If budget isn't an option you will notice all of us run Survival of the Fittest for that purpose. LoL troll is just too slow either way to be honest. Unless your Mime list has a massive creature list I doubt it will make an impact.
Yeah, you're right. I was just looking at a body with regenerate and discard outlet with trample and thought it would be a good body to dredge up with Mimeoplasm and stick 13 counters on it with Death's Shadow. I suppose other than that it's not all that great.
My Commanders:
:symg::symu::symb: The Mimeoplasm
:symg::symu::symb: Damia, Sage of Stone
:symr::symg::symw: Mayael the Anima
:symw::symu::symb: Sharuum the Hegemon
:symg::symu: Prime Speaker Zegana
:symb::symr: Olivia Voldaren
:symu::symb: Grimgrin, Corpse-Born
:symr::symw: Tajic, Blade of the Legion
Geth, Lord of the Vault
My Commanders:
:symg::symu::symb: The Mimeoplasm
:symg::symu::symb: Damia, Sage of Stone
:symr::symg::symw: Mayael the Anima
:symw::symu::symb: Sharuum the Hegemon
:symg::symu: Prime Speaker Zegana
:symb::symr: Olivia Voldaren
:symu::symb: Grimgrin, Corpse-Born
:symr::symw: Tajic, Blade of the Legion
Geth, Lord of the Vault
If you're trying to reanimate something out of your yard, these help immensely. They will be in my build from now on. They allow super early Jin.
If you wish to play as competitive as possible and budget isn't a big concern I would recommend Entomb into Jin/Skittles turn 1. Turn 2 you Reanimate it. With a turn 1 and 2 swamp you can be swinging with Skittles turn 2. Most people have an issue dealing with this. Jin is even better in large game as it is unlikely for you to take out more than one player with Skittles. Without hands though it is much harder for your opponents to do anything to you. Either case generally becomes archenemy. But who cares when they're toast really?
I have near zero graveyard hate in my meta so perhaps I am not the best person to help with this. I do run Grim Discovery in my Maga list to get back my commander (Cabal Coffers). It is amazing in that deck.
I feel like in this situation why bother running cards to save a single card from graveyard hate? I feel like it makes more sense to just run an answer to their hate in the first place. Creature spot removal such as Pongify (or the new 2.0) will take care of the Wretch quite nicely. Krosan Grip as it has split second can be used in response to them trying to exile your yard. Abrupt Decay and Beast Within are all starts and deal with both. Voidslime in a bind can be used to counter their activated ability as well. I recommend that one to stop Bojuka Bog type of effects.
I would also recommend taking advantage of the decks tricks more. While there are many tricks I'll give just one example. You can wait until there is no hate on the field and using your Alchemist's Refuge you can EoT a Buried Alive into a Lord of Extinction + Invisible Stalker/Nether Traitor + other. Using Cavern of Souls you can ensure it can't be countered. You will then either have a lethal, haste, near unblockable or a lethal, hexproof, unblockable. Either most of the time means GG.
If you wish to play as competitive as possible and budget isn't a big concern I would recommend Entomb into Jin/Skittles turn 1. Turn 2 you Reanimate it. With a turn 1 and 2 swamp you can be swinging with Skittles turn 2. Most people have an issue dealing with this. Jin is even better in large game as it is unlikely for you to take out more than one player with Skittles. Without hands though it is much harder for your opponents to do anything to you. Either case generally becomes archenemy. But who cares when they're toast really?
The Mimeoplasm needs two targets to be able to exile creatures in graveyards. There are times when you need an extra creature. Both Street Wraith and Architects of Will help this along just that much more, plus you can pitch them to Survival of the Fittest. Which should be in every Mimeoplasm deck. This increases the creature count to help this enchantment.
Entombing for Skittles isn't competitive though, I must disagree. It's just not good at all really. If it gets removed you get nothing at all. No advantage. Jin is far superior. Or, if you have Life from the Loam in hand, even reanimating Braids Cabal Minion is just better than going all in on Skittles.
Even so, none of those creatures guarantees any kind of win. It's just nice to immediately draw 7 with Jin and maybe discard their hand. It's also nice to exile Jin so it can't be used against you.
I when I see an opening, I usually use Intuition for Jin and Sphinx when I can't assemble a combo and just exile with the Plasm.
I think combos that kill everyone are the best way to go, using one shots with the plasm allows other players time to react.
I worded that poorly perhaps. It is very difficult to get it off turn 2. It has happened turn 2 I think all of twice. Kind of need a special scenario. Still, it can happen. I should have said ASAP for Reanimate.
I play in mostly 1v1v1 games. Skittles can be an amazing target to reanimate in a small game. I frequently kill one of them before skittles is dead. After skittles returns as mime I can often get another one. I think this is a very meta specific question. I pretty much play with the same 3-4 people most every time. There is a fairly diverse selections of decks however. If I am going up against deck(s) I know have issues with early game spot removal than why not grab a skittles?
I honestly can't stand combo though. I have built 8 decks and none involve board killing combos. I wont even play T&N as I think it's a stupid lazy card. Same reason I hate infinty. I just hate moments where I say to myself "wow... that was a waste of an hour for the other 3 players that had a whole game ahead of them". I don't mind players having a chance to react. If I can overcome an entire table one at a time with them knowing what is about to happen that is true skill/deck building in my opinion. Again, my personal preference though. If you want to play game ending combo be my guest. The combo debate has it's own place and this isn't it.
I worded that poorly perhaps. It is very difficult to get it off turn 2. It has happened turn 2 I think all of twice. Kind of need a special scenario. Still, it can happen. I should have said ASAP for Reanimate.
I play in mostly 1v1v1 games. Skittles can be an amazing target to reanimate in a small game. I frequently kill one of them before skittles is dead. After skittles returns as mime I can often get another one. I think this is a very meta specific question. I pretty much play with the same 3-4 people most every time. There is a fairly diverse selections of decks however. If I am going up against deck(s) I know have issues with early game spot removal than why not grab a skittles?
