d. Turns out there was nothing really scary I'm really happy with this result.
1a) Guul Draz Assassin - 0, I think.
1b) Sacred Mesa - 6
NTheo
2a) Mayor of Avabruck - 2
2b) Kiku, Night's Flower - 0 Keep in hand to prevent flip, then you have anough time to kill first Alpha, then one or two wolves.
Danxor3
3a) Voidstone Gargoyle - 6
3b) Putrid Leech - 6 (you can't attack while I have two creatures, or I double block and kill Leech leaving me with win; I can wait and create enough creatures)
ManyCookies
4a) Nicol Bolas, the Ravager - 6
4b) Stillmoon Cavalier - 6 (killing by going wide)
Anachronity
5a) Hammer of Purphoros - 3
5b) Kargan Dragonlord - 6 (Too wide, too fast)
Sizel
6a) Sacred Mesa - 6
6b) Vraska the Unseen - 6
Feyd_Ruin
8a) Metrognome - 6
8b) Nether Spirit - 6
Convoy_Avenger
1a) Guul Draz Assassin - 2
1b) Sacred Mesa - 6
NTheo
2a) Mayor of Avabruck - 0
2b) Kiku, Night's Flower - 2
Danxor3
3a) Voidstone Gargoyle - 0 (barely fast enough on play)
3b) Putrid Leech - 2
ManyCookies
4a) Nicol Bolas, the Ravager - 0
4b) Stillmoon Cavalier - 2
Anachronity
5a) Hammer of Purphoros - 6
5b) Kargan Dragonlord - 2
Sizel
6a) Sacred Mesa - 6
6b) Vraska the Unseen - 6
Feyd_Ruin
8a) Metrognome - 6
8b) Nether Spirit - 0
The Dragonlord and the Mayor both win by T6, but the Dragonlord comes out the turn after the mayor to delay him from transforming for 1 turn, OTP or OTD. This lets the Dragonlord race the Mayor and go 6-0.
- Rabid Wombat
Many apologies: It was rushed, rather than lazy, but yeah - you're right.
Sorry to anyone else too - I'll try to edit my post if I spot disagreements as I'm catching up on the thread.
Edit: I think it's Dragonlord, Hammer and Mayor (twice)...
- Rabid Wombat