And keep lifelink in and deathtouch in :symb:. Ohaithar Wurmcoil Engine. I love the use of artifact/colorless spells to make certain otherwise-restricted-to-one-color aspects of the color pie available to all, in an appropriately limited amount.
Just for the record, Wurmcoil is one of my least favorite cards as well.
Up to 10 lands, and if there's 50 lands in play in a 5 player game (not uncommon), that's not a back-breaking play by a long shot.
Terastodoncan punish multicolor decks over mono. If you only have a handful of lands fixing your colors at the moment and Terastodon nukes them, you're effectively screwed. Have fun with your 3/3 tokens.
50 lands in a 5-player game. But what's the chance that it's an even 10-10-10-10-10 split?
If it's an even split, you're still thinking about it wrong. That would make it 10 lands out of 40 (you don't count your own). So if you get to selectively destroy 25% of the lands, you aren't doing serious damage?
And would you ever want to play a 5-color deck if Sundering Titan was played in your group?
Sundering Titan doesn't target. Also it's really bad at killing the rampiest of ramp decks - mono green.
you know what i meant, though you are right i shouldnt be throwing round the word targeted on this forum
its not just mono green though, G/x decks as well. and lets be honest, are you really going to kill lands of someone who isn't the hideous ramp-threat that green is?
you know what i meant, though you are right i shouldnt be throwing round the word targeted on this forum
its not just mono green though, G/x decks as well. and lets be honest, are you really going to kill lands of someone who isn't the hideous ramp-threat that green is?
I play Titan in Vorinclex and Sasaya, so yes, I will. Frequently.
This format literally started with only three-color decks legal. It's supposed to be the format where newbies can put all their favorite sweet cards in one deck, not a place where "greedy" decks need to be "punished."
Besides, I often see the most broken deck at the table with a land count of one original dual, an M10 land, a filter land, a Reflecting Pool, a City of Brass, and four utility lands, leaving them to lose one land to Sundering Titan while the poor kid with the Ghave Precon loses three basic lands. Twice.
This is where I disagree Devon. Why shouldn't a greedy deck be punished for indulging in too much of one thing? Sure it's fun to ramp half the lands in your deck onto the table by turn 6, but it gets old when people don't do anything to stop it. I understand everyone wants to do their own thing in Commander, but half the fun comes from when everyone is interacting with everyone else, causing all sorts of stuff to happen that you normally wouldn't expect.
Monogreen decks don't get crippled by Sundering Titan all that much, but not every ramp deck is monogreen. Many of them are at least one color, if not three colors or more.
Honestly I'm surprised to see this many people actually want Sundering Titan back. I'm also surprised it wasn't banned sooner. Sundering Titan totally needed to be banned, it was far too powerful of a multicolor hoser in colorless no less. I'm all for land hate, it's a necessary evil, but it shouldn't be colorless.
People also seem to think Sundering Titan gone means all mass LD is gone. When in fact it's just a little less one sided now. Multicolor decks were already slower than mono color decks since as multicolor you have to fix your colors, sundering titan only broadens that gap.
Unfortunately every try hard from Sacramento to Shanghai preaches from the top of their 27 lands + Mana Reflection that Tooth and Nail and Time Stretch are fine to play in the same turn but Armageddon is unfair.
Who the hell wants to play Sundering Titan? If you are one of those people, I really have no incentive to play with you because you are most likely a try hard Spike EDH player who just gets off ruining people's fun who enjoy playing with goofy cards (what EDH is about last time I checked) and all you care about is winning. Mass LD in EDH is lame, and the majority of EDH players particularly do not enjoy it. Good riddance to a card that only creates negative reactions every time it hits the board. If people's arguments are that it sucks against hosing ramp, that even furthers the case that it hurts decks who are aren't ramping and are just trying to play a regular game of EDH. If you truly want to hose ramp, try Acid Rain or color hoser cards who get greedy with their color strengths. Thank goodness I never have to see this annoying card ever again when I just want to play a chill game of EDH.