I honestly can't stand combo though. I have built 8 decks and none involve board killing combos. I wont even play T&N as I think it's a stupid lazy card. Same reason I hate infinty. I just hate moments where I say to myself "wow... that was a waste of an hour for the other 3 players that had a whole game ahead of them". I don't mind players having a chance to react. If I can overcome an entire table one at a time with them knowing what is about to happen that is true skill/deck building in my opinion. Again, my personal preference though. If you want to play game ending combo be my guest. The combo debate has it's own place and this isn't it.
Every T&N combo I can think of can be answered with simple instant speed spot removal.
It's interesting that you start debating about combos out of nowhere, and then end your statements by saying this isn't the place to be talking about combos. It's like someone giving their opinion, then saying no one else is allowed to talk about it.
I do however completely understand why people use words like stupid and lazy to describe magic cards as it's a passive attempt at calling the people who use those cards the exact derogatory terms you've used to describe the cards. It's kinda like smoke and mirrors.
Anyways, I've noticed you tried using the word competitive.....
Alright guys, let's not have this turn into any personal attacks on either side. Clearly some people enjoy the use of infinite combos as a win condition while others do not. Both viewpoints are perfectly fine depending on what is fun to YOU. I'm fine with people discussing decks of either type in this thread as long as it doesn't turn into a big argument. This debate has played out many times in various threads and I think the only real consensus is that there isn't a single correct answer. It all depends on you and your group. Now if we could get back to constructive discussion I would quite appreciate that.
I'll post a much larger update in the near future and reply to a lot of the posts that have been made since the last time I posted in here.
You are complete allowed your opinion. I was under the impression you already had given it on the subject when you suggested running combos. Just trying to give my view to anyone else seeking advice.
I also believe that any combo, not just T&N, has an answer. Be it in the form of instant speed removal, counters or activated abilities. That doesn't really stop the card from being what it is. I just think it is a weak way to win. Never really liked cards that are basically "win in a box"
Competitive is a subjective term as well. I'm sure you understand this. Competitive to me means plays like that and worse. Does that mean my meta is ultra competitive? Not a chance. None of us play Zur, Azami, Scion, or any of those other high level decks. A game ending before the 8th turn isn't commonplace. Compared to how we started playing "casual" EDH originally some of our decks are very competitive in my opinion. Would they get steam rolled by true tier 1 play? Almost certainly. Not how I play.
Thoughts on Consuming Aberration DTrain?
Edit: Urban Evolution... I like it. Worth at least testing in my land loving build.
Mind Grind seems good for those who build Mime around using opponent's graveyards
In reference to the spot removal discussion, Sever the Bloodline could be an option for those who want the exile portion. It's a bit expensive and is a Sorcery, but it is a two for one and can potentially hit multiple dudes. Something to consider.
Sever the Bloodline can definitely provide some nice card advantage, but I think what I'm currently looking to fit in is something that's cheap and instant speed. I think the closest thing we have to Swords to Plowshares in this color combination would be Pongify.
I like those spells because theyre cheap, versatile, and can be played very early.
I used to run Massacre Wurm, but there aren't really any token deck in my group currently, so it's not really needed. I also don't run Putrefy right now because I've been testing Abrupt Decay in its place. I think I'm going to stick with Decay because my meta is starting to have a lot of control decks, and the ability to hit enchantments is also very relevant. At this point I think it's worth giving up the ability to hit CMC 4 or greater in my group. However, this is could be very different for your group so it's best to make your own call on that.
It was pretty sweet, especially because it could only happen with the Refuge out in play.
Yes, Alchemist's Refuge is indeed very powerful. I cut it from the deck for a while, but I think I'm going to add it back in because it fuels some very explosive plays.
I am I big fan of going lethal with an Invisible Stalker pumped with Lord of Extinction. I have been looking for a backup buff for that combo. I have also been looking for another potential mill card to ad in. I must say, I think I have finally found it. Thank you WotC
BTW... I have finally added my Mime deck to my sig. Feel free to link it to the other deck's list if you like. I have spent a great deal of time,money and effort into tuning it and will gladly respond to anyone who posts.
I added your decklist to the "Other People's Decklists" in the primer. I really like Consuming Aberration for certain builds of the deck. If your plan is to go lethal with a huge Mimeoplasm, then it's certainly another great option alongside Lord of Extinction. I personally prefer the Skithiryx plan backed up by some control and reanimator elements, but both versions have their merits. I actually really want to turn my budget version into a second deck so that I can play a lot of the cards that haven't made the cut in my main list.
Refuge has fueled some pretty outrageous plays for me and it's bananas what you can do when it's in play. Sadly, with the banning of Primeval it becomes a lot less frequent that I see the card
Yeah, sadly this has become an issue for all non-basic lands. I don't see the ones I want nearly as much without Primeval Titan, which significantly hampers their usefulness.
Really what I came here for was your guys impression on the new Simic Guildmage? Shrinking Mimeo to draw some cards seems sweet and I was curious if I was the only one.
Tolaria West is a card that I'm not really sure on. It's certainly great that it gives you the ability to transmute for another land, but the fact that it comes into play tapped if you need to play it as a land is a major downside. I'm pretty light on ETB tapped lands right now, so maybe I'll give it a shot. As for the new Zameck Guildmage, it can be a pretty consistent draw outlet that shouldn't attract much hate, but I tend to prefer more efficient and powerful draw that can give me more cards and for less mana.
Think you're talking about Zameck Guildmage. And yes, he's totally abusable when combo'd with Lorescale Coatl, Corpsejack Menace or even the new Simic Fluxmage.
Personally, I'm pretty excited about Consuming Aberration, Lazav, Dimir Mastermind, and to an extent: Duskmantle Guildmage.
