Without speaking for Hannes, it is my impression that he is now open to the possibility of having a technician, if we find a suitable one.
That's good to hear. I'm willing to offer help, but I'm not sure if I can take on full time tech responsibilities for a site this large.
I think moving to a collaborative model for technical changes would be a good thing. Put the codebase up on github, have new features developed there and voted on by experienced programmers, and then move changes through a test-production steup. Have some sort of system in place that keeps track of all changes in production and if a change wasn't done on test then the tech that made the change is reprimanded.
If changes are evaluated and tested before being put into production then we're no longer at the mercy of a rogue tech. A collaborative environment means we won't be stagnant.
There are already a handful of java scripts that provide the card popup. Its just a matter of inserting it into the page header. Most will need a little tailoring to recognize MTGS's card tag.
Hey, guys, would it be feasible to 'get' a decent, able, and trustworthy site technician? I think a lot of bad things can be obviated by having one on board at all times and can also reduce the amount of comparatively ordinary or routine work that Hannes needs to do too around the site.
Am I just saying what's on everyone's mind now?
The rest of the thread has been, for lack of a better word, interesting to read, and I don't quite know how to respond as I feel fit just yet.
Oh hey MagicMage/ITDW/Gimmick account! What made you decide to bust out this old account? Nostalgia eh?
Anyway I think Hannes kinda became wary of technicians after having jdski go on somewhat of an internet power trip where he kinda just starting doing whatever he wanted, as was alluded to by sentimentgx4.
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I think what Madding is getting at is that a lot of the technical aspects of site improvement are outside the staff's abilities and only Hannes can implement them. If the site is to 'get with the times' and start implementing social media and other modern features, it would need to be under Hannes' direction.
Of course, I could be wrong and Madding was saying Hannes needs to come in and whip the staff into shape somehow, but I don't think that's it.
Please, for the love of all that is holy, do not implement facebook integration (or any other social media).
I *hate* the way every website and its mother is integrating facebook or blogspot or twitter, or whathaveyou into every single thing...
Please, for the love of all that is holy, do not implement facebook integration (or any other social media).
I *hate* the way every website and its mother is integrating facebook or blogspot or twitter, or whathaveyou into every single thing...
Yeah cause flowing with the way social media is implanted and helps spread the word on things is always a bad feature to have for a major site to also increase its awareness. #hategoodideas
Seriously. Considering how much the other things are used I can say the facebook group Im a part of posts Many links from here and other gaming sites. While on the other sites I simply press a button and BOOM Site is linked with the page I want and all is well. here Have to copy, paste, edit the wording of the link sometimes. Basicly I am doing much more then needed when a simple interface can help many and also be interesting at the same time.
Yeah cause flowing with the way social media is implanted and helps spread the word on things is always a bad feature to have for a major site to also increase its awareness. #hategoodideas
Seriously. Considering how much the other things are used I can say the facebook group Im a part of posts Many links from here and other gaming sites. While on the other sites I simply press a button and BOOM Site is linked with the page I want and all is well. here Have to copy, paste, edit the wording of the link sometimes. Basicly I am doing much more then needed when a simple interface can help many and also be interesting at the same time.
Agreed.
I didn't want to be the first to say this, because 'apparently noone agrees with me' that this site sorely needs social media integration.
The internet has changed, the way people interact on it has changed.
Heck, even AIM is shutting down soon because of facebook.
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News and spoiler contributor for GatheringMagic.com
Agreed.
I didn't want to be the first to say this, because 'apparently noone agrees with me' that this site sorely needs social media integration.
The internet has changed, the way people interact on it has changed.
Heck, even AIM is shutting down soon because of facebook.
I hated facebook, I hated twitter, and I hated other major social media items. Then they got better and easier to use with using different interfaces. Now I like them cause its not that hard. Hell alot of the events I watch or attend is thanks to social medias ability to spread the word faster then expected. To me this intergration be nothing but a Boom.
And Glad I dont use AIM anymore. Skype is much easier and better with me and everyone I work with.