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Who the hell wants to play Sundering Titan? If you are one of those people, I really have no incentive to play with you because you are most likely a try hard Spike EDH player who just gets off ruining people's fun who enjoy playing with goofy cards (what EDH is about last time I checked) and all you care about is winning. Mass LD in EDH is lame, and the majority of EDH players particularly do not enjoy it. Good riddance to a card that only creates negative reactions every time it hits the board. If people's arguments are that it sucks against hosing ramp, that even furthers the case that it hurts decks who are aren't ramping and are just trying to play a regular game of EDH. If you truly want to hose ramp, try Acid Rain or color hoser cards who get greedy with their color strengths. Thank goodness I never have to see this annoying card ever again when I just want to play a chill game of EDH.
This, is what I hate about the EDH community.
Everyone wants to play their own, simple minded game, and roll a dice on who's fastest. If there's no punishing, no interaction anymore, what kind of format are we playing then?
Maybe I come from a competative playgroup but.. I know everyone is having fun in mine, and they would never have fun in "chill, let's all primetime vorinclex yo"
This, is what I hate about the EDH community.
Everyone wants to play their own, simple minded game, and roll a dice on who's fastest. If there's no punishing, no interaction anymore, what kind of format are we playing then?
Maybe I come from a competative playgroup but.. I know everyone is having fun in mine, and they would never have fun in "chill, let's all primetime vorinclex yo"
Am I alone here in not understanding a single thing you are trying to get across here?
Rolling a dice on who is fastest? Huh?
No punishing? Yeah, that sounds good to me. I would rather have no punishing people for wanting to have fun. It seems like a lot more fun rather than playing with vindictive players who want to "punish" people. Blechh.
No interaction? There is always interaction in EDH, unless you are playing a deck that wins on turn 3-4 without caring what you do.
Also, Primeval Titan and Vorinclex definitely are not the first cards when I think chill EDH. Both typically induce groaning and moaning and boring yawn inducing play where I play at.
I guess I am in the 1% of EDH players who are more interested in making sure other players have fun and not playing as hardcore as possible with the most efficient cards you can use. To me, that is just boring as all hell. I prefer being a nice EDH player that allows people to play their cards and let them have a good time for the duration of the game.
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Unlock and open the door
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Am I alone here in not understanding a single thing you are trying to get across here?
Rolling a dice on who is fastest? Huh?
No punishing? Yeah, that sounds good to me. I would rather have no punishing people for wanting to have fun. It seems like a lot more fun rather than playing with vindictive players who want to "punish" people. Blechh.
No interaction? There is always interaction in EDH, unless you are playing a deck that wins on turn 3-4 without caring what you do.
Also, Primeval Titan and Vorinclex definitely are not the first cards when I think chill EDH. Both typically induce groaning and moaning and boring yawn inducing play where I play at.
I guess I am in the 1% of EDH players who are more interested in making sure other players have fun and not playing as hardcore as possible with the most efficient cards you can use. To me, that is just boring as all hell. I prefer being a nice EDH player that allows people to play their cards and let them have a good time for the duration of the game.
First, you are alone.
Second, wanting to have fun usually equates to ramping out insane amounts of mana before playing stupidly degenerate cards. Therefore Primetime and Vorniclex are perfect casual cards. Only the latter is unviable in a competitive meta.
Third, you are in fact the 1% in that you see EDH as a format which should require no skill, thinking, deck construction or play ability. Go back to Yugioh for that kind of game.
Second, wanting to have fun usually equates to ramping out insane amounts of mana before playing stupidly degenerate cards. Therefore Primetime and Vorniclex are perfect casual cards. Only the latter is unviable in a competitive meta.
Third, you are in fact the 1% in that you see EDH as a format which should require no skill, thinking, deck construction or play ability. Go back to Yugioh for that kind of game.
Wow, hostility much for no reason?
When did I ever say I see EDH "as a format which should require no skill, thinking, deck construction or play ability."?