I've already commented about Zameck Guildmage above, but I'll address the other two here. They both would be very good in a mill oriented build of the deck, where you could get full value out of their abilities. In this version I don't think they're at their best since I don't usually have a constant stream of cards entering the graveyard. That combo with Duskmantle Guildmage and Traumatize is pretty cool and will probably find it's way into my budget / second list. I think Lazav would be really good as a general in his own deck, where you could build around milling powerful creatures into the graveyard to turn him into. He would also work well, as I said earlier, in a Mimeoplasm deck that was much more dedicated to milling than this one. He reminds me of a combination of Sakashima the Imposter and Dimir Doppelganger, but perhaps even better than either.
Looking at some iffy creatures on my deck list, and I'm wondering if there's room for Lotleth Troll or Death's Shadow. Surprised not many people run Lotleth Troll in their Mimeoplasm lists...
I have definitely found that their are superior discard outlets to Lotleth Troll, especially the aforementioned Survival of the Fittest and it's creature version, Fauna Shaman. If you want a lot of discard outlets then perhaps Lotleth Troll could be one of your later choices, but make sure you're running those other 2 first. As for Death's Shadow, it's certainly big, but it doesn't do anything other than serve as fodder for The Mimeoplasm to copy. If you're looking for cards to fill this role, I would suggest Lord of Extinction and the new Consuming Aberration well ahead of Death's Shadow.
If budget isn't an option you will notice all of us run Survival of the Fittest for that purpose. LoL troll is just too slow either way to be honest. Unless your Mime list has a massive creature list I doubt it will make an impact.
What do you guys think of the new Pongify? Is it worth running two of them? I mean its like the cheapest and most versatile creature removal in our colors. I was considering Slaughter Pact for a while but now they made that new card.
I really like the new Pongify and I am definitely going to start running one or both of them in my deck. The only obstacle is finding somewhere to fit it (them) in, but I'm sure there are cards that can be cut to upgrade my removal.
Yeah, you're right. I was just looking at a body with regenerate and discard outlet with trample and thought it would be a good body to dredge up with Mimeoplasm and stick 13 counters on it with Death's Shadow. I suppose other than that it's not all that great.
If you're trying to reanimate something out of your yard, these help immensely. They will be in my build from now on. They allow super early Jin.
I haven't really had a problem with having a second target for The Mimeoplasm when trying to reanimate Jin-Gitaxias because The Mimeoplasm never really comes out before turn 4-5, at which point someone has usually activated a Sakura-Tribe Elder, Skullclamped a dude to draw cards, or traded creatures in combat, which means I almost always have a second target for The Mimeoplasm to exile.
I have had to deal with a bit more graveyard hate in meta lately, but I don't really think these are the best answers to it. Krosan Grip and Voidslime are really good ways to shut down the artifacts that can be sacrificed to exile your graveyard. For the ones you mentioned, the best way to deal with them is really to just destroy them before they get a chance to do too much damage. The thing is though, the best way to deal with all graveyard hate is to just not overextend too much. Just drop a couple threatening things into the graveyard at once, so that if they get removed, you'll have more stuff ready to go in your hand.
If you wish to play as competitive as possible and budget isn't a big concern I would recommend Entomb into Jin/Skittles turn 1. Turn 2 you Reanimate it. With a turn 1 and 2 swamp you can be swinging with Skittles turn 2. Most people have an issue dealing with this. Jin is even better in large game as it is unlikely for you to take out more than one player with Skittles. Without hands though it is much harder for your opponents to do anything to you. Either case generally becomes archenemy. But who cares when they're toast really?
I have near zero graveyard hate in my meta so perhaps I am not the best person to help with this. I do run Grim Discovery in my Maga list to get back my commander (Cabal Coffers). It is amazing in that deck.
I feel like in this situation why bother running cards to save a single card from graveyard hate? I feel like it makes more sense to just run an answer to their hate in the first place. Creature spot removal such as Pongify (or the new 2.0) will take care of the Wretch quite nicely. Krosan Grip as it has split second can be used in response to them trying to exile your yard. Abrupt Decay and Beast Within are all starts and deal with both. Voidslime in a bind can be used to counter their activated ability as well. I recommend that one to stop Bojuka Bog type of effects.
I would also recommend taking advantage of the decks tricks more. While there are many tricks I'll give just one example. You can wait until there is no hate on the field and using your Alchemist's Refuge you can EoT a Buried Alive into a Lord of Extinction + Invisible Stalker/Nether Traitor + other. Using Cavern of Souls you can ensure it can't be countered. You will then either have a lethal, haste, near unblockable or a lethal, hexproof, unblockable. Either most of the time means GG.
This post has a lot of good suggestions in it. The turn 1+2 Entomb then Reanimate is probably the most broken thing the deck can do, and leads to some bery easy victories if you manage to pull it off.
The Mimeoplasm needs two targets to be able to exile creatures in graveyards. There are times when you need an extra creature. Both Street Wraith and Architects of Will help this along just that much more, plus you can pitch them to Survival of the Fittest. Which should be in every Mimeoplasm deck. This increases the creature count to help this enchantment.
Entombing for Skittles isn't competitive though, I must disagree. It's just not good at all really. If it gets removed you get nothing at all. No advantage. Jin is far superior. Or, if you have Life from the Loam in hand, even reanimating Braids Cabal Minion is just better than going all in on Skittles.
Even so, none of those creatures guarantees any kind of win. It's just nice to immediately draw 7 with Jin and maybe discard their hand. It's also nice to exile Jin so it can't be used against you.
I when I see an opening, I usually use Intuition for Jin and Sphinx when I can't assemble a combo and just exile with the Plasm.
I think combos that kill everyone are the best way to go, using one shots with the plasm allows other players time to react.
Skittles may not be the most competetive way to win, but I would say it's far from bad, and if your opponets don't have any instant speed spot removal in hand then they are just dead on the spot. Braids is actually an interesting option that I never realy considered for a reanimator package. It definitely has the potential to shut people down early if you can't get Jin-Gitaxias for some reason. I'm personally not running any combos right now, but I don't have anything against them. I used to run an infinite turn package, but it was just a little bit too broken for my playgroup to handle.
Edit: Urban Evolution... I like it. Worth at least testing in my land loving build.