While I personally would not use any of this social media integration that is being discussed, I cannot see any negative effects to implementing any integration that VBullitin supports.
Just because person X hates social media, does it really hurt him that person Y sees it as an enhancement to their enjoyment of this site.
If a Person X exists that is so repulsed by social media that they would no longer use the site, we could also implement some sort of toggle that turns off all viewing of this social media integration.
[this site] lost it's identity long ago and with the quality of posts here in the sections actually pertaining to Magic being rather weak...
...The added state of it existing as nothing more than a source for regurgitating news from websites doesn't hold water in terms of value...
...even the compiled spoiler layout is extremely old and quite an eyesore...
...Hannes is MIA and the lack of social media networking can also be seen as partially responsible for being unable to find ways to fund vBulletin and website upgrades in some ways outside of advertising on the main website....
...[the site feels] like it's floating in limbo on a yearly cycle of inevitable staff changes that come in waves with marginal benefits for the community as a whole...
...Some people know that the place could be more exciting, and that there's more potential if it could shake the bonds of apathy and get the rest of the community more involved somehow.
RE: Oldsters -
I was here back in 2007, when rumors were still in full swing. The site doesn't feel appreciably worse now than it did then. Some people have gone (Sen, Furor, T2), new people have shown up (Hi, Misclick!).
At the end of the day, a tremendous amount of what you're saying feels like nostalgia and, "Stuff costs more!"
Agreed.
I didn't want to be the first to say this, because 'apparently noone agrees with me' that this site sorely needs social media integration
Let me check and see if I have some nails lying around here somewhere...
Re: Social Media
Most sites that integrate this have paid staff. This site doesn't. Citing potential income as a way to defray this is ludicrous. If I were Hannes, I wouldn't be adding it.
For what it's worth, I want to personally apologize for my lack of a role in all of this. For a multitude of reasons, I have dropped the ball in many aspects of my moderating duties for months now and when I should have been around for an event like this, and event that has real-life ramifications that are unimaginable, I simply wasn't.
I'm not going to lie and say that this was the sole reason why I have decided to retire, but my incompetency in this event is something that should not be tolerated and if all the other reasons were not there, I would still be making this post.
Go easy on the guys that are left. They're doing their best with the resources they have available to them to make decisions to improve this site. We're human and we screw up, but from having worked with guys like Sene, rianalnn, Galspanic, and viperesque, I know they are good people with a lot to give you folks.
Now I'm worried about Sene getting burnout. Yukora has quitted and Ria is still searching for something. Frankly it's quite worrying for mtgs at the moment.
If the store owner says that I can't trade in the premises, I'll just go outside. If he says that I can't trade within 10m of his premises, I'll go to 11 meters. If he says that he doesn't want to see me trading, I will put a basket over his head and continue trading.
Yes, he's a local legend. He's only known to take his clothes off before he goes into the Ladies' Lockerroom. Nobody knows what he does in there because he's invisible, but it's almost certainly tons of masturbating.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I don't know about you guys but I have never posted about Magic on my facebook and I have no desire to.
This is very conducive to the thread topic. Thank you for your insight, LogicX. The fact that you are not yet an admin is a major concern of mine.
@Kijin: Obviously I trolled the troll (poorly) at one point and got gb& for it but I will say that outside of certain corner case scenarios, you were always fair and reasonable. MTGS is a worse place for losing you both as a moderator and member. No riding intended.
Passive aggressive trolling is still trolling. Warning issued.
-Galspanic
I don't know about you guys but I have never posted about Magic on my facebook and I have no desire to.
Whereas I have a group on Facebook that many friends and local players post to where we discuss upcoming events, travel arrangements and use it as a forum for many topics related to a hobby we spend a lot of time doing. It works out pretty great, and Facebook integration, especially for my group would be a welcome addition.