First of all, EDH IS the format where it doesn't HAVE to require skill, thinking, or deck construction or play ability. It is a format for people who want to do what they please. Wanna play nothing but Homarids? This is the place to do it.
Secondly, if you read what I said which you clearly didn't, I was pointing out that people play with Sundering Titan to bum people out. If it doesn't do much, which many people here have already stated, then what is the point of playing it other then to create a negative experience which 9 times out of 10 it does?
Vorinclex is a winter orb effect. Nobody particularly enjoys Winter Orb. If you do, good for you. I don't want to play with you. You will probably have a great time playing with your uber competitve spike buddies who only care about winning. When I want to play a Spike format, I will go play in a Grand Prix or Legacy open series or whatever and I perfectly understand what I am getting myself into if I get all my mana base destroyed by Wasteland on turn 2-3 or my win-con countered.
BBe the broke or the breakerB
Be the giver or the undertaker
Unlock and open the door
Be the healer or the breaker
The keys are in your hands
Realize you are your own source of all creation BOf your own master planB
When did I ever say I see EDH "as a format which should require no skill, thinking, deck construction or play ability."?
First of all, EDH IS the format where it doesn't HAVE to require skill, thinking, or deck construction or play ability. It is a format for people who want to do what they please. Wanna play nothing but Homarids? This is the place to do it.
Secondly, if you read what I said which you clearly didn't, I was pointing out that people play with Sundering Titan to bum people out. If it doesn't do much, which many people here have already stated, then what is the point of playing it other then to create a negative experience which 9 times out of 10 it does?
Vorinclex is a winter orb effect. Nobody particularly enjoys Winter Orb. If you do, good for you. I don't want to play with you. You will probably have a great time playing with your uber competitve spike buddies who only care about winning. When I want to play a Spike format, I will go play in a Grand Prix or Legacy open series or whatever and I perfectly understand what I am getting myself into if I get all my mana base destroyed by Wasteland on turn 2-3 or my win-con countered.
Playing a couple of Counterspells isn't a Spiky format; it's playing a reasonable game of Magic. If you don't want to think during a Magic game... why are you playing Magic? The whole idea behind the game is that it's a mind test.
Also, you're making ridiculous generalizations about people that like to play certain cards.
Playing a couple of Counterspells isn't a Spiky format; it's playing a reasonable game of Magic. If you don't want to think during a Magic game... why are you playing Magic? The whole idea behind the game is that it's a mind test.
Also, you're making ridiculous generalizations about people that like to play certain cards.
I think plenty when playing EDH. I don't see how taking out counterspells completely removes thought from MTG.
My "ridiculous generalizations" are just from my 3+ years experience of playing EDH with many different people through paper magic or online. The majority of the time people really dislike land destruction, Winter Orb effects (taxing effects as well), and counterspells. I don't know how to tell you any other way than they create negative experiences more often than not. This includes Sundering Titan especially.
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
BBe the broke or the breakerB
Be the giver or the undertaker
Unlock and open the door
Be the healer or the breaker
The keys are in your hands
Realize you are your own source of all creation BOf your own master planB
Honestly I'm surprised to see this many people actually want Sundering Titan back. I'm also surprised it wasn't banned sooner. Sundering Titan totally needed to be banned, it was far too powerful of a multicolor hoser in colorless no less. I'm all for land hate, it's a necessary evil, but it shouldn't be colorless.
People also seem to think Sundering Titan gone means all mass LD is gone. When in fact it's just a little less one sided now. Multicolor decks were already slower than mono color decks since as multicolor you have to fix your colors, sundering titan only broadens that gap.
I wouldn't be suprised at all. The card has basically become such a fringe card. Everyone knows what it does some groups play it some don't. ST was a shinning example of what EDH was about. Groups self regulated. When ever i went to a new group, I always asked about "cards like sundering titan" some groups liked them, some didn't. Also, it was 8 years ago when this was released, nothing substantial changed him, after 8 years, it's safe to say that he's not getting banned. Then wham out of no where ban?