Mind Grind seems good for those who build Mime around using opponent's graveyards
As I said, Consuming Aberration seems good in abuild which tries to win by setting a huge Mimeoplasm on an evasive creature and swinging for the win. I don't currently run Lord of Extinction in my main build, so I doubt that Aberration will be able to find a spot. Urban Evolution seems pretty weak to me as paying 5 to draw three and ramp myself by one just seems underwhelming. It's a solid value card, but it's quite a bit of mana for an effect that isn't really game changing. Mind Grind seems really awesome for a mill focused build. I really like the way they're using the "mill until x lands are revealed" type of cards, similar to Mind Funeral from Alara Reborn.
Whew, that was a lot to respond to. I still have to go through and make a few updates to the OP, but I think that I've got all the responses in this post. Keep up the good work guys!
I was actually coming back to ask your opinions on including Phyrexian Dreadnought in your build, since you're running Trinket Mage. The Dreadnought could be tutored up by Trinket Mage then played to either go straight in the graveyard, or as a sac outlet for some of your other creatures, taking advantage of Grave Pact effects. If you let him go straight to your grave then he could be used for his 12 +1/+1 counters when you cast Mime.
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My Commanders:
:symg::symu::symb: The Mimeoplasm
:symg::symu::symb: Damia, Sage of Stone
:symr::symg::symw: Mayael the Anima
:symw::symu::symb: Sharuum the Hegemon
:symg::symu: Prime Speaker Zegana
:symb::symr: Olivia Voldaren
:symu::symb: Grimgrin, Corpse-Born
:symr::symw: Tajic, Blade of the Legion
Geth, Lord of the Vault
I was actually coming back to ask your opinions on including Phyrexian Dreadnought in your build, since you're running Trinket Mage. The Dreadnought could be tutored up by Trinket Mage then played to either go straight in the graveyard, or as a sac outlet for some of your other creatures, taking advantage of Grave Pact effects. If you let him go straight to your grave then he could be used for his 12 +1/+1 counters when you cast Mime.
I never thought about the fact that you could use him with Trinket Mage. That's pretty cool. However, I prefer that the creatures that I'm using with The Mimeoplasm have some kind of additional benefit besides just being a big body. Certainly Phyrexian Dreadnought and Death's Shadow can provide a huge body at a cheap cost, but for the most part their usefulness ends there. They're not useful to reanimate or to attack with. They don't have any useful ETB effects so I just feel like they would be dead cards too often.
I never thought about the fact that you could use him with Trinket Mage. That's pretty cool. However, I prefer that the creatures that I'm using with The Mimeoplasm have some kind of additional benefit besides just being a big body. Certainly Phyrexian Dreadnought and Death's Shadow can provide a huge body at a cheap cost, but for the most part their usefulness ends there. They're not useful to reanimate or to attack with. They don't have any useful ETB effects so I just feel like they would be dead cards too often.
Yeah I guess his use is somewhat limited, but the fact you can tutor for him with Trinket Mage is pretty cool, I think. In a creature-heavy deck it would probably be worth including. It's a decent sac outlet for Kokusho, Genesis, Terastodon, especially if you've got a Mimic Vat on the field. Its 12 +1/+1 counters could end the game quickly, and it's got Trample so it doesn't make a bad body.
Maybe somebody out there could come up with some crazy combo using this thing.
My Commanders:
:symg::symu::symb: The Mimeoplasm
:symg::symu::symb: Damia, Sage of Stone
:symr::symg::symw: Mayael the Anima
:symw::symu::symb: Sharuum the Hegemon
:symg::symu: Prime Speaker Zegana
:symb::symr: Olivia Voldaren
:symu::symb: Grimgrin, Corpse-Born
:symr::symw: Tajic, Blade of the Legion
Geth, Lord of the Vault
Yeah I guess his use is somewhat limited, but the fact you can tutor for him with Trinket Mage is pretty cool, I think. In a creature-heavy deck it would probably be worth including. It's a decent sac outlet for Kokusho, Genesis, Terastodon, especially if you've got a Mimic Vat on the field. Its 12 +1/+1 counters could end the game quickly, and it's got Trample so it doesn't make a bad body.
Maybe somebody out there could come up with some crazy combo using this thing.
There are definitely way to make good use of it, I just don't think that it fits in my list specifically. It may be much better in your list, so by all means test it, and run it if it suits your deck.
I cut Kodoma's Reach for Gilded Drake. I managed to get one in a trade and I figured Reach was the weakest card.
Yeah Gilded Drake is awesome. I don't own a copy myself, but my friend does and I have benefitted many times from copying it an abusing it with Havengul Lich.
If you want to make a planeswalkers deck then you sort of need to make room for them lol. But if you're enjoying BUG without them then by all means go for it. PWs are generally less optimal then other choices.
Yeah that green primordial is incredible. The black one seems extremely powerful as well. Obviously they are better the more players there are, but even with just 2-3 opponents it's basically a mini Primeval Titan stapled to a Terastodon for 5GG. This cycle will definitely see a lot of play in EDH, probably even more so than the Titan cycle since all of these have incredible effects, as compared to the Titans where only Primeval Titan and Sun Titan are really very good in EDH.
I have really been considering removing all counters and spot removal from my deck. I really feel like they slow my clock down. Right now I run Beast Within, Pongify, Abrupt Decay, Putrefy, Voidslime, Spell Crumple, Forbid and Hinder. I will keep my sweeps I figure in Damnation, Cyclonic Rift, Life's Final & Living Death. I think I will keep Forbid just for the buyback. Way too easy to keep a Forbid lock on somebody with this deck.
I feel like that is 7 slots extra to speed me up. I was thinking 2 extra ramp, 2 extra threats, 3 extra draw spells
Have you ever tried such a thing? I tried out an Edric build at one point in time that ran zero removal including sweeps. I understand you need creature density in that deck to make it function but I never once thought I needed removal. The deck was really good as well.
