I don't believe that most people see a peck on the cheek, a well timed kiss or hand holding as offensive or pandering.
But that's the point, though. Gay people publicly making out or holding hands many times results in people reacting differently than straight people doing the same.
A common example is adult lap sitting. Its awkward to see an adult woman sitting in a mans lap at the bar. That is inappropriate behavior.
Why?
I don't know what country we're discussing, but if this is the US, and it's not like, I don't know, an expensive bar, and it's a couple, who cares?
I absolutely agree that there are gay people who take displays of affection too far, just as there are in any group. However, I must disagree with this:
I don't believe that most people see a peck on the cheek, a well timed kiss or hand holding as offensive or pandering.
I would argue that it depends on where you are. I live in a deeply conservative, very religious area. I've personally been jeered for holding my boyfriend's hand in public. I had great service at a restaurant until the server saw me kiss my boyfriend on the cheek as he sat down (he was slightly late because of car troubles). Afterwards we received horrible service, only seeing our waiter once in an hour's timeframe despite the building being almost empty.
I imagine that in larger cities or more accepting areas that this is less likely to happen, but in smaller towns and more religious areas (which is a large chunk of America) these things are commonplace. Most people don't notice, since it doesn't happen to them, but it's definitely there.
The commercial deal is a bit more complicated. I understand that there is often an agenda at work in the commercials. However, every commercial has an agenda: to get you to buy their stuff. The methods have evolved over the years, but it's always there. My problem is that some people don't realize this and view anything deviating from a straight, white male (or female depending on the product being marketed, but usually male) is somehow pandering or pushing an agenda while simultaneously ignoring (or perhaps not realizing) the fact that commercials with said straight, white male as the protagonist are the most pandering commercials there are.
Shifting gears slightly, even today commercials with non-white couples (or, god forbid, an interracial couple) are seen as pandering or pushing some nefarious liberal agenda, despite the growing non-white population in America. Cheerios released a commercial last year (if I remember correctly) featuring an interracial couple that received serious blowback for something so benign. Ads featuring gay couples often fall into this category, with people not realizing that the agenda at play is merely to appeal to a slightly different audience and get said audience to purchase their things.
That's why I have such a problem with this. Some people go into a rage whenever a non-straight person is featured in anything and see it as pandering or pushing an agenda, no matter how tastefully done or if it fits the plot/narrative (in the case of a movie or book). Anything that deviates from the default is seen as bad and threatening.
I absolutely agree that there are gay people who take displays of affection too far, just as there are in any group. However, I must disagree with this:
I don't believe that most people see a peck on the cheek, a well timed kiss or hand holding as offensive or pandering.
I would argue that it depends on where you are. I live in a deeply conservative, very religious area. I've personally been jeered for holding my boyfriend's hand in public. I had great service at a restaurant until the server saw me kiss my boyfriend on the cheek as he sat down (he was slightly late because of car troubles). Afterwards we received horrible service, only seeing our waiter once in an hour's timeframe despite the building being almost empty.
I imagine that in larger cities or more accepting areas that this is less likely to happen, but in smaller towns and more religious areas (which is a large chunk of America) these things are commonplace. Most people don't notice, since it doesn't happen to them, but it's definitely there.
The commercial deal is a bit more complicated. I understand that there is often an agenda at work in the commercials. However, every commercial has an agenda: to get you to buy their stuff. The methods have evolved over the years, but it's always there. My problem is that some people don't realize this and view anything deviating from a straight, white male (or female depending on the product being marketed, but usually male) is somehow pandering or pushing an agenda while simultaneously ignoring (or perhaps not realizing) the fact that commercials with said straight, white male as the protagonist are the most pandering commercials there are.
Shifting gears slightly, even today commercials with non-white couples (or, god forbid, an interracial couple) are seen as pandering or pushing some nefarious liberal agenda, despite the growing non-white population in America. Cheerios released a commercial last year (if I remember correctly) featuring an interracial couple that received serious blowback for something so benign. Ads featuring gay couples often fall into this category, with people not realizing that the agenda at play is merely to appeal to a slightly different audience and get said audience to purchase their things.
That's why I have such a problem with this. Some people go into a rage whenever a non-straight person is featured in anything and see it as pandering or pushing an agenda, no matter how tastefully done or if it fits the plot/narrative (in the case of a movie or book). Anything that deviates from the default is seen as bad and threatening.
I too enjoyed your post, so thank you for that.
Thank you! I'm glad to hear it.
That's interesting. I live in a mostly white city with above average incomes, but you don't really see racism or bigotry until you visit the lower income housing or dive bars. The people here have a solid sense of community; if you're here, you're here for the same reasons we are. We "read" about the race war in America. What you see here is mostly reverse racism if you can believe that. But its very fair to say that since I'm a straight white male (oh god I just labeled myself) that it might be there, and I simply don't experience it myself.