"but you don't need to follow the ban list!" That's such a cop out mentality to justify pissing off a certain group of players. The very definition of a banlist suggests it must be followed.
Who the hell wants to play Sundering Titan? If you are one of those people, I really have no incentive to play with you because you are most likely a try hard Spike EDH player who just gets off ruining people's fun who enjoy playing with goofy cards (what EDH is about last time I checked) and all you care about is winning. Mass LD in EDH is lame, and the majority of EDH players particularly do not enjoy it. Good riddance to a card that only creates negative reactions every time it hits the board. If people's arguments are that it sucks against hosing ramp, that even furthers the case that it hurts decks who are aren't ramping and are just trying to play a regular game of EDH. If you truly want to hose ramp, try Acid Rain or color hoser cards who get greedy with their color strengths. Thank goodness I never have to see this annoying card ever again when I just want to play a chill game of EDH.
regardless of your opinion, I played sundering titan, but how do you know you wouldn't want to play with me? You never even asked me to take it out, you just jumped to conclusions and applied stereotypes.
Am I alone here in not understanding a single thing you are trying to get across here?
Rolling a dice on who is fastest? Huh?
No punishing? Yeah, that sounds good to me. I would rather have no punishing people for wanting to have fun. It seems like a lot more fun rather than playing with vindictive players who want to "punish" people. Blechh.
No interaction? There is always interaction in EDH, unless you are playing a deck that wins on turn 3-4 without caring what you do.
Also, Primeval Titan and Vorinclex definitely are not the first cards when I think chill EDH. Both typically induce groaning and moaning and boring yawn inducing play where I play at.
I guess I am in the 1% of EDH players who are more interested in making sure other players have fun and not playing as hardcore as possible with the most efficient cards you can use. To me, that is just boring as all hell. I prefer being a nice EDH player that allows people to play their cards and let them have a good time for the duration of the game.
Fun starts before the EDH game starts, not from a banlist or fracturing the community by saying only x use sundering titan for y.
When did I ever say I see EDH "as a format which should require no skill, thinking, deck construction or play ability."?
First of all, EDH IS the format where it doesn't HAVE to require skill, thinking, or deck construction or play ability. It is a format for people who want to do what they please. Wanna play nothing but Homarids? This is the place to do it.
Secondly, if you read what I said which you clearly didn't, I was pointing out that people play with Sundering Titan to bum people out. If it doesn't do much, which many people here have already stated, then what is the point of playing it other then to create a negative experience which 9 times out of 10 it does?
Vorinclex is a winter orb effect. Nobody particularly enjoys Winter Orb. If you do, good for you. I don't want to play with you. You will probably have a great time playing with your uber competitve spike buddies who only care about winning. When I want to play a Spike format, I will go play in a Grand Prix or Legacy open series or whatever and I perfectly understand what I am getting myself into if I get all my mana base destroyed by Wasteland on turn 2-3 or my win-con countered.
Magic in its very nature is a skill intensive game and takes years to fully understand. I've been playing since it started, and I just got a lesson in layering. Once again, you present evidence that titan was used to bum people out, sadly I have tons of counter evidence. We can do this all day.
I think plenty when playing EDH. I don't see how taking out counterspells completely removes thought from MTG.
My "ridiculous generalizations" are just from my 3+ years experience of playing EDH with many different people through paper magic or online. The majority of the time people really dislike land destruction, Winter Orb effects (taxing effects as well), and counterspells. I don't know how to tell you any other way than they create negative experiences more often than not. This includes Sundering Titan especially.
By that logic removal should be removed, it does the same thing as a counterspell, it creates a negative experience (the net result is the same).
You don't see anything wrong in removing a key mechanic from the game? Every post you made seems to suggest you want the game to be simplified by removing aspects you don't like.