I have really been considering removing all counters and spot removal from my deck. I really feel like they slow my clock down. Right now I run Beast Within, Pongify, Abrupt Decay, Putrefy, Voidslime, Spell Crumple, Forbid and Hinder. I will keep my sweeps I figure in Damnation, Cyclonic Rift, Life's Final & Living Death. I think I will keep Forbid just for the buyback. Way too easy to keep a Forbid lock on somebody with this deck.
I feel like that is 7 slots extra to speed me up. I was thinking 2 extra ramp, 2 extra threats, 3 extra draw spells
Have you ever tried such a thing? I tried out an Edric build at one point in time that ran zero removal including sweeps. I understand you need creature density in that deck to make it function but I never once thought I needed removal. The deck was really good as well.
I usually play a bit of a slower game where I sit back and then go for the win once I see an opportunity, so sacrificing some control elements would not be ideal for me, though it is definitely an interesting idea for some builds. I think I would just feel naked without any way to stop anything that my opponents are trying to do.
It's the classic question of answers vs threats. Having a lot of threats will ensure that you are always able to put some type pf pressure on, but it is much easier to beat several threats with one answer than it is to beat several answers with one threat. From what I understand it sounds like you're trying to take this deck in a more aggressive direction, which is prefectly fine. It's not my first choice for play style, but I can see it working it the right situation.
However, in any deck I think you still want at least a few ways to interact with your opponents. Even combo decks, which tend to be the least interactive of all, usually still play at least a few removal or counters so that they can protect themselves until they go off. I would be surprised to not at least see something like Pongify or Beast Within in an Edric deck, since there are certain cards which completely shut him down.
So I guess my answer is no, I have never built a deck like that. I would also encourage you to try it out and let the rest of us back here know how it turns out. There is always room to test new things and innovate on current decks, but you never know when or where you will find these things. The best way to improve on decks is by simply playing with them, finding out what works and what doesn't, and then finding ways to fix the things that don't work while enhancing the things that do work.
I feel like Mime is a fast enough deck potentially that this could work. I'm going to try it out and give it 15 or so games before I make any judgement on it. Was hoping another Mime player might have gone thought this before though to tell me it didn't work.
Yeah, you're right. I was just looking at a body with regenerate and discard outlet with trample and thought it would be a good body to dredge up with Mimeoplasm and stick 13 counters on it with Death's Shadow. I suppose other than that it's not all that great.
I'll have to pick up a copy of Survival of the Fittest. Thanks for the input!
Here's the list I've concocted that I've yet to test:
1x Acidic Slime
1x Coiling Oracle
1x Deadeye Navigator
1x Dimir Doppelganger
1x Disciple of Bolas
1x Duplicant
1x Eternal Witness
1x Fauna Shaman
1x Fleshbag Marauder
1x Havengul Lich
1x Inkwell Leviathan
1x Invisible Stalker
1x Lord of Extinction
1x Mulldrifter
1x Nezumi Graverobber
1x Phantasmal Image
1x Phyrexian Metamorph
1x Puppeteer Clique
1x Rune-Scarred Demon
1x Sheoldred, Whispering One
1x Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon
1x Snapcaster Mage
1x Solemn Simulacrum
1x Terastodon
1x Trinket Mage
1x Trygon Predator
1x Viscera Seer
1x Wurmcoil Engine
1x Yavimaya Elder
1x Animate Dead
1x Phyrexian Arena
1x Phyrexian Reclamation
1x Rhystic Study
Sorcery (13)
1x Beacon of Unrest
1x Buried Alive
1x Damnation
1x Dread Return
1x Green Sun's Zenith
1x Jarad's Orders
1x Life from the Loam
1x Life's Finale
1x Living Death
1x Reanimate
1x Rite of Replication
1x Stitch Together
Instant (8)
1x Abrupt Decay
1x Beast Within
1x Capsize
1x Cyclonic Rift
1x Fact or Fiction
1x Golgari Charm
1x Noxious Revival
1x Putrefy
Artifact (7)
1x Birthing Pod
1x Chromatic Lantern
1x Darksteel Ingot
1x Lightning Greaves
1x Mimic Vat
1x Nihil Spellbomb
1x Skullclamp
1x Sol Ring
5x Forest
3x Island
8x Swamp
1x Alchemist's Refuge
1x Barren Moor
1x Command Tower
1x Dimir Aqueduct
1x Drowned Catacomb
1x Ghost Quarter
1x Golgari Rot Farm
1x Hinterland Harbor
1x Lonely Sandbar
1x Maze of Ith
1x Mystifying Maze
1x Nephalia Drownyard
1x Overgrown Tomb
1x Shizo, Death's Storehouse
1x Simic Growth Chamber
1x Strip Mine
1x Svogthos, the Restless Tomb
1x Tainted Isle
1x Tectonic Edge
1x Temple of the False God
1x Tolaria West
1x Tranquil Thicket
:symg::symu::symb: The Mimeoplasm
:symg::symu::symb: Damia, Sage of Stone
:symr::symg::symw: Mayael the Anima
:symw::symu::symb: Sharuum the Hegemon
:symg::symu: Prime Speaker Zegana
:symb::symr: Olivia Voldaren
:symu::symb: Grimgrin, Corpse-Born
:symr::symw: Tajic, Blade of the Legion
Geth, Lord of the Vault
The Mimeoplasm
Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Rhys the Redeemed
Merieke Ri Berit
Nekusar, the Mindrazer
Cromat Wurm Tribal
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Looking for Green friendly EDH players/groups in the Toronto area. PM me if this is you.
Street Wraith and Architects of Will
If you're trying to reanimate something out of your yard, these help immensely. They will be in my build from now on. They allow super early Jin.
Just curious why those two suggestions?
The Mimeoplasm
Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Rhys the Redeemed
Merieke Ri Berit
Nekusar, the Mindrazer
Cromat Wurm Tribal
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Looking for Green friendly EDH players/groups in the Toronto area. PM me if this is you.