You would definitely experience it if you drove out to the country - Ohio has its fair share of good 'ol boys and simpletons.
And I feel the same way about the scene in commercials! Why does EVERYONE have to have a spotless, immaculate beautiful home? If the commercial had two men making dinner together, I'd think that's ridiculous - did they JUST BUY that house? Obviously no children there.. I get to the end of the house, and the first room I painted needs a fresh paint.
But that's the point, though. Gay people publicly making out or holding hands many times results in people reacting differently than straight people doing the same.
A common example is adult lap sitting. Its awkward to see an adult woman sitting in a mans lap at the bar. That is inappropriate behavior.
Why?
I don't know what country we're discussing, but if this is the US, and it's not like, I don't know, an expensive bar, and it's a couple, who cares?
Holding hands and making out are two different things. We'll talk about making out. Its really silly to split hairs over whether an action thats disrespectful to everyone around them is MORE or LESS offensive based on their sexuality. But yes, when its same sex it comes with an added 'shock' factor because its pulling people out of their element. I don't think that can be changed - its just not commonplace enough to make everyone comfortable with it at all times.
Bars...
Well yes we tend to stick to higher end places - martini bars and cocktail lounges, as there are more like-minded people we can associate with, and less plaid covered ruffians looking for the first excuse they can find to start a physical confrontation. We do frequent one hole in the wall, as our mixed drinks are $2.50 during happy hour and we know people there. There you will see more racism and bigotry - its a direct correlation. But even there, word would travel fast if two people of any sex were making out in the back room. My only concern here is that with so many CCW now, and people who ignore the CCW laws - what used to be a ruffian fist fight outside of the bar might someday become a ruffian shooting, but thats a whole different topic I think. Best course of action is to be polite to everyone =)
Trump's looking awful in this debate. They're not attacking each other, and without attacks he's forced to actually confront the questions, and he doesn't have answers to them.
Hoping this results in people finally wising up to him.
*Blinks* Holy *****, someone won a debate on the internet.
That make me really happy. Nice work, MrM0nd4y. And nice work, Infallible, as well.
Lol I told you last night I could be reasoned with and have my views changed. It happens literally all the time. I'm wrong ALL the damn time. You don't become a smarter and better person by rejecting all criticism and doubling down the moment your argument starts to fall apart. I had a bit too much to drink last night. After re reading the last few pages I felt like an idiot. And thanks for the compliment.
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Mhjames: mtgsalvation: I DON'T SEE HOW THIS CARD IS GOOD. I KNOW PATRICK CHAPIN USED IT AND WENT 8-0, BUT THAT WAS A SMALL TOURNAMENT. THE CARD IS TOO SLOW. YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE THE OPPONENT HAS A SPELL IN THE GRAVEYARD
Trump's looking awful in this debate. They're not attacking each other, and without attacks he's forced to actually confront the questions, and he doesn't have answers to them.
Hoping this results in people finally wising up to him.
I unfortunately just got off work and missed it. That was an amazing closing statement, however.
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Mhjames: mtgsalvation: I DON'T SEE HOW THIS CARD IS GOOD. I KNOW PATRICK CHAPIN USED IT AND WENT 8-0, BUT THAT WAS A SMALL TOURNAMENT. THE CARD IS TOO SLOW. YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE THE OPPONENT HAS A SPELL IN THE GRAVEYARD
Trump's looking awful in this debate. They're not attacking each other, and without attacks he's forced to actually confront the questions, and he doesn't have answers to them.
Hoping this results in people finally wising up to him.
I think a lot of people are already too heavily invested in his rhetoric now to turn back. I would love to think that people might be able to see him for the fraud he is but I doubt it.
Its a real shame that some of the more acceptable candidates got cut out of this race by his antics otherwise we may have had a real competition instead of the literal definition of "lesser of two evils."
I think a lot of people are already too heavily invested in his rhetoric now to turn back. I would love to think that people might be able to see him for the fraud he is but I doubt it.
I don't know. Trump wasn't the guy dominating the debate with his attacks and snide comments this time around. This wasn't the Trump circus, this was an actual debate.
I think most Trump supporters are too far gone to care. But I'm really hoping that now that people are actually viewing Trump as a candidate as opposed to a media fiasco they might actually regard him with some scrutiny.
Basically comes down to Ohio and Floria. Once again, I firmly back Kasich as the clear best choice of the bunch. Hopefully Kasich can get Ohio. If he can't, then it's over, but if he can, Trump and Cruz might just be able to be boxed out.