Here's the funny thing about the titan ban, for the first time... a lot (and I mean a lot) of players are now looking at a butt load of land destruction. Believe it or not, it's not fun watching a player masturbate and drop 12 lands on the table so they can trolololololol tooth and lame ftw. Cheer about the titan being banned, get ready for a new type of EDH deck. In addition to ramp and win, control and win, and combo, you will now have LD and win.
I agree. We should all only play g/x decks because they are the most objectively fun and anyone who disagrees does not know the truth about EDH. Everyone should just play their decks because interaction beyond high fiving about how many land are in play is unfun and equivalent to casting Stasis while kicking puppies. I for one will never play with anyone who casts tutors, removal spells, blue cards, things I arbitrarily decide I don't like but will probably cast myself later.
I wouldn't be suprised at all. The card has basically become such a fringe card. Everyone knows what it does some groups play it some don't. ST was a shinning example of what EDH was about. Groups self regulated. When ever i went to a new group, I always asked about "cards like sundering titan" some groups liked them, some didn't. Also, it was 8 years ago when this was released, nothing substantial changed him, after 8 years, it's safe to say that he's not getting banned. Then wham out of no where ban?
"but you don't need to follow the ban list!" That's such a cop out mentality to justify pissing off a certain group of players. The very definition of a banlist suggests it must be followed.
regardless of your opinion, I played sundering titan, but how do you know you wouldn't want to play with me? You never even asked me to take it out, you just jumped to conclusions and applied stereotypes.
Fun starts before the EDH game starts, not from a banlist or fracturing the community by saying only x use sundering titan for y.
Magic in its very nature is a skill intensive game and takes years to fully understand. I've been playing since it started, and I just got a lesson in layering. Once again, you present evidence that titan was used to bum people out, sadly I have tons of counter evidence. We can do this all day.
By that logic removal should be removed, it does the same thing as a counterspell, it creates a negative experience (the net result is the same).
You don't see anything wrong in removing a key mechanic from the game? Every post you made seems to suggest you want the game to be simplified by removing aspects you don't like.
Here's the funny thing about the titan ban, for the first time... a lot (and I mean a lot) of players are now looking at a butt load of land destruction. Believe it or not, it's not fun watching a player masturbate and drop 12 lands on the table so they can trolololololol tooth and lame ftw. Cheer about the titan being banned, get ready for a new type of EDH deck. In addition to ramp and win, control and win, and combo, you will now have LD and win.
After someone plays Sundering Titan when has anyone ever ever ever EVER been like, "Sundering Titan, YES! I love Titan he is so awesome! Thanks for blowing up my mana base so I get to sit here for 10 minutes not doing anything! You really saved the day by playing him!"
Also, LD decks have already exist in abundance already. There will not be a "new type of EDH deck" just because Titan got banned. What the hell kind of weird speculation logic is that?
All I am pointing out is people play cards that piss people off when you don't need to. This isn't just me ranting on about stuff that only applies to me.
Oh yeah, does that new type of EDH deck you mentioned come equipped with lazers and serves you hot cocoa or something? If so, I would like one please.
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The keys are in your hands
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Fatty can I get an example of what a fun game would be like for you? Like just run me through the turns of a fun game. What would your game plan be going into the game? What would your deck ideally do? How would you win?
Unfortunately every try hard from Sacramento to Shanghai preaches from the top of their 27 lands + Mana Reflection that Tooth and Nail and Time Stretch are fine to play in the same turn but Armageddon is unfair.
After someone plays Sundering Titan when has anyone ever ever ever EVER been like, "Sundering Titan, YES! I love Titan he is so awesome! Thanks for blowing up my mana base so I get to sit here for 10 minutes not doing anything! You really saved the day by playing him!"
Also, LD decks have already exist in abundance already. There will not be a "new type of EDH deck" just because Titan got banned. What the hell kind of weird speculation logic is that?
All I am pointing out is people play cards that piss people off when you don't need to. This isn't just me ranting on about stuff that only applies to me.