:symg::symu::symb: The Mimeoplasm
:symg::symu::symb: Damia, Sage of Stone
:symr::symg::symw: Mayael the Anima
:symw::symu::symb: Sharuum the Hegemon
:symg::symu: Prime Speaker Zegana
:symb::symr: Olivia Voldaren
:symu::symb: Grimgrin, Corpse-Born
:symr::symw: Tajic, Blade of the Legion
Geth, Lord of the Vault
If you wish to play as competitive as possible and budget isn't a big concern I would recommend Entomb into Jin/Skittles turn 1. Turn 2 you Reanimate it. With a turn 1 and 2 swamp you can be swinging with Skittles turn 2. Most people have an issue dealing with this. Jin is even better in large game as it is unlikely for you to take out more than one player with Skittles. Without hands though it is much harder for your opponents to do anything to you. Either case generally becomes archenemy. But who cares when they're toast really?
I have near zero graveyard hate in my meta so perhaps I am not the best person to help with this. I do run Grim Discovery in my Maga list to get back my commander (Cabal Coffers). It is amazing in that deck.
I feel like in this situation why bother running cards to save a single card from graveyard hate? I feel like it makes more sense to just run an answer to their hate in the first place. Creature spot removal such as Pongify (or the new 2.0) will take care of the Wretch quite nicely. Krosan Grip as it has split second can be used in response to them trying to exile your yard. Abrupt Decay and Beast Within are all starts and deal with both. Voidslime in a bind can be used to counter their activated ability as well. I recommend that one to stop Bojuka Bog type of effects.
I would also recommend taking advantage of the decks tricks more. While there are many tricks I'll give just one example. You can wait until there is no hate on the field and using your Alchemist's Refuge you can EoT a Buried Alive into a Lord of Extinction + Invisible Stalker/Nether Traitor + other. Using Cavern of Souls you can ensure it can't be countered. You will then either have a lethal, haste, near unblockable or a lethal, hexproof, unblockable. Either most of the time means GG.
The Mimeoplasm
Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Rhys the Redeemed
Merieke Ri Berit
Nekusar, the Mindrazer
Cromat Wurm Tribal
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Looking for Green friendly EDH players/groups in the Toronto area. PM me if this is you.
The Mimeoplasm needs two targets to be able to exile creatures in graveyards. There are times when you need an extra creature. Both Street Wraith and Architects of Will help this along just that much more, plus you can pitch them to Survival of the Fittest. Which should be in every Mimeoplasm deck. This increases the creature count to help this enchantment.
Entombing for Skittles isn't competitive though, I must disagree. It's just not good at all really. If it gets removed you get nothing at all. No advantage. Jin is far superior. Or, if you have Life from the Loam in hand, even reanimating Braids Cabal Minion is just better than going all in on Skittles.
Even so, none of those creatures guarantees any kind of win. It's just nice to immediately draw 7 with Jin and maybe discard their hand. It's also nice to exile Jin so it can't be used against you.
I when I see an opening, I usually use Intuition for Jin and Sphinx when I can't assemble a combo and just exile with the Plasm.
I think combos that kill everyone are the best way to go, using one shots with the plasm allows other players time to react.
I play in mostly 1v1v1 games. Skittles can be an amazing target to reanimate in a small game. I frequently kill one of them before skittles is dead. After skittles returns as mime I can often get another one. I think this is a very meta specific question. I pretty much play with the same 3-4 people most every time. There is a fairly diverse selections of decks however. If I am going up against deck(s) I know have issues with early game spot removal than why not grab a skittles?
I honestly can't stand combo though. I have built 8 decks and none involve board killing combos. I wont even play T&N as I think it's a stupid lazy card. Same reason I hate infinty. I just hate moments where I say to myself "wow... that was a waste of an hour for the other 3 players that had a whole game ahead of them". I don't mind players having a chance to react. If I can overcome an entire table one at a time with them knowing what is about to happen that is true skill/deck building in my opinion. Again, my personal preference though. If you want to play game ending combo be my guest. The combo debate has it's own place and this isn't it.
The Mimeoplasm
Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Rhys the Redeemed
Merieke Ri Berit
Nekusar, the Mindrazer
Cromat Wurm Tribal
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Looking for Green friendly EDH players/groups in the Toronto area. PM me if this is you.
Every T&N combo I can think of can be answered with simple instant speed spot removal.
It's interesting that you start debating about combos out of nowhere, and then end your statements by saying this isn't the place to be talking about combos. It's like someone giving their opinion, then saying no one else is allowed to talk about it.
I do however completely understand why people use words like stupid and lazy to describe magic cards as it's a passive attempt at calling the people who use those cards the exact derogatory terms you've used to describe the cards. It's kinda like smoke and mirrors.
Anyways, I've noticed you tried using the word competitive.....
I'll post a much larger update in the near future and reply to a lot of the posts that have been made since the last time I posted in here.
GUB [Retired Primer] The Mimeoplasm BUG
Modern: UR Storm RU
Cube: WUBRG Pauper Cube GRBUW
Credit for the banner goes to DarkNightCavalier at Heroes of the Plane Studios
I also believe that any combo, not just T&N, has an answer. Be it in the form of instant speed removal, counters or activated abilities. That doesn't really stop the card from being what it is. I just think it is a weak way to win. Never really liked cards that are basically "win in a box"
Competitive is a subjective term as well. I'm sure you understand this. Competitive to me means plays like that and worse. Does that mean my meta is ultra competitive? Not a chance. None of us play Zur, Azami, Scion, or any of those other high level decks. A game ending before the 8th turn isn't commonplace. Compared to how we started playing "casual" EDH originally some of our decks are very competitive in my opinion. Would they get steam rolled by true tier 1 play? Almost certainly. Not how I play.
Thoughts on Consuming Aberration DTrain?
Edit: Urban Evolution... I like it. Worth at least testing in my land loving build.
Mind Grind seems good for those who build Mime around using opponent's graveyards
The Mimeoplasm
Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Rhys the Redeemed
Merieke Ri Berit
Nekusar, the Mindrazer
Cromat Wurm Tribal
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Looking for Green friendly EDH players/groups in the Toronto area. PM me if this is you.
