I got into a debate about douche cards to play, and Timesifter came up. I was curious what the EDH community felt about this card as it can lead to long gaps in people getting turns.
And a follow up question, Is it worse then say dovescape in annoyance factor?
Annoying is what it is. A prime example of a card that should be avoided in a multiplayer format. I guess certain people will get some enjoyment out of it, though.
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From the mind of Raymond Swanland: Valla, a plane made entirely out of brownish spikes.
It's griefer tier. Impossible to really abuse and really only serves to screw the game state.
Hilarious for say one or two games but certainly not every one.
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A long time ago when mirrodin was released XD. My friend made a deck that abused timesifter. It's not fun being perma timewalked and milled at the same time. I hate that card more than any other card legal in EDH.
It depends totally on how you've built the deck it's in. If you're packing G/U ramp with HUGE mana costs then you're being a douche. If it's in there and your curve is pretty all over the place, meaning that you're not always the one that's going to benefit, then sometimes it's alright. Till you get to the guy that has the Divining Top and keeps putting the Blightsteel Collosus on top... But then he's being the douche, not you.
It depends totally on how you've built the deck it's in. If you're packing G/U ramp with HUGE mana costs then you're being a douche. If it's in there and your curve is pretty all over the place, meaning that you're not always the one that's going to benefit, then sometimes it's alright. Till you get to the guy that has the Divining Top and keeps putting the Blightsteel Collosus on top... But then he's being the douche, not you
Timesifter exiles the card on top, so even Blightsteel Colossus is a one-and-done type of thing.
Timesifter certainly isn't competitive, so in my eyes that makes it fall under the most common definition of casual. Whether it's fun or not is a different story altogether, but it's certainly casual.
As an aside, here's a story:
I was playing Gaddock Teeg combo against Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker, Linvala, Keeper of Silence, and Intet, the Dreamer. Intet plays Timesifter and, on average, everyone gets the same amount of turns they would normally. I have an active Sensei's Divining Top, so I originally thought I was going to emerge victorious, but what ended up happening was that I had to choose to exile my own combo pieces (Reveillark, Sun Titan, Pentavus, etc.) in order to even have a shot at getting a turn. Timesifter has its benefits!
Is it a casual card - yes, but only if you mean "non-competitive". If you mean "fun", then it's not. I also don't think someone is "elitist" for playing it. I either think they're a noob, a child, griefer, or just enjoy random outcomes...... but should still be hated off the table.
I wouldn't ever play it under any circumstances as I don't like random outcomes.
Where is the "You are an idiot who has more fun playing with a slot machine than playing Magic" option? This isn't a hardcore versus casual debate. It's an Einstein versus chimp debate. If you play time sifter, you are a chimp.
The problem with defining [EDH] by what is "fun" is that everyone seems to define fun as what they don't lose to. If you keep losing to easily answered cards, that means you should improve your deck. If you don't want to improve your deck, then you should come to peace with the idea that you are going to lose because you chose to not interact with better strategies.
What Blackjack said. It's a griefer card and it's precisely the kind of card that hurts the format on a local level. Denying people turns on a semi-random basis just isn't fun.
Its really just an obnoxious card, I don't think either option really fits so I'm not sure how much of an indication this poll will be. Its not particularly fun but its not very cutthroat either so you basically just have to be a griefer to play the card.
As for this versus Dovescape, meh I really don't mind if people play either, Dovescape has some legitimate applications as a combo piece plus you can force spells through it with things like Boseiju and Vexing Shusher. Timesifter isn't particularly hard to deal with but I think its probably a bit more annoying if it isn't dealt with fast but I can't see someone being able to take a ton of turns in a row consistently.
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It's not a DB card, nor is it casual. It's just annoying, along with Warp World, Shahrazad, and Grip of Chaos. People who play those are typically my first targets.
I disagree with both poll options so i didnt vote.
Timesifter isnt "hardcore" because its really good, but it is pretty crazy. I have left a few games where its in play and I dont untap while people take twenty turns and no one wants to use a spell to destroy it. No one really enjoys it I think except when its really late and you get a good laugh about it.
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There's nothing competitive about it, it's just an obnoxious card.
Well I don't think Knowledge Pool is nearly in the same group as the other cards in your list. Knowledge Pool is a blast to play and doesnt gum up the game state like the others. I think it's really fun with Vedalkan Orrey or Leyline of Anticipaition in play.
And anybody that hates a good Warp World is just silly!
Timesifter exiles the card on top, so even Blightsteel Colossus is a one-and-done type of thing.
Timesifter certainly isn't competitive, so in my eyes that makes it fall under the most common definition of casual. Whether it's fun or not is a different story altogether, but it's certainly casual.