Its a real shame that some of the more acceptable candidates got cut out of this race by his antics otherwise we may have had a real competition instead of the literal definition of "lesser of two evils."
Yeah, I would be depressed if it does end up being a battle between Trump and Cruz as to which would be the bigger disaster of a candidate. (It's still Cruz.)
Lol I told you last night I could be reasoned with and have my views changed. It happens literally all the time. I'm wrong ALL the damn time. You don't become a smarter and better person by rejecting all criticism and doubling down the moment your argument starts to fall apart. I had a bit too much to drink last night. After re reading the last few pages I felt like an idiot. And thanks for the compliment.
Of course. It takes a bold person to admit being wrong.
I'm hoping you'll end up admitting that you're wrong about the Trump thing, hopefully before Tuesday.
Of course. It takes a bold person to admit being wrong.
I'm hoping you'll end up admitting that you're wrong about the Trump thing, hopefully before Tuesday.
That's highly unlikely. In order for me to ever jump ship from Trump I would have to like another candidate enough. Unless Kasich starts mounting the most impressive come back in election history, I'm with Trump until the end. I despise Hillary and Bernie for obvious reasons.
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Mhjames: mtgsalvation: I DON'T SEE HOW THIS CARD IS GOOD. I KNOW PATRICK CHAPIN USED IT AND WENT 8-0, BUT THAT WAS A SMALL TOURNAMENT. THE CARD IS TOO SLOW. YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE THE OPPONENT HAS A SPELL IN THE GRAVEYARD
I don't know. Trump wasn't the guy dominating the debate with his attacks and snide comments this time around. This wasn't the Trump circus, this was an actual debate.
I'll be sure to catch the highlights later. I missed this one live.
Trump's looking awful in this debate. They're not attacking each other, and without attacks he's forced to actually confront the questions, and he doesn't have answers to them.
Hoping this results in people finally wising up to him.
Reading someone else's recap now. Apparently it was amazingly civil compared to previous debates. I see speculation that the RNC had a chat with all of them before the debate, told them to behave, and threatened something they actually took seriously.
It sounds like Trump proposed a trade war, why am I not surprised? Kasich supports renewable energy, though, one for your guy there!
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If Frozen Solid is not reprinted, you are aware that I'm quoting you in my sig for eternity?
Trump's looking awful in this debate. They're not attacking each other, and without attacks he's forced to actually confront the questions, and he doesn't have answers to them.
Hoping this results in people finally wising up to him.
Reading someone else's recap now. Apparently it was amazingly civil compared to previous debates. I see speculation that the RNC had a chat with all of them before the debate, told them to behave, and threatened something they actually took seriously.
It sounds like Trump proposed a trade war, why am I not surprised? Kasich supports renewable energy, though, one for your guy there!
Considering last week being a massive media fiasco that got him a TON of attention, and considering a lot of people get their information from these debates, it's pretty reasonable to assume the reason he was so civil tonight and acted like an actual candidate and not a bully for once is to appeal to people who don't know a ton about him. Online polls are showing him winning that debate by a 30% margin vs El Rato and Roboto and Mr Kasich.
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Mhjames: mtgsalvation: I DON'T SEE HOW THIS CARD IS GOOD. I KNOW PATRICK CHAPIN USED IT AND WENT 8-0, BUT THAT WAS A SMALL TOURNAMENT. THE CARD IS TOO SLOW. YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE THE OPPONENT HAS A SPELL IN THE GRAVEYARD
Considering last week being a massive media fiasco that got him a TON of attention, and considering a lot of people get their information from these debates, it's pretty reasonable to assume the reason he was so civil tonight and acted like an actual candidate and not a bully for once is to appeal to people who don't know a ton about him. Online polls are showing him winning that debate by a 30% margin vs El Rato and Roboto and Mr Kasich.
If the recap I'm reading is accurate, he claimed that GDP was zero for the last two quarters, and seems to want to amend the Geneva conventions to allow actions that are currently war crimes. "Now, we have to obey the laws, OK, but we have to expand those laws because we have to be able to fight on at least somewhat of an equal footing or we will never, ever knock out ISIS and all of the others that are so bad. We better expand our laws or we’re being a bunch of suckers and they are laughing at us. They are laughing at us. Believe me." How did he win this debate?
Heck, even Rubio had a sudden rush of brains to the head: "I’m not interested in being politically correct; I’m interested in being correct … We are going to have to work with people of the Muslim faith, even as Islam faces a crisis within [itself]."
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I am willing to bet my collection that Frozen and Solid are not on the same card. For example, Frozen Tomb and Solid Wall.
If Frozen Solid is not reprinted, you are aware that I'm quoting you in my sig for eternity?