Sever the Bloodline can definitely provide some nice card advantage, but I think what I'm currently looking to fit in is something that's cheap and instant speed. I think the closest thing we have to Swords to Plowshares in this color combination would be Pongify.
I used to run Massacre Wurm, but there aren't really any token deck in my group currently, so it's not really needed. I also don't run Putrefy right now because I've been testing Abrupt Decay in its place. I think I'm going to stick with Decay because my meta is starting to have a lot of control decks, and the ability to hit enchantments is also very relevant. At this point I think it's worth giving up the ability to hit CMC 4 or greater in my group. However, this is could be very different for your group so it's best to make your own call on that.
Yes, Alchemist's Refuge is indeed very powerful. I cut it from the deck for a while, but I think I'm going to add it back in because it fuels some very explosive plays.
I added your decklist to the "Other People's Decklists" in the primer. I really like Consuming Aberration for certain builds of the deck. If your plan is to go lethal with a huge Mimeoplasm, then it's certainly another great option alongside Lord of Extinction. I personally prefer the Skithiryx plan backed up by some control and reanimator elements, but both versions have their merits. I actually really want to turn my budget version into a second deck so that I can play a lot of the cards that haven't made the cut in my main list.
Yeah, sadly this has become an issue for all non-basic lands. I don't see the ones I want nearly as much without Primeval Titan, which significantly hampers their usefulness.
Tolaria West is a card that I'm not really sure on. It's certainly great that it gives you the ability to transmute for another land, but the fact that it comes into play tapped if you need to play it as a land is a major downside. I'm pretty light on ETB tapped lands right now, so maybe I'll give it a shot. As for the new Zameck Guildmage, it can be a pretty consistent draw outlet that shouldn't attract much hate, but I tend to prefer more efficient and powerful draw that can give me more cards and for less mana.
I've already commented about Zameck Guildmage above, but I'll address the other two here. They both would be very good in a mill oriented build of the deck, where you could get full value out of their abilities. In this version I don't think they're at their best since I don't usually have a constant stream of cards entering the graveyard. That combo with Duskmantle Guildmage and Traumatize is pretty cool and will probably find it's way into my budget / second list. I think Lazav would be really good as a general in his own deck, where you could build around milling powerful creatures into the graveyard to turn him into. He would also work well, as I said earlier, in a Mimeoplasm deck that was much more dedicated to milling than this one. He reminds me of a combination of Sakashima the Imposter and Dimir Doppelganger, but perhaps even better than either.
I have definitely found that their are superior discard outlets to Lotleth Troll, especially the aforementioned Survival of the Fittest and it's creature version, Fauna Shaman. If you want a lot of discard outlets then perhaps Lotleth Troll could be one of your later choices, but make sure you're running those other 2 first. As for Death's Shadow, it's certainly big, but it doesn't do anything other than serve as fodder for The Mimeoplasm to copy. If you're looking for cards to fill this role, I would suggest Lord of Extinction and the new Consuming Aberration well ahead of Death's Shadow.
Yep, my thoughts exactly.
I really like the new Pongify and I am definitely going to start running one or both of them in my deck. The only obstacle is finding somewhere to fit it (them) in, but I'm sure there are cards that can be cut to upgrade my removal.
I can add your decklist to the "Other People's Decklists" section of the primer if you would like.
I haven't really had a problem with having a second target for The Mimeoplasm when trying to reanimate Jin-Gitaxias because The Mimeoplasm never really comes out before turn 4-5, at which point someone has usually activated a Sakura-Tribe Elder, Skullclamped a dude to draw cards, or traded creatures in combat, which means I almost always have a second target for The Mimeoplasm to exile.
I have had to deal with a bit more graveyard hate in meta lately, but I don't really think these are the best answers to it. Krosan Grip and Voidslime are really good ways to shut down the artifacts that can be sacrificed to exile your graveyard. For the ones you mentioned, the best way to deal with them is really to just destroy them before they get a chance to do too much damage. The thing is though, the best way to deal with all graveyard hate is to just not overextend too much. Just drop a couple threatening things into the graveyard at once, so that if they get removed, you'll have more stuff ready to go in your hand.
This post has a lot of good suggestions in it. The turn 1+2 Entomb then Reanimate is probably the most broken thing the deck can do, and leads to some bery easy victories if you manage to pull it off.
Skittles may not be the most competetive way to win, but I would say it's far from bad, and if your opponets don't have any instant speed spot removal in hand then they are just dead on the spot. Braids is actually an interesting option that I never realy considered for a reanimator package. It definitely has the potential to shut people down early if you can't get Jin-Gitaxias for some reason. I'm personally not running any combos right now, but I don't have anything against them. I used to run an infinite turn package, but it was just a little bit too broken for my playgroup to handle.
As I said, Consuming Aberration seems good in abuild which tries to win by setting a huge Mimeoplasm on an evasive creature and swinging for the win. I don't currently run Lord of Extinction in my main build, so I doubt that Aberration will be able to find a spot. Urban Evolution seems pretty weak to me as paying 5 to draw three and ramp myself by one just seems underwhelming. It's a solid value card, but it's quite a bit of mana for an effect that isn't really game changing. Mind Grind seems really awesome for a mill focused build. I really like the way they're using the "mill until x lands are revealed" type of cards, similar to Mind Funeral from Alara Reborn.
Whew, that was a lot to respond to. I still have to go through and make a few updates to the OP, but I think that I've got all the responses in this post. Keep up the good work guys!
GUB [Retired Primer] The Mimeoplasm BUG
Modern: UR Storm RU
Cube: WUBRG Pauper Cube GRBUW
Credit for the banner goes to DarkNightCavalier at Heroes of the Plane Studios
I was actually coming back to ask your opinions on including Phyrexian Dreadnought in your build, since you're running Trinket Mage. The Dreadnought could be tutored up by Trinket Mage then played to either go straight in the graveyard, or as a sac outlet for some of your other creatures, taking advantage of Grave Pact effects. If you let him go straight to your grave then he could be used for his 12 +1/+1 counters when you cast Mime.