Oh yeah, does that new type of EDH deck you mentioned come equipped with lazers and serves you hot cocoa or something? If so, I would like one please.
Just last week before he was banned actually... I used titan to blow a 5 color deck out. I don't think anyone ever cheers for a bomb to be played..... Making blanket statements about the EDH community doesn't help your argument. LD isn't in abundance because players whine that it's not fun. Well guess what fatty, LD just got a lot more fun since the EDH card pool got smaller.
I for one LOVE LD, but generally kept away from it because it's frowned upon. Since the RC is encouraging mindless ramp, I have no choice but to use a plethora of LD to make other players miserable. That's right, I said miserable, watching someone ramp 2903847520934785 lands to tooth and nail for palinchron is not fun. Playing a 8 games in a row, with EVERY deck running green and tutoring to prime time so they can ramp harder is not fun. It doesn't promote creative deck building, or creative play by any stretch of the imagination. It just stagnates design and game play. Doing the same thing over and over again is insanity.
I agree. We should all only play g/x decks because they are the most objectively fun and anyone who disagrees does not know the truth about EDH. Everyone should just play their decks because interaction beyond high fiving about how many land are in play is unfun and equivalent to casting Stasis while kicking puppies. I for one will never play with anyone who casts tutors, removal spells, blue cards, things I arbitrarily decide I don't like but will probably cast myself later.
Yeah green has gotten way to many good cards recently. I'm seriously contemplating throwing Acid Rain in all my blue decks and Wake of Destruction in my red decks.
Unfortunately every try hard from Sacramento to Shanghai preaches from the top of their 27 lands + Mana Reflection that Tooth and Nail and Time Stretch are fine to play in the same turn but Armageddon is unfair.
I personally have no problem with the ban. I also have no problem with ramp. You see, I run a Numot deck that carries Obliterate, Armaggedon, Jokulhaups, Devestation, Wildfire, Destructive Force, Wrath of God, Runiation, Decree of Annihilation, and soon, Worldfire.
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Just for the record, Wurmcoil is one of my least favorite cards as well.
50 lands in a 5-player game. But what's the chance that it's an even 10-10-10-10-10 split?
If it's an even split, you're still thinking about it wrong. That would make it 10 lands out of 40 (you don't count your own). So if you get to selectively destroy 25% of the lands, you aren't doing serious damage?
And would you ever want to play a 5-color deck if Sundering Titan was played in your group?
Sundering Titan doesn't target. Also it's really bad at killing the rampiest of ramp decks - mono green.
you know what i meant, though you are right i shouldnt be throwing round the word targeted on this forum
its not just mono green though, G/x decks as well. and lets be honest, are you really going to kill lands of someone who isn't the hideous ramp-threat that green is?
Niv-Mizzet Ramp 'n' Wheel
Godo: Strap him up and turn him sideways!
Odds are pretty good that you'll have to, unless there's someone playing 5C ramp.
I play Titan in Vorinclex and Sasaya, so yes, I will. Frequently.
GRRWHazezon Tamar (Valakut)GRRW
UKami of the Crescent Moon (
Group Hug)UUHeidar, Rimewind Master [Mini-Primer]U
WKemba, Kha Regent (Stax)W
GEzuri, Renegade Leader [Primer]G
sure but unless they are mono green you will probably give them the biggest beat with it.
and if they are mono-green and you want them dead you just don't play it do you? so then you can team up and sort them out
Niv-Mizzet Ramp 'n' Wheel
Godo: Strap him up and turn him sideways!
They're still testing, so we prob won't hear about it again till september as sheldon said
This is where I disagree Devon. Why shouldn't a greedy deck be punished for indulging in too much of one thing? Sure it's fun to ramp half the lands in your deck onto the table by turn 6, but it gets old when people don't do anything to stop it. I understand everyone wants to do their own thing in Commander, but half the fun comes from when everyone is interacting with everyone else, causing all sorts of stuff to happen that you normally wouldn't expect.