You're right. I misread the card as linked. Even then though, with some way to manipulate the top of your deck if you build it right you're going to take the majority of the turns.
I played it in my dedicated chaos deck once. It seems that turns (extra, random, or otherwise) are not something that people enjoy being manipulated during a game.
Buddy of mine's Mayael deck played this combo until Timesifter became a "ok scoop time" when the engine started.
I was fine with it before then (he dropped the combo in dire situations. Never an auto win condition), and he made the right call to remove it..so i have no grudge against the card in that particular case. If you see that it's an auto-scoop card, or if turns out to become that way, and u don't remove it. then i have a problem
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If you're wanting to mess around with turns, it's a lot more fun to roll a six-sided die at the beginning of each end step.
Every time the die lands on a certain number (i.e. a 6), someone gets to take an extra turn after the current turn. Then assign players to different numbers on the die, roll again, and give the turn to the winner (alternatively, you can clash as with Timesifter). After the extra turn, the cycle starts back where it would have been without that turn.
In my experience it maintains the "randomness" without putting a target on a player's head for running it, and isn't so off the walls that people don't play.
And a follow up question, Is it worse then say dovescape in annoyance factor?
From the mind of Raymond Swanland: Valla, a plane made entirely out of brownish spikes.
Hilarious for say one or two games but certainly not every one.
Timesifter exiles the card on top, so even Blightsteel Colossus is a one-and-done type of thing.
Timesifter certainly isn't competitive, so in my eyes that makes it fall under the most common definition of casual. Whether it's fun or not is a different story altogether, but it's certainly casual.
As an aside, here's a story:
I was playing Gaddock Teeg combo against Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker, Linvala, Keeper of Silence, and Intet, the Dreamer. Intet plays Timesifter and, on average, everyone gets the same amount of turns they would normally. I have an active Sensei's Divining Top, so I originally thought I was going to emerge victorious, but what ended up happening was that I had to choose to exile my own combo pieces (Reveillark, Sun Titan, Pentavus, etc.) in order to even have a shot at getting a turn. Timesifter has its benefits!
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Is it a casual card - yes, but only if you mean "non-competitive". If you mean "fun", then it's not. I also don't think someone is "elitist" for playing it. I either think they're a noob, a child, griefer, or just enjoy random outcomes...... but should still be hated off the table.
I wouldn't ever play it under any circumstances as I don't like random outcomes.
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There's nothing competitive about it, it's just an obnoxious card.
The poll needs a third option.
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As for this versus Dovescape, meh I really don't mind if people play either, Dovescape has some legitimate applications as a combo piece plus you can force spells through it with things like Boseiju and Vexing Shusher. Timesifter isn't particularly hard to deal with but I think its probably a bit more annoying if it isn't dealt with fast but I can't see someone being able to take a ton of turns in a row consistently.
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Timesifter isnt "hardcore" because its really good, but it is pretty crazy. I have left a few games where its in play and I dont untap while people take twenty turns and no one wants to use a spell to destroy it. No one really enjoys it I think except when its really late and you get a good laugh about it.
I invision a future where one is not mighty when he can silence a crowd with brutality,
but when he leaves them speechless with wisdom.
Well I don't think Knowledge Pool is nearly in the same group as the other cards in your list. Knowledge Pool is a blast to play and doesnt gum up the game state like the others. I think it's really fun with Vedalkan Orrey or Leyline of Anticipaition in play.
And anybody that hates a good Warp World is just silly!
You're right. I misread the card as linked. Even then though, with some way to manipulate the top of your deck if you build it right you're going to take the majority of the turns.
Agreed though that it is totally casual
It was cut.
Buddy of mine's Mayael deck played this combo until Timesifter became a "ok scoop time" when the engine started.
I was fine with it before then (he dropped the combo in dire situations. Never an auto win condition), and he made the right call to remove it..so i have no grudge against the card in that particular case. If you see that it's an auto-scoop card, or if turns out to become that way, and u don't remove it. then i have a problem
EDH:
Currently Piloting:
Dama, Sage of Stone | Karador, Ghost Chieftan | Sigarda, Host of Herons | Elbrus, the Binding Blade / Withengar Unbound | Grand Arbiter Augustin IV | Genju of the Realm | Ruric Thar, the Unbowed
Every time the die lands on a certain number (i.e. a 6), someone gets to take an extra turn after the current turn. Then assign players to different numbers on the die, roll again, and give the turn to the winner (alternatively, you can clash as with Timesifter). After the extra turn, the cycle starts back where it would have been without that turn.
In my experience it maintains the "randomness" without putting a target on a player's head for running it, and isn't so off the walls that people don't play.
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On the contrary, it goes in decks with Plow Under and Thoughtpicker Witch, too.
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