:symg::symu::symb: The Mimeoplasm
:symg::symu::symb: Damia, Sage of Stone
:symr::symg::symw: Mayael the Anima
:symw::symu::symb: Sharuum the Hegemon
:symg::symu: Prime Speaker Zegana
:symb::symr: Olivia Voldaren
:symu::symb: Grimgrin, Corpse-Born
:symr::symw: Tajic, Blade of the Legion
Geth, Lord of the Vault
I never thought about the fact that you could use him with Trinket Mage. That's pretty cool. However, I prefer that the creatures that I'm using with The Mimeoplasm have some kind of additional benefit besides just being a big body. Certainly Phyrexian Dreadnought and Death's Shadow can provide a huge body at a cheap cost, but for the most part their usefulness ends there. They're not useful to reanimate or to attack with. They don't have any useful ETB effects so I just feel like they would be dead cards too often.
GUB [Retired Primer] The Mimeoplasm BUG
Modern: UR Storm RU
Cube: WUBRG Pauper Cube GRBUW
Credit for the banner goes to DarkNightCavalier at Heroes of the Plane Studios
Yeah I guess his use is somewhat limited, but the fact you can tutor for him with Trinket Mage is pretty cool, I think. In a creature-heavy deck it would probably be worth including. It's a decent sac outlet for Kokusho, Genesis, Terastodon, especially if you've got a Mimic Vat on the field. Its 12 +1/+1 counters could end the game quickly, and it's got Trample so it doesn't make a bad body.
Maybe somebody out there could come up with some crazy combo using this thing.
Perhaps the fact that Death's Shadow and Phyrexian Dreadnought almost always die upon entry, a deck could be built abusing Grave Pact or Harvester of Souls effects, or just straight up discard.
:symg::symu::symb: The Mimeoplasm
:symg::symu::symb: Damia, Sage of Stone
:symr::symg::symw: Mayael the Anima
:symw::symu::symb: Sharuum the Hegemon
:symg::symu: Prime Speaker Zegana
:symb::symr: Olivia Voldaren
:symu::symb: Grimgrin, Corpse-Born
:symr::symw: Tajic, Blade of the Legion
Geth, Lord of the Vault
There are definitely way to make good use of it, I just don't think that it fits in my list specifically. It may be much better in your list, so by all means test it, and run it if it suits your deck.
GUB [Retired Primer] The Mimeoplasm BUG
Modern: UR Storm RU
Cube: WUBRG Pauper Cube GRBUW
Credit for the banner goes to DarkNightCavalier at Heroes of the Plane Studios
GWUBAtraxa, Praetor's Voice PrimerGWUB
GWURoon Bant Blink WhateverGWU
BRGLord Windgrace LandsBRG
Yeah Gilded Drake is awesome. I don't own a copy myself, but my friend does and I have benefitted many times from copying it an abusing it with Havengul Lich.
GUB [Retired Primer] The Mimeoplasm BUG
Modern: UR Storm RU
Cube: WUBRG Pauper Cube GRBUW
Credit for the banner goes to DarkNightCavalier at Heroes of the Plane Studios
If you want to make a planeswalkers deck then you sort of need to make room for them lol. But if you're enjoying BUG without them then by all means go for it. PWs are generally less optimal then other choices.
GWUBAtraxa, Praetor's Voice PrimerGWUB
GWURoon Bant Blink WhateverGWU
BRGLord Windgrace LandsBRG
GUB [Retired Primer] The Mimeoplasm BUG
Modern: UR Storm RU
Cube: WUBRG Pauper Cube GRBUW
Credit for the banner goes to DarkNightCavalier at Heroes of the Plane Studios
I feel like that is 7 slots extra to speed me up. I was thinking 2 extra ramp, 2 extra threats, 3 extra draw spells
Have you ever tried such a thing? I tried out an Edric build at one point in time that ran zero removal including sweeps. I understand you need creature density in that deck to make it function but I never once thought I needed removal. The deck was really good as well.
The Mimeoplasm
Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Rhys the Redeemed
Merieke Ri Berit
Nekusar, the Mindrazer
Cromat Wurm Tribal
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Looking for Green friendly EDH players/groups in the Toronto area. PM me if this is you.
I usually play a bit of a slower game where I sit back and then go for the win once I see an opportunity, so sacrificing some control elements would not be ideal for me, though it is definitely an interesting idea for some builds. I think I would just feel naked without any way to stop anything that my opponents are trying to do.
It's the classic question of answers vs threats. Having a lot of threats will ensure that you are always able to put some type pf pressure on, but it is much easier to beat several threats with one answer than it is to beat several answers with one threat. From what I understand it sounds like you're trying to take this deck in a more aggressive direction, which is prefectly fine. It's not my first choice for play style, but I can see it working it the right situation.
However, in any deck I think you still want at least a few ways to interact with your opponents. Even combo decks, which tend to be the least interactive of all, usually still play at least a few removal or counters so that they can protect themselves until they go off. I would be surprised to not at least see something like Pongify or Beast Within in an Edric deck, since there are certain cards which completely shut him down.
So I guess my answer is no, I have never built a deck like that. I would also encourage you to try it out and let the rest of us back here know how it turns out. There is always room to test new things and innovate on current decks, but you never know when or where you will find these things. The best way to improve on decks is by simply playing with them, finding out what works and what doesn't, and then finding ways to fix the things that don't work while enhancing the things that do work.
GUB [Retired Primer] The Mimeoplasm BUG
Modern: UR Storm RU
Cube: WUBRG Pauper Cube GRBUW
Credit for the banner goes to DarkNightCavalier at Heroes of the Plane Studios
The Mimeoplasm
Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Rhys the Redeemed
Merieke Ri Berit
Nekusar, the Mindrazer
Cromat Wurm Tribal
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Looking for Green friendly EDH players/groups in the Toronto area. PM me if this is you.