Monogreen decks don't get crippled by Sundering Titan all that much, but not every ramp deck is monogreen. Many of them are at least one color, if not three colors or more.
People also seem to think Sundering Titan gone means all mass LD is gone. When in fact it's just a little less one sided now. Multicolor decks were already slower than mono color decks since as multicolor you have to fix your colors, sundering titan only broadens that gap.
Be the giver or the undertaker
Unlock and open the door
Be the healer or the breaker
The keys are in your hands
Realize you are your own source of all creation
BOf your own master planB
This, is what I hate about the EDH community.
Everyone wants to play their own, simple minded game, and roll a dice on who's fastest. If there's no punishing, no interaction anymore, what kind of format are we playing then?
Maybe I come from a competative playgroup but.. I know everyone is having fun in mine, and they would never have fun in "chill, let's all primetime vorinclex yo"
[Primer] Kozilek, Butcher with Juice.
Am I alone here in not understanding a single thing you are trying to get across here?
Rolling a dice on who is fastest? Huh?
No punishing? Yeah, that sounds good to me. I would rather have no punishing people for wanting to have fun. It seems like a lot more fun rather than playing with vindictive players who want to "punish" people. Blechh.
No interaction? There is always interaction in EDH, unless you are playing a deck that wins on turn 3-4 without caring what you do.
Also, Primeval Titan and Vorinclex definitely are not the first cards when I think chill EDH. Both typically induce groaning and moaning and boring yawn inducing play where I play at.
I guess I am in the 1% of EDH players who are more interested in making sure other players have fun and not playing as hardcore as possible with the most efficient cards you can use. To me, that is just boring as all hell. I prefer being a nice EDH player that allows people to play their cards and let them have a good time for the duration of the game.
Be the giver or the undertaker
Unlock and open the door
Be the healer or the breaker
The keys are in your hands
Realize you are your own source of all creation
BOf your own master planB
First, you are alone.
Second, wanting to have fun usually equates to ramping out insane amounts of mana before playing stupidly degenerate cards. Therefore Primetime and Vorniclex are perfect casual cards. Only the latter is unviable in a competitive meta.
Third, you are in fact the 1% in that you see EDH as a format which should require no skill, thinking, deck construction or play ability. Go back to Yugioh for that kind of game.
Wow, hostility much for no reason?
When did I ever say I see EDH "as a format which should require no skill, thinking, deck construction or play ability."?
First of all, EDH IS the format where it doesn't HAVE to require skill, thinking, or deck construction or play ability. It is a format for people who want to do what they please. Wanna play nothing but Homarids? This is the place to do it.
Secondly, if you read what I said which you clearly didn't, I was pointing out that people play with Sundering Titan to bum people out. If it doesn't do much, which many people here have already stated, then what is the point of playing it other then to create a negative experience which 9 times out of 10 it does?
Vorinclex is a winter orb effect. Nobody particularly enjoys Winter Orb. If you do, good for you. I don't want to play with you. You will probably have a great time playing with your uber competitve spike buddies who only care about winning. When I want to play a Spike format, I will go play in a Grand Prix or Legacy open series or whatever and I perfectly understand what I am getting myself into if I get all my mana base destroyed by Wasteland on turn 2-3 or my win-con countered.
Be the giver or the undertaker
Unlock and open the door
Be the healer or the breaker
The keys are in your hands
Realize you are your own source of all creation
BOf your own master planB
Playing a couple of Counterspells isn't a Spiky format; it's playing a reasonable game of Magic. If you don't want to think during a Magic game... why are you playing Magic? The whole idea behind the game is that it's a mind test.
Also, you're making ridiculous generalizations about people that like to play certain cards.
EDH Decks:
RBG Kresh, the Bloodbraided RBG
GW Rhys, the Redeemed GW
Legacy:
RGW Enchantress RGW
I think plenty when playing EDH. I don't see how taking out counterspells completely removes thought from MTG.