Considering last week being a massive media fiasco that got him a TON of attention, and considering a lot of people get their information from these debates, it's pretty reasonable to assume the reason he was so civil tonight and acted like an actual candidate and not a bully for once is to appeal to people who don't know a ton about him.
It's because he lost support from that debate. So did Rubio. The caustic nature of the debate turned people off, while meanwhile Kasich benefited.
It's also doubtless because of all the negative publicity surrounding the party as a whole. They recognize that if they continue to squabble like children, the whole party is brought down. Hell, the headlines were about how disgusted everyone was with the performances of the non-Kasich participants.
If the recap I'm reading is accurate, he claimed that GDP was zero for the last two quarters, and seems to want to amend the Geneva conventions to allow actions that are currently war crimes. "Now, we have to obey the laws, OK, but we have to expand those laws because we have to be able to fight on at least somewhat of an equal footing or we will never, ever knock out ISIS and all of the others that are so bad. We better expand our laws or we’re being a bunch of suckers and they are laughing at us. They are laughing at us. Believe me."
Yes, the man looked like a total moron. But even that wasn't as bad as his repetition of, "We need to make a good deal," with regards to Cuba. Rubio hammered him with regards to that.
How did he win this debate?
Well the thing is that Donald Trump has a tremendous advantage: his supporters don't care about facts or coherent thought. Donald Trump doesn't have to make sense or say intelligent things. He just has to be Donald Trump and he'll get votes. It's celebrity presidency.
Considering last week being a massive media fiasco that got him a TON of attention, and considering a lot of people get their information from these debates, it's pretty reasonable to assume the reason he was so civil tonight and acted like an actual candidate and not a bully for once is to appeal to people who don't know a ton about him.
Maybe that's the reason, but I don't think so. The reason he (and everyone else) was civil tonight is because the GOP has capitulated. The party elites have made a truce with Trump. It's the most logical explanation.
They'll still try and stop him of course. Rubio will drop out and Kasich and Cruz will try to come up with enough wins to take it to the convention, but tonight signals that the fighting is over.
In order to try and stop the party from imploding, I think the GOP has agreed call off the dogs and will fully support him as the nominee if he wins.
Considering last week being a massive media fiasco that got him a TON of attention, and considering a lot of people get their information from these debates, it's pretty reasonable to assume the reason he was so civil tonight and acted like an actual candidate and not a bully for once is to appeal to people who don't know a ton about him.
Maybe that's the reason, but I don't think so. The reason he (and everyone else) was civil tonight is because the GOP has capitulated. The party elites have made a truce with Trump. It's the most logical explanation.
They'll still try and stop him of course. Rubio will drop out and Kasich and Cruz will try to come up with enough wins to take it to the convention, but tonight signals that the fighting is over.
In order to try and stop the party from imploding, I think the GOP has agreed call off the dogs and will fully support him as the nominee if he wins.
When he wins, you mean. He'll surely get the most delegates. I fear a brokered convention if he doesn't win the required majority, though. There's no quicker way to get tens of millions of Americans to vote Democrat or not vote in protest than to screw the front runner out of the primary.
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Cockatrice: Infallible
Mhjames: mtgsalvation: I DON'T SEE HOW THIS CARD IS GOOD. I KNOW PATRICK CHAPIN USED IT AND WENT 8-0, BUT THAT WAS A SMALL TOURNAMENT. THE CARD IS TOO SLOW. YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE THE OPPONENT HAS A SPELL IN THE GRAVEYARD
When he wins, you mean. He'll surely get the most delegates. I fear a brokered convention if he doesn't win the required majority, though. There's no quicker way to get tens of millions of Americans to vote Democrat or not vote in protest than to screw the front runner out of the primary.
From that frame of mind, why should anyone in the 60-70% of the people who are not Trump supporters vote for Trump in the election if he is the candidate?
Personally, I see nothing wrong or unfair about a brokered convention. The fact of the matter is you can't declare yourself the victor without the majority of delegates. You don't just get to declare yourself the winner. You have to actually win.
When he wins, you mean. He'll surely get the most delegates. I fear a brokered convention if he doesn't win the required majority, though. There's no quicker way to get tens of millions of Americans to vote Democrat or not vote in protest than to screw the front runner out of the primary.
From that frame of mind, why should anyone in the 60-70% of the people who are not Trump supporters vote for Trump in the election if he is the candidate?
Personally, I see nothing wrong or unfair about a brokered convention. The fact of the matter is you can't declare yourself the victor without the majority of delegates. You don't just get to declare yourself the winner. You have to actually win.
That number seems too high. Even if it is true, where did it come from? Probably an online poll where Canadians and other foreigners can weigh in. See Bernie's super amazing sauce poll numbers and then watch him lose that same state. Not trying to be edgy here, that is literally what happens.