I don't know what it is with the anti-social networking crowd or people that act ashamed to talk outside of a card shop about playing Magic, and their attitude of "Well I'm to cool for this" while feeling the need to assert their opinion all over a Magic: the Gathering forum. The people that act sheepish about the topic of Magic towards people they know or who want to be digital dinosaurs and shoot down the importance of social networking while probably steaming YouTube videos all day or using a text messaging service are pretty amusing. Whether these people like it or not, they're on the grid, and whatever misplaced sense of self-righteousness they have that leads them to being in the minority that is the anti-social networking crowd just garners skepticism on my part, given there's conveniently never any real argument or reasoning that pops up for why not. That is, except for the occasional tinfoil hat arguments more related to individuals and their inability to think about what they're posting on the internet before they post it, whereas otherwise they have nothing to fear.
To be quite blunt: Hiding heads in the sand, being socially awkward, not wanting to be part of a social network and/or not wanting to talk about X topic on Y doesn't magically make the great majority of the internet userbase that does use social networking suddenly vanish and become irrelevant. The pure irony is that ignoring this trend is what would actually lead to irrelevancy or at least being less effective in delivering media than a website or community could be. It's asinine that people try to downplay the importance of further social media integration when you consider how many people use AdBlock, NoScript etc. taking into account that there are upkeep costs that need to be met to keep this place float, and the number of things social networking would do to actually help the website and forums. Meanwhile people's argument is summed up as "I don't want to. Maintain the status quo. I don't use it so I don't think anyone should." The appropriate response to these sentiments and the few measly posters doing what internet users do best - attempting to be contrary without adding any actual substance to a discussion - would be who cares? There's not even any real argument present.
P.S. Grats Galspanic for the promotion to Administrator.
My opposition to social media integration is not an opposition to integration in general, its an opposition to everywhere else I've seen it integrated where it becomes mandatory.
Suffice to say, if it becomes mandatory you won't see me posting anymore because facebook and I have...issues (like me being locked out of my account because of old email addresses that don't work).
I don't know what it is with the anti-social networking crowd
Well, funny thing is... if you don't want to encorporate your facebook into your forum profile, you don't have to. So its odd anyone would be against it. If you don't like it, don't use it *shrug*
Whereas I have a group on Facebook that many friends and local players post to where we discuss upcoming events, travel arrangements and use it as a forum for many topics related to a hobby we spend a lot of time doing. It works out pretty great, and Facebook integration, especially for my group would be a welcome addition.
I don't know what it is with the anti-social networking crowd or people that act ashamed to talk outside of a card shop about playing Magic, and their attitude of "Well I'm to cool for this" while feeling the need to assert their opinion all over a Magic: the Gathering forum. The people that act sheepish about the topic of Magic towards people they know or who want to be digital dinosaurs and shoot down the importance of social networking while probably steaming YouTube videos all day or using a text messaging service are pretty amusing. Whether these people like it or not, they're on the grid, and whatever misplaced sense of self-righteousness they have that leads them to being in the minority that is the anti-social networking crowd just garners skepticism on my part, given there's conveniently never any real argument or reasoning that pops up for why not. That is, except for the occasional tinfoil hat arguments more related to individuals and their inability to think about what they're posting on the internet before they post it, whereas otherwise they have nothing to fear.
To be quite blunt: Hiding heads in the sand, being socially awkward, not wanting to be part of a social network and/or not wanting to talk about X topic on Y doesn't magically make the great majority of the internet userbase that does use social networking suddenly vanish and become irrelevant. The pure irony is that ignoring this trend is what would actually lead to irrelevancy or at least being less effective in delivering media than a website or community could be. It's asinine that people try to downplay the importance of further social media integration when you consider how many people use AdBlock, NoScript etc. taking into account that there are upkeep costs that need to be met to keep this place float, and the number of things social networking would do to actually help the website and forums. Meanwhile people's argument is summed up as "I don't want to. Maintain the status quo. I don't use it so I don't think anyone should." The appropriate response to these sentiments and the few measly posters doing what internet users do best - attempting to be contrary without adding any actual substance to a discussion - would be who cares? There's not even any real argument present.
P.S. Grats Galspanic for the promotion to Administrator.
I'm not anti-social networking, I'm just saying I probably wouldn't use facebook integration in MTGS. This is just my personal input on the issue. Those in charge can take my stance for what it is worth.
Well, funny thing is... if you don't want to encorporate your facebook into your forum profile, you don't have to. So its odd anyone would be against it. If you don't like it, don't use it *shrug*
I am one of those "Facebook leave me alone!!!!" kind of guys and I hardly use it anymore because all I see now are 4chan meme updates from fringe friends I don't even know if I know. I might be wrong, but it's that sort of thing that makes people NOT want social networking to be part of the site. I know I could make them stop but constantly having to do settings updates is so irritating that I pretty gave up on all FB-ish sites.
As you are clearly more involved with the tech side of forum software it never occured to me that we could flip it off in our profile or that we would have control over how it was used. And when I saw "we" I mean all 100.000 of the people here.
So, clearly I need more information on how that would even happen (hint hint, link?)
Of course, all relative to your own version of VB and whats available for it. Some of them let you simul login. Some of them let you blog back and forth. Some enable friends to be cross referenced between the two sites.
----
vb 4.0 comes with the "Like" button feature already that people talked about. Its not exclusive to the forum though. IT IS tied directly into facebook. Thus if you have a facebook account, and click "Like" on the forum, it "likes" it on your facebook.
----
In regard to rating posts (some refer to this as 'thumbs' like youtube) this is already built into the vBulletin system, but its part of the reputation systems. +/- reputation for a post, affects the posts rating. Its cumbersome to use though and its "rating the post, based on the person" instead of just rating the damn post.
There are additional apps and addons avail, though.
Please don't think I'm pushing for anything related to facebook - I don't even have a facebook account. I'm off the grid baby!
However, if other people will use something, theres no real harm in letting them have it. Its important to keep your website updated and add new features. Especially if you want to stay a competitive forum, it is good to add such enhancements.
----
If you wanted to dabble, you could create a "Features you'd like to see" type of thread, and reference the app forum for the current VB version as well. This could generate some user feedback and ideas.
Then, you could pick through and decide not only whats feasible, within reason of admin capabilities, and what would be a good addition that suits MTGS appropriately.
----
My other forum has some really cool social features much like facebook, but exclusive to the site itself. Friends, visitor messages, etc. All very "community" related things for fun. I've attached a picture since only accounts can see profiles. Like this see. I can do some digging and find out how much of that is built into VB, and what are addons...
That's good to hear. I'm willing to offer help, but I'm not sure if I can take on full time tech responsibilities for a site this large.
I think moving to a collaborative model for technical changes would be a good thing. Put the codebase up on github, have new features developed there and voted on by experienced programmers, and then move changes through a test-production steup. Have some sort of system in place that keeps track of all changes in production and if a change wasn't done on test then the tech that made the change is reprimanded.
If changes are evaluated and tested before being put into production then we're no longer at the mercy of a rogue tech. A collaborative environment means we won't be stagnant.
[card=Jace Beleren]Jace[/card] = Jace
Magic CompRules
Scry Rollover Popups for Google Chrome
The first rule of Cursecatcher is, You do not talk about Cursecatcher.
My Buying Thread
Oh hey MagicMage/ITDW/Gimmick account! What made you decide to bust out this old account? Nostalgia eh?
Anyway I think Hannes kinda became wary of technicians after having jdski go on somewhat of an internet power trip where he kinda just starting doing whatever he wanted, as was alluded to by sentimentgx4.
Please, for the love of all that is holy, do not implement facebook integration (or any other social media).
I *hate* the way every website and its mother is integrating facebook or blogspot or twitter, or whathaveyou into every single thing...
I agree! Can we get a "like" functions for post like this? I want to share it on my Facebook...
Yeah cause flowing with the way social media is implanted and helps spread the word on things is always a bad feature to have for a major site to also increase its awareness. #hategoodideas
Seriously. Considering how much the other things are used I can say the facebook group Im a part of posts Many links from here and other gaming sites. While on the other sites I simply press a button and BOOM Site is linked with the page I want and all is well. here Have to copy, paste, edit the wording of the link sometimes. Basicly I am doing much more then needed when a simple interface can help many and also be interesting at the same time.
Agreed.
I didn't want to be the first to say this, because 'apparently noone agrees with me' that this site sorely needs social media integration.
The internet has changed, the way people interact on it has changed.
Heck, even AIM is shutting down soon because of facebook.
Twitter
I hated facebook, I hated twitter, and I hated other major social media items. Then they got better and easier to use with using different interfaces. Now I like them cause its not that hard. Hell alot of the events I watch or attend is thanks to social medias ability to spread the word faster then expected. To me this intergration be nothing but a Boom.
And Glad I dont use AIM anymore. Skype is much easier and better with me and everyone I work with.
Eh? You have a source for that?
Just because person X hates social media, does it really hurt him that person Y sees it as an enhancement to their enjoyment of this site.
If a Person X exists that is so repulsed by social media that they would no longer use the site, we could also implement some sort of toggle that turns off all viewing of this social media integration.
Millionaires, I hear it's good Music (Disclaimer: lyrics not PG-13) Thanks, CC
RE: Oldsters -
I was here back in 2007, when rumors were still in full swing. The site doesn't feel appreciably worse now than it did then. Some people have gone (Sen, Furor, T2), new people have shown up (Hi, Misclick!).
At the end of the day, a tremendous amount of what you're saying feels like nostalgia and, "Stuff costs more!"
Let me check and see if I have some nails lying around here somewhere...
Re: Social Media
Most sites that integrate this have paid staff. This site doesn't. Citing potential income as a way to defray this is ludicrous. If I were Hannes, I wouldn't be adding it.
Harkius
My Buying Thread
I'm not going to lie and say that this was the sole reason why I have decided to retire, but my incompetency in this event is something that should not be tolerated and if all the other reasons were not there, I would still be making this post.
Go easy on the guys that are left. They're doing their best with the resources they have available to them to make decisions to improve this site. We're human and we screw up, but from having worked with guys like Sene, rianalnn, Galspanic, and viperesque, I know they are good people with a lot to give you folks.
That said, All the best Yukora.
Good thing you aren't Hannes, then!
As for AIM, haven't used it in a while - everyone stopped using it, so, no one to talk to.
Skype starts automatically on my computer and I can't be arsed to change that (plus I have friends that use it), so why the hell not use it?
Anyway, so long as we're not required to link up with other accounts, I wouldn't care if it were integrated into the site.
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2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
This is very conducive to the thread topic. Thank you for your insight, LogicX. The fact that you are not yet an admin is a major concern of mine.
@Kijin: Obviously I trolled the troll (poorly) at one point and got gb& for it but I will say that outside of certain corner case scenarios, you were always fair and reasonable. MTGS is a worse place for losing you both as a moderator and member. No riding intended.
Passive aggressive trolling is still trolling. Warning issued.
-Galspanic
Whereas I have a group on Facebook that many friends and local players post to where we discuss upcoming events, travel arrangements and use it as a forum for many topics related to a hobby we spend a lot of time doing. It works out pretty great, and Facebook integration, especially for my group would be a welcome addition.
I don't know what it is with the anti-social networking crowd or people that act ashamed to talk outside of a card shop about playing Magic, and their attitude of "Well I'm to cool for this" while feeling the need to assert their opinion all over a Magic: the Gathering forum. The people that act sheepish about the topic of Magic towards people they know or who want to be digital dinosaurs and shoot down the importance of social networking while probably steaming YouTube videos all day or using a text messaging service are pretty amusing. Whether these people like it or not, they're on the grid, and whatever misplaced sense of self-righteousness they have that leads them to being in the minority that is the anti-social networking crowd just garners skepticism on my part, given there's conveniently never any real argument or reasoning that pops up for why not. That is, except for the occasional tinfoil hat arguments more related to individuals and their inability to think about what they're posting on the internet before they post it, whereas otherwise they have nothing to fear.
To be quite blunt: Hiding heads in the sand, being socially awkward, not wanting to be part of a social network and/or not wanting to talk about X topic on Y doesn't magically make the great majority of the internet userbase that does use social networking suddenly vanish and become irrelevant. The pure irony is that ignoring this trend is what would actually lead to irrelevancy or at least being less effective in delivering media than a website or community could be. It's asinine that people try to downplay the importance of further social media integration when you consider how many people use AdBlock, NoScript etc. taking into account that there are upkeep costs that need to be met to keep this place float, and the number of things social networking would do to actually help the website and forums. Meanwhile people's argument is summed up as "I don't want to. Maintain the status quo. I don't use it so I don't think anyone should." The appropriate response to these sentiments and the few measly posters doing what internet users do best - attempting to be contrary without adding any actual substance to a discussion - would be who cares? There's not even any real argument present.
P.S. Grats Galspanic for the promotion to Administrator.
(Also known as Xenphire)
Suffice to say, if it becomes mandatory you won't see me posting anymore because facebook and I have...issues (like me being locked out of my account because of old email addresses that don't work).
If its not mandatory then, meh I could care less.
Well, funny thing is... if you don't want to encorporate your facebook into your forum profile, you don't have to. So its odd anyone would be against it. If you don't like it, don't use it *shrug*
My Buying Thread
I'm not anti-social networking, I'm just saying I probably wouldn't use facebook integration in MTGS. This is just my personal input on the issue. Those in charge can take my stance for what it is worth.
I am one of those "Facebook leave me alone!!!!" kind of guys and I hardly use it anymore because all I see now are 4chan meme updates from fringe friends I don't even know if I know. I might be wrong, but it's that sort of thing that makes people NOT want social networking to be part of the site. I know I could make them stop but constantly having to do settings updates is so irritating that I pretty gave up on all FB-ish sites.
As you are clearly more involved with the tech side of forum software it never occured to me that we could flip it off in our profile or that we would have control over how it was used. And when I saw "we" I mean all 100.000 of the people here.
So, clearly I need more information on how that would even happen (hint hint, link?)
WUBRGPauper Battle BoxWUBRG ... and why I am not a fan of Wayne Reynolds' Illustrations.
http://www.vbulletin.org/forum/showthread.php?t=198499&highlight=facebook+connect
http://www.vbulletin.org/forum/showthread.php?t=266159&highlight=facebook
Of course, all relative to your own version of VB and whats available for it. Some of them let you simul login. Some of them let you blog back and forth. Some enable friends to be cross referenced between the two sites.
----
vb 4.0 comes with the "Like" button feature already that people talked about. Its not exclusive to the forum though. IT IS tied directly into facebook. Thus if you have a facebook account, and click "Like" on the forum, it "likes" it on your facebook.
----
In regard to rating posts (some refer to this as 'thumbs' like youtube) this is already built into the vBulletin system, but its part of the reputation systems. +/- reputation for a post, affects the posts rating. Its cumbersome to use though and its "rating the post, based on the person" instead of just rating the damn post.
There are additional apps and addons avail, though.
Please don't think I'm pushing for anything related to facebook - I don't even have a facebook account. I'm off the grid baby!
However, if other people will use something, theres no real harm in letting them have it. Its important to keep your website updated and add new features. Especially if you want to stay a competitive forum, it is good to add such enhancements.
----
If you wanted to dabble, you could create a "Features you'd like to see" type of thread, and reference the app forum for the current VB version as well. This could generate some user feedback and ideas.
Then, you could pick through and decide not only whats feasible, within reason of admin capabilities, and what would be a good addition that suits MTGS appropriately.
----
My other forum has some really cool social features much like facebook, but exclusive to the site itself. Friends, visitor messages, etc. All very "community" related things for fun. I've attached a picture since only accounts can see profiles. Like this see. I can do some digging and find out how much of that is built into VB, and what are addons...
My Buying Thread