My "ridiculous generalizations" are just from my 3+ years experience of playing EDH with many different people through paper magic or online. The majority of the time people really dislike land destruction, Winter Orb effects (taxing effects as well), and counterspells. I don't know how to tell you any other way than they create negative experiences more often than not. This includes Sundering Titan especially.
Be the giver or the undertaker
Unlock and open the door
Be the healer or the breaker
The keys are in your hands
Realize you are your own source of all creation
BOf your own master planB
I wouldn't be suprised at all. The card has basically become such a fringe card. Everyone knows what it does some groups play it some don't. ST was a shinning example of what EDH was about. Groups self regulated. When ever i went to a new group, I always asked about "cards like sundering titan" some groups liked them, some didn't. Also, it was 8 years ago when this was released, nothing substantial changed him, after 8 years, it's safe to say that he's not getting banned. Then wham out of no where ban?
"but you don't need to follow the ban list!" That's such a cop out mentality to justify pissing off a certain group of players. The very definition of a banlist suggests it must be followed.
regardless of your opinion, I played sundering titan, but how do you know you wouldn't want to play with me? You never even asked me to take it out, you just jumped to conclusions and applied stereotypes.
Fun starts before the EDH game starts, not from a banlist or fracturing the community by saying only x use sundering titan for y.
Magic in its very nature is a skill intensive game and takes years to fully understand. I've been playing since it started, and I just got a lesson in layering. Once again, you present evidence that titan was used to bum people out, sadly I have tons of counter evidence. We can do this all day.
By that logic removal should be removed, it does the same thing as a counterspell, it creates a negative experience (the net result is the same).
You don't see anything wrong in removing a key mechanic from the game? Every post you made seems to suggest you want the game to be simplified by removing aspects you don't like.
Here's the funny thing about the titan ban, for the first time... a lot (and I mean a lot) of players are now looking at a butt load of land destruction. Believe it or not, it's not fun watching a player masturbate and drop 12 lands on the table so they can trolololololol tooth and lame ftw. Cheer about the titan being banned, get ready for a new type of EDH deck. In addition to ramp and win, control and win, and combo, you will now have LD and win.
After someone plays Sundering Titan when has anyone ever ever ever EVER been like, "Sundering Titan, YES! I love Titan he is so awesome! Thanks for blowing up my mana base so I get to sit here for 10 minutes not doing anything! You really saved the day by playing him!"
...............................that's right. Never.
Also, LD decks have already exist in abundance already. There will not be a "new type of EDH deck" just because Titan got banned. What the hell kind of weird speculation logic is that?
All I am pointing out is people play cards that piss people off when you don't need to. This isn't just me ranting on about stuff that only applies to me.
Oh yeah, does that new type of EDH deck you mentioned come equipped with lazers and serves you hot cocoa or something? If so, I would like one please.
Be the giver or the undertaker
Unlock and open the door
Be the healer or the breaker
The keys are in your hands
Realize you are your own source of all creation
BOf your own master planB
EDIT: Also to everyone who seems to think the Sundering Titan ban is out of nowhere it was mentioned once before as a card Sheldon had his eye on.
http://mtgcommander.net/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1499
Just last week before he was banned actually... I used titan to blow a 5 color deck out. I don't think anyone ever cheers for a bomb to be played..... Making blanket statements about the EDH community doesn't help your argument. LD isn't in abundance because players whine that it's not fun. Well guess what fatty, LD just got a lot more fun since the EDH card pool got smaller.
I for one LOVE LD, but generally kept away from it because it's frowned upon. Since the RC is encouraging mindless ramp, I have no choice but to use a plethora of LD to make other players miserable. That's right, I said miserable, watching someone ramp 2903847520934785 lands to tooth and nail for palinchron is not fun. Playing a 8 games in a row, with EVERY deck running green and tutoring to prime time so they can ramp harder is not fun. It doesn't promote creative deck building, or creative play by any stretch of the imagination. It just stagnates design and game play. Doing the same thing over and over again is insanity.