And even if the number is actually correct, which I seriously doubt, how many of those people are going to show up and vote, anyway? Republicans are killing the Democratic turn out in the primary this season, and Trump, love him or hate him, is a very large reason why.
Nothing like being phone banked by a teenager about Bernie to get me to change my opinion lol.
Mhjames: mtgsalvation: I DON'T SEE HOW THIS CARD IS GOOD. I KNOW PATRICK CHAPIN USED IT AND WENT 8-0, BUT THAT WAS A SMALL TOURNAMENT. THE CARD IS TOO SLOW. YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE THE OPPONENT HAS A SPELL IN THE GRAVEYARD
That number seems too high. Even if it is true, where did it come from?
That Trump generally places somewhere between 30-40% in these primaries.
Still plenty to win land slides and set records in the states he wins. The only state thus far that has been actually close has been Iowa. Thank you Rato for stealing voters from Carson. Can't wait to watch the most Conservative candidate endorse Trump tomorrow. What an amazingly hilarious ***** show this has all become for the RNC. They should try something else.
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By: ol MISAKA lo
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Mhjames: mtgsalvation: I DON'T SEE HOW THIS CARD IS GOOD. I KNOW PATRICK CHAPIN USED IT AND WENT 8-0, BUT THAT WAS A SMALL TOURNAMENT. THE CARD IS TOO SLOW. YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE THE OPPONENT HAS A SPELL IN THE GRAVEYARD
That Trump generally places somewhere between 30-40% in these primaries.
These same people will vote for him in the general election if it's him vs Hillary/Bernie. I dislike Cruz but I'd still vote for him over anyone in the DNC. It's not even about conservatism at this point. The left is even more crazy than the right this election imo. 64k Democrats in PA alone switched to Republican to vote for Trump. It's pretty apparent something is going on. I don't buy into the whole 'racist rednecks only vote Trump" bull***** when you have people like me growing up in the ghetto, dating a black woman and working in the food industry not #feelingthebern or whatever. Be it blatant idol worship (I admit I love Donald Trump and that has a lot to do with why I'm voting for him) or just the rejection of Democrats and what can be precieved as an abject failure over the last 8 years to help conservatives at all instead of harming them or not. This election is very weird. I didn't ever expect to run into as many african americans and hispanics as I did at the Trump rally in Columbus, Ohio a few weeks ago. And to hear all the dissenting opinions. Kids in Bernie shirts with MAGA hats on. I was literally shocked. Real great time.
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Mhjames: mtgsalvation: I DON'T SEE HOW THIS CARD IS GOOD. I KNOW PATRICK CHAPIN USED IT AND WENT 8-0, BUT THAT WAS A SMALL TOURNAMENT. THE CARD IS TOO SLOW. YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE THE OPPONENT HAS A SPELL IN THE GRAVEYARD
Still plenty to win land slides and set records in the states he wins.
"Land slides"? He's gotten the majority in one state, South Carolina, and it was fractions of a percentage point over fifty percent. That's not winning by a landslide.
The only state thus far that has been actually close has been Iowa.
That is completely incorrect.
Fact is, if Trump can't get the majority of delegates, then you cannot say he should win the candidacy, because winning the candidacy means getting the majority of delegates.
And if the majority of delegates do not vote for Trump in a brokered convention, then Trump has lost, because he did not get the majority of delegates. There's nothing that compels the delegates to vote for Trump, because that's the entire point of a brokered convention. And there's nothing that says Trump should win, because Trump never got a majority.
So Trump supporters can get pissy and say they're angry their candidate didn't win and vote for Hillary instead out of spite, but that's nothing more than a childish temper tantrum and no one should claim otherwise. And if that's the level of maturity that Trump supporters bring, I think the Republican party should be glad to be rid of them.
Still plenty to win land slides and set records in the states he wins.
"Land slides"? As I understand it, he's gotten the majority in one state, and it was barely over fifty percent. That's not winning by a landslide.
Fact is, if Trump can't get the majority of delegates, then you cannot say he should win the candidacy, because winning the candidacy means getting the majority of delegates.
And if the majority of delegates do not vote for Trump in a brokered convention, then Trump has lost, because he did not get the majority of delegates. There's nothing that compels the delegates to vote for Trump, because that's the entire point of a brokered convention. And there's nothing that says Trump should win, because Trump never got a majority.
So Trump supporters can get pissy and say they're angry their candidate didn't win and vote for Hillary instead out of spite, but that's nothing more than a childish temper tantrum and no one should claim otherwise. And if that's the level of maturity that Trump supporters bring, I think the Republican party should be glad to be rid of them.
See all the Berniebots saying they'd 'write' Bernie's name on the balot even though it's all done electronically now as an example. You vote for what is in your best interest or if you're not a selfish douche you vote for what is best for America fiscally and socially. A moderate Republican is rare, I know, it's scary. And he's a big meanie and says mean things. But, that being said, when you consider his opposition the only person who doesn't look as bad or worse than him is Bernie. And I can give you a literal novel about why he is a disaster. Don't even get me started on Hillary.
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By: ol MISAKA lo
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Mhjames: mtgsalvation: I DON'T SEE HOW THIS CARD IS GOOD. I KNOW PATRICK CHAPIN USED IT AND WENT 8-0, BUT THAT WAS A SMALL TOURNAMENT. THE CARD IS TOO SLOW. YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE THE OPPONENT HAS A SPELL IN THE GRAVEYARD
See all the Berniebots saying they'd 'write' Bernie's name on the balot even though it's all done electronically now as an example. You vote for what is in your best interest or if you're not a selfish douche you vote for what is best for America fiscally and socially.
And you believe Hillary Clinton is best for America fiscally and socially?
No, you don't. You're talking about people voting for Hillary to stick it to the Republican party for not making Trump the candidate. This is, as you say, being a "selfish douche." It is also childish, immature, spiteful, and above all, demonstrates complete negligence in one's duties as a citizen.
A moderate Republican is rare, I know, it's scary. And he's a big meanie and says mean things. But, that being said, when you consider his opposition the only person who doesn't look as bad or worse than him is Bernie.
Which is not an endorsement.
And I can give you a literal novel about why he is a disaster.
I would like you to give me an actual novel, so that for once in this thread you might actually have used the word "literal" correctly.
I would like you to give me an actual novel, so that for once in this thread you might actually have used the word "literal" correctly.
My grammar could use some work, I admit.
That being said;
And you believe Hillary Clinton is best for America fiscally and socially?
Fiscally she's much better than Sanders. She's taking after Bill in the Blue-Dog Democrat camp on quite a few of her stances. Too bad she's a liar and a felon and even liberals so far left to consider Bernie hate her. Republicans hate her. She and Ted Cruz should share a ticket and campaign as "The Most Hated People in America" at this point. They're extremely low energy. However, when did I say she's the best for America? o.o
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Mhjames: mtgsalvation: I DON'T SEE HOW THIS CARD IS GOOD. I KNOW PATRICK CHAPIN USED IT AND WENT 8-0, BUT THAT WAS A SMALL TOURNAMENT. THE CARD IS TOO SLOW. YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE THE OPPONENT HAS A SPELL IN THE GRAVEYARD
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Why?
I don't know what country we're discussing, but if this is the US, and it's not like, I don't know, an expensive bar, and it's a couple, who cares?
I would argue that it depends on where you are. I live in a deeply conservative, very religious area. I've personally been jeered for holding my boyfriend's hand in public. I had great service at a restaurant until the server saw me kiss my boyfriend on the cheek as he sat down (he was slightly late because of car troubles). Afterwards we received horrible service, only seeing our waiter once in an hour's timeframe despite the building being almost empty.
I imagine that in larger cities or more accepting areas that this is less likely to happen, but in smaller towns and more religious areas (which is a large chunk of America) these things are commonplace. Most people don't notice, since it doesn't happen to them, but it's definitely there.
The commercial deal is a bit more complicated. I understand that there is often an agenda at work in the commercials. However, every commercial has an agenda: to get you to buy their stuff. The methods have evolved over the years, but it's always there. My problem is that some people don't realize this and view anything deviating from a straight, white male (or female depending on the product being marketed, but usually male) is somehow pandering or pushing an agenda while simultaneously ignoring (or perhaps not realizing) the fact that commercials with said straight, white male as the protagonist are the most pandering commercials there are.
Shifting gears slightly, even today commercials with non-white couples (or, god forbid, an interracial couple) are seen as pandering or pushing some nefarious liberal agenda, despite the growing non-white population in America. Cheerios released a commercial last year (if I remember correctly) featuring an interracial couple that received serious blowback for something so benign. Ads featuring gay couples often fall into this category, with people not realizing that the agenda at play is merely to appeal to a slightly different audience and get said audience to purchase their things.
That's why I have such a problem with this. Some people go into a rage whenever a non-straight person is featured in anything and see it as pandering or pushing an agenda, no matter how tastefully done or if it fits the plot/narrative (in the case of a movie or book). Anything that deviates from the default is seen as bad and threatening.
Thank you! I'm glad to hear it.
URW Control
WBG Abzan
GRW Burn
EDH
GR Rosheen Meanderer
That's interesting. I live in a mostly white city with above average incomes, but you don't really see racism or bigotry until you visit the lower income housing or dive bars. The people here have a solid sense of community; if you're here, you're here for the same reasons we are. We "read" about the race war in America. What you see here is mostly reverse racism if you can believe that. But its very fair to say that since I'm a straight white male (oh god I just labeled myself) that it might be there, and I simply don't experience it myself.
You would definitely experience it if you drove out to the country - Ohio has its fair share of good 'ol boys and simpletons.
And I feel the same way about the scene in commercials! Why does EVERYONE have to have a spotless, immaculate beautiful home? If the commercial had two men making dinner together, I'd think that's ridiculous - did they JUST BUY that house? Obviously no children there.. I get to the end of the house, and the first room I painted needs a fresh paint.
Holding hands and making out are two different things. We'll talk about making out. Its really silly to split hairs over whether an action thats disrespectful to everyone around them is MORE or LESS offensive based on their sexuality. But yes, when its same sex it comes with an added 'shock' factor because its pulling people out of their element. I don't think that can be changed - its just not commonplace enough to make everyone comfortable with it at all times.
Bars...
Well yes we tend to stick to higher end places - martini bars and cocktail lounges, as there are more like-minded people we can associate with, and less plaid covered ruffians looking for the first excuse they can find to start a physical confrontation. We do frequent one hole in the wall, as our mixed drinks are $2.50 during happy hour and we know people there. There you will see more racism and bigotry - its a direct correlation. But even there, word would travel fast if two people of any sex were making out in the back room. My only concern here is that with so many CCW now, and people who ignore the CCW laws - what used to be a ruffian fist fight outside of the bar might someday become a ruffian shooting, but thats a whole different topic I think. Best course of action is to be polite to everyone =)
My Buying Thread
Hoping this results in people finally wising up to him.
Lol I told you last night I could be reasoned with and have my views changed. It happens literally all the time. I'm wrong ALL the damn time. You don't become a smarter and better person by rejecting all criticism and doubling down the moment your argument starts to fall apart. I had a bit too much to drink last night. After re reading the last few pages I felt like an idiot. And thanks for the compliment.
By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible
I unfortunately just got off work and missed it. That was an amazing closing statement, however.
By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible
Its a real shame that some of the more acceptable candidates got cut out of this race by his antics otherwise we may have had a real competition instead of the literal definition of "lesser of two evils."
I think most Trump supporters are too far gone to care. But I'm really hoping that now that people are actually viewing Trump as a candidate as opposed to a media fiasco they might actually regard him with some scrutiny.
Basically comes down to Ohio and Floria. Once again, I firmly back Kasich as the clear best choice of the bunch. Hopefully Kasich can get Ohio. If he can't, then it's over, but if he can, Trump and Cruz might just be able to be boxed out.
Yeah, I would be depressed if it does end up being a battle between Trump and Cruz as to which would be the bigger disaster of a candidate. (It's still Cruz.)
Of course. It takes a bold person to admit being wrong.
I'm hoping you'll end up admitting that you're wrong about the Trump thing, hopefully before Tuesday.
By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible
I'll be sure to catch the highlights later. I missed this one live.
Reading someone else's recap now. Apparently it was amazingly civil compared to previous debates. I see speculation that the RNC had a chat with all of them before the debate, told them to behave, and threatened something they actually took seriously.
It sounds like Trump proposed a trade war, why am I not surprised? Kasich supports renewable energy, though, one for your guy there!
Considering last week being a massive media fiasco that got him a TON of attention, and considering a lot of people get their information from these debates, it's pretty reasonable to assume the reason he was so civil tonight and acted like an actual candidate and not a bully for once is to appeal to people who don't know a ton about him. Online polls are showing him winning that debate by a 30% margin vs El Rato and Roboto and Mr Kasich.
By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible
Heck, even Rubio had a sudden rush of brains to the head: "I’m not interested in being politically correct; I’m interested in being correct … We are going to have to work with people of the Muslim faith, even as Islam faces a crisis within [itself]."
It's also doubtless because of all the negative publicity surrounding the party as a whole. They recognize that if they continue to squabble like children, the whole party is brought down. Hell, the headlines were about how disgusted everyone was with the performances of the non-Kasich participants.
Yes, the man looked like a total moron. But even that wasn't as bad as his repetition of, "We need to make a good deal," with regards to Cuba. Rubio hammered him with regards to that.
Well the thing is that Donald Trump has a tremendous advantage: his supporters don't care about facts or coherent thought. Donald Trump doesn't have to make sense or say intelligent things. He just has to be Donald Trump and he'll get votes. It's celebrity presidency.
Maybe that's the reason, but I don't think so. The reason he (and everyone else) was civil tonight is because the GOP has capitulated. The party elites have made a truce with Trump. It's the most logical explanation.
They'll still try and stop him of course. Rubio will drop out and Kasich and Cruz will try to come up with enough wins to take it to the convention, but tonight signals that the fighting is over.
In order to try and stop the party from imploding, I think the GOP has agreed call off the dogs and will fully support him as the nominee if he wins.
When he wins, you mean. He'll surely get the most delegates. I fear a brokered convention if he doesn't win the required majority, though. There's no quicker way to get tens of millions of Americans to vote Democrat or not vote in protest than to screw the front runner out of the primary.
By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible
Personally, I see nothing wrong or unfair about a brokered convention. The fact of the matter is you can't declare yourself the victor without the majority of delegates. You don't just get to declare yourself the winner. You have to actually win.
That number seems too high. Even if it is true, where did it come from? Probably an online poll where Canadians and other foreigners can weigh in. See Bernie's super amazing sauce poll numbers and then watch him lose that same state. Not trying to be edgy here, that is literally what happens.
And even if the number is actually correct, which I seriously doubt, how many of those people are going to show up and vote, anyway? Republicans are killing the Democratic turn out in the primary this season, and Trump, love him or hate him, is a very large reason why.
Nothing like being phone banked by a teenager about Bernie to get me to change my opinion lol.
By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible
Still plenty to win land slides and set records in the states he wins. The only state thus far that has been actually close has been Iowa. Thank you Rato for stealing voters from Carson. Can't wait to watch the most Conservative candidate endorse Trump tomorrow. What an amazingly hilarious ***** show this has all become for the RNC. They should try something else.
By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible
These same people will vote for him in the general election if it's him vs Hillary/Bernie. I dislike Cruz but I'd still vote for him over anyone in the DNC. It's not even about conservatism at this point. The left is even more crazy than the right this election imo. 64k Democrats in PA alone switched to Republican to vote for Trump. It's pretty apparent something is going on. I don't buy into the whole 'racist rednecks only vote Trump" bull***** when you have people like me growing up in the ghetto, dating a black woman and working in the food industry not #feelingthebern or whatever. Be it blatant idol worship (I admit I love Donald Trump and that has a lot to do with why I'm voting for him) or just the rejection of Democrats and what can be precieved as an abject failure over the last 8 years to help conservatives at all instead of harming them or not. This election is very weird. I didn't ever expect to run into as many african americans and hispanics as I did at the Trump rally in Columbus, Ohio a few weeks ago. And to hear all the dissenting opinions. Kids in Bernie shirts with MAGA hats on. I was literally shocked. Real great time.
By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible
That is completely incorrect.
Fact is, if Trump can't get the majority of delegates, then you cannot say he should win the candidacy, because winning the candidacy means getting the majority of delegates.
And if the majority of delegates do not vote for Trump in a brokered convention, then Trump has lost, because he did not get the majority of delegates. There's nothing that compels the delegates to vote for Trump, because that's the entire point of a brokered convention. And there's nothing that says Trump should win, because Trump never got a majority.
So Trump supporters can get pissy and say they're angry their candidate didn't win and vote for Hillary instead out of spite, but that's nothing more than a childish temper tantrum and no one should claim otherwise. And if that's the level of maturity that Trump supporters bring, I think the Republican party should be glad to be rid of them.
See all the Berniebots saying they'd 'write' Bernie's name on the balot even though it's all done electronically now as an example. You vote for what is in your best interest or if you're not a selfish douche you vote for what is best for America fiscally and socially. A moderate Republican is rare, I know, it's scary. And he's a big meanie and says mean things. But, that being said, when you consider his opposition the only person who doesn't look as bad or worse than him is Bernie. And I can give you a literal novel about why he is a disaster. Don't even get me started on Hillary.
By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible
No, you don't. You're talking about people voting for Hillary to stick it to the Republican party for not making Trump the candidate. This is, as you say, being a "selfish douche." It is also childish, immature, spiteful, and above all, demonstrates complete negligence in one's duties as a citizen.
Which is not an endorsement.
I would like you to give me an actual novel, so that for once in this thread you might actually have used the word "literal" correctly.
My grammar could use some work, I admit.
That being said;
Fiscally she's much better than Sanders. She's taking after Bill in the Blue-Dog Democrat camp on quite a few of her stances. Too bad she's a liar and a felon and even liberals so far left to consider Bernie hate her. Republicans hate her. She and Ted Cruz should share a ticket and campaign as "The Most Hated People in America" at this point. They're extremely low energy. However, when did I say she's the best for America? o.o
By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible