I played rsaunder's Goyf splash at the last Vestal event to an unspectacular 2-2-1 finish (largely due to my own idiocy). Goyf was fantastic and didn't really bother my manabase at all, while being an absolute must answer for opponents. He definitely deserves the spot.
As for some of the other lists here, Sensei's Top is awful. You have much better things to be doing turns 1-5 and past that, it's underwhelming because this deck needs card advantage infinitely more than card quality.
Additionally, Gatekeeper is the best card printed for Deadguy in a very long while. Not running him in some capacity is a huge mistake.
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Can you post the DGA list you're talking about (with Gatekeeper/Goyf)? I'm really interested.
It's still getting tweaked. Tivon, White_Ghost and myself have a little more work to do on it before it goes public in any respect. From what W_G said though, you should be able to piece together a basic list
One more piece of advice though everyone: Pikula's basic build and strategy is still the strongest, especially with the new tools it has available. Think and test very carefully before getting too off-base.
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Quote from "Warden" »
rsaunder has beautiful eyes. Think of a sunset, sunrise, and cool breeze at the beach rolled into one moment. Now make that moment blue...because those are his eyes
A lot of Deadguy comes down to personal style of play and what you expect to face in your metagame. The list has a ton of flex spots and a brief overview of deckcheck shows a lot of lists in a lot of different directions.Despite the fact that both Chris and I have played the deck since around Philly in 2005, we've always ran slightly different decklists and I still disagree with him about some of the stuff in the newest edition.
And Chris is pretty much right on here. Keep it black heavy and remember the emphasis on disruption. Moving towards midrange Rock lists or BWG Agro lists (Anwar's article) doesn't seem like the right decision, even if I did end up losing to Anwar's list (due to a severe error on my part coupled with two ridiculously bad stretches of topdecks).
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Adding Goyf to the deck means you're playing BWG aggro instead BW pikula
I don't see why. The gameplan is exactly the same, and the manabase plays no new non-black producers since you don't need them with minimal splashes. Cutting hymns or sinkholes or making heavier splashes requiring running off-color basics is getting farther off base from the gameplan Homebrew than splashing for 4 of the best creature ever printed.
Goyf is better than persecutor and tombstalker because it doesnt require you to run sub-par cards to run it (persecutor) or cut bob/die to bad luck every so often (tombstalker). Splashing the third color for this perfectly curved beatstick allows you to have a solid game against tempo.dec by stalling the ground game as you beat them with attrition, trump everything aggro will be doing as you again beat them with attrition, and finish the game with an individual creature against control once they're off balance.
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Quote from "Warden" »
rsaunder has beautiful eyes. Think of a sunset, sunrise, and cool breeze at the beach rolled into one moment. Now make that moment blue...because those are his eyes
Adding Goyf to the deck means you're playing BWG aggro instead BW pikula...I'd like to know if you stick with BW or add green for Goyf. Adding green makes the mana base less stable and Gatekeeper is useless when you run 3 colors.
Doesn't Persecutor have a place in DGA these days or is Stalker still prefered?
I still run zero non-swamps besides Wasteland. Goyf takes the place of Shade or whatever other garbage creature decks were running before. Deadguy has always run some kind of pure beatstick to end games faster. Goyf is just the best bang for your buck.
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Beat you to it. Maybe we should finish this project tomorrow...
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rsaunder has beautiful eyes. Think of a sunset, sunrise, and cool breeze at the beach rolled into one moment. Now make that moment blue...because those are his eyes
Try it before you judge. Moon effects suck, yes, but no one runs them or back to basics (and they probably will never resolve against you) and wastelands hitting your lands only serves to further your gameplan of mana denial. Against blue tempo decks you should be sandbagging fetches anyway, it isn't like the deck doesn't run 23 land with 5 basics and a curve that tops out at 3.
Actually I saw a lot of decks running B2B yesterday in the Philly Open to best lands and new horizons.
Hey, great Primer; I found the content pretty helpful, since I'll be running a B/W/g Deadguy Ale deck tomorrow (Although you might wanna run through the spellcheck quick, you had many typos and the punctuation was very Gradeschool-ish, just sayin' :))
I've always been a fan of mono black control, which is pretty much this, although I love how this allows a lot more flexibility. I have two cards I was going to ask about, if anyone has tried using...
(1) Mother of Runes
(2) Moratorium Stone
I was thinking MOM backed by Jitte (+other creature) would just end the game quickly. Surprised I didn't see it mentioned.
The stone was just an idea, possibly SB in place of relic. I'm not sure how good it would be, but with all the hand disruption and destruction it seems like it could have some functionality. Probably crap, but just thought I'd throw it out there.
Originally Posted by fearmeordie View Post
"HAI GUISE I PLAYZ T2 AND WANT TO PLAY LEGACY BUT NO HAZ CASHZ"
Originally Posted by Sir Aureus View Post
I don't see why everyone is so confused about the (SoM)expansion symbol. It's clearly a croissant. A metal croissant.
All hail croissant block.
I don't think it deoes enough in a deck like this... but it is an interesting choice and one that isnt entirely without merit. CA, strictly a LD spell (waste) and a creature for 1B.
/this format seems to have a thing for stoneforge mystic...
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Quote from "Warden" »
rsaunder has beautiful eyes. Think of a sunset, sunrise, and cool breeze at the beach rolled into one moment. Now make that moment blue...because those are his eyes
i get that it is good, but does every deck really need one? i mean it got printed and the format got a hard on for it.
I was going to use that terminology, but I thought I might get warned and it totally wasnt worth it.
Sooo... thanks
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Quote from "Warden" »
rsaunder has beautiful eyes. Think of a sunset, sunrise, and cool breeze at the beach rolled into one moment. Now make that moment blue...because those are his eyes
Originally Posted by fearmeordie View Post
"HAI GUISE I PLAYZ T2 AND WANT TO PLAY LEGACY BUT NO HAZ CASHZ"
Originally Posted by Sir Aureus View Post
I don't see why everyone is so confused about the (SoM)expansion symbol. It's clearly a croissant. A metal croissant.
All hail croissant block.
4cc means that it had better win the game right here and now, which it doesn't. In fact, it doesnt really affect the board state at all when it comes down so I'd give it a resounding "no."
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Quote from "Warden" »
rsaunder has beautiful eyes. Think of a sunset, sunrise, and cool breeze at the beach rolled into one moment. Now make that moment blue...because those are his eyes
My bad i meant:
Cursed Scroll 1
Artifact 3 : Name a card. Then reveal a card from you hand at random, if that carded was the name card, cursed scroll deals 2 damage to target creature or player.
Your comment about the imediate impact is still correct though, but this is more for when there is a standstill (not the card, although...)
Originally Posted by fearmeordie View Post
"HAI GUISE I PLAYZ T2 AND WANT TO PLAY LEGACY BUT NO HAZ CASHZ"
Originally Posted by Sir Aureus View Post
I don't see why everyone is so confused about the (SoM)expansion symbol. It's clearly a croissant. A metal croissant.
All hail croissant block.
Originally Posted by fearmeordie View Post
"HAI GUISE I PLAYZ T2 AND WANT TO PLAY LEGACY BUT NO HAZ CASHZ"
Originally Posted by Sir Aureus View Post
I don't see why everyone is so confused about the (SoM)expansion symbol. It's clearly a croissant. A metal croissant.
All hail croissant block.
There is nothing wrong with Scroll, its just that there are not many slots that are open for personal tweaks. So feel free to use Scroll over SDT/Jitte etc.
It was "agressive" slots 11-13, with the origional creature base of:
4 Hippy
4 BoB
3 Shade
It was good when goblins was so big, but then again the deck ran 2 MB E. Plague when it T8'd at Philly. Scroll is too weak now. with creatures with an ass bigger than 2 running around.
SDT is bad in this deck because its a tempo black hole. I don't see why people havent noticed that yet and stopped advocating it.
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Quote from "Warden" »
rsaunder has beautiful eyes. Think of a sunset, sunrise, and cool breeze at the beach rolled into one moment. Now make that moment blue...because those are his eyes
I like SDT because of it saving my *** from lifeloss coming from Dark Confidant. + it lets me manipulate my draws. In mid game you may want to push through with more creatures or need that one removal, but instead you top deck a discard spell/land which is often dead cards late in the game. SDT at least lets you dig 3 cards deep and even gives you another shot after cracking a fetch-land.
Seeing that the deck often play in top-deck mode, and could need its synergy with dark confidant, I think SDT is a good card for this deck.
Other may disagree, and there are for sure other cards to use in SDT's slot.
SDT is bad in this deck because its a tempo black hole. I don't see why people havent noticed that yet and stopped advocating it.
Meaning, SDT is a mana sink, pays 1 to cast, 1 to use. This deck is just full of hate and answers and spending that 2 mana, early game, is tempo disadvantage, because it doesn't do anything, or rather does nothing. You're fixing your draws and setting up to do something but you just spent 2 mana not doing anything. Confidant is CA, Hymn to tourach is tempo, and this is an aggressive deck. The benefit from top is mild at best and it does slow down your clock.
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As for some of the other lists here, Sensei's Top is awful. You have much better things to be doing turns 1-5 and past that, it's underwhelming because this deck needs card advantage infinitely more than card quality.
Additionally, Gatekeeper is the best card printed for Deadguy in a very long while. Not running him in some capacity is a huge mistake.
sig by Anime FX:http://tinyurl.com/2u743o
Team Blitzkrieg- When We Put Our Cards Down, You Pick Yours Up.
Team Rehab- Wicked Defunct, But Still Better Than You.
It's still getting tweaked. Tivon, White_Ghost and myself have a little more work to do on it before it goes public in any respect. From what W_G said though, you should be able to piece together a basic list
One more piece of advice though everyone: Pikula's basic build and strategy is still the strongest, especially with the new tools it has available. Think and test very carefully before getting too off-base.
I'm here to kick ass and play card games.
BZK Level 4 Bad Guy
And Chris is pretty much right on here. Keep it black heavy and remember the emphasis on disruption. Moving towards midrange Rock lists or BWG Agro lists (Anwar's article) doesn't seem like the right decision, even if I did end up losing to Anwar's list (due to a severe error on my part coupled with two ridiculously bad stretches of topdecks).
sig by Anime FX:http://tinyurl.com/2u743o
Team Blitzkrieg- When We Put Our Cards Down, You Pick Yours Up.
Team Rehab- Wicked Defunct, But Still Better Than You.
I don't see why. The gameplan is exactly the same, and the manabase plays no new non-black producers since you don't need them with minimal splashes. Cutting hymns or sinkholes or making heavier splashes requiring running off-color basics is getting farther off base from the gameplan Homebrew than splashing for 4 of the best creature ever printed.
Goyf is better than persecutor and tombstalker because it doesnt require you to run sub-par cards to run it (persecutor) or cut bob/die to bad luck every so often (tombstalker). Splashing the third color for this perfectly curved beatstick allows you to have a solid game against tempo.dec by stalling the ground game as you beat them with attrition, trump everything aggro will be doing as you again beat them with attrition, and finish the game with an individual creature against control once they're off balance.
I'm here to kick ass and play card games.
BZK Level 4 Bad Guy
I still run zero non-swamps besides Wasteland. Goyf takes the place of Shade or whatever other garbage creature decks were running before. Deadguy has always run some kind of pure beatstick to end games faster. Goyf is just the best bang for your buck.
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Team Blitzkrieg- When We Put Our Cards Down, You Pick Yours Up.
Team Rehab- Wicked Defunct, But Still Better Than You.
we don't run prosecutor or stalker
I'll shoot you a PM as soon as I can find the list. The build is currently at rsaunders house and I can't remember the exact thing
I'm here to kick ass and play card games.
BZK Level 4 Bad Guy
Actually I saw a lot of decks running B2B yesterday in the Philly Open to best lands and new horizons.
Sig and Avvy by Heroes of the Plane Studios
Ninjas
Fish
Dredge
EDH
Sharuum
I've always been a fan of mono black control, which is pretty much this, although I love how this allows a lot more flexibility. I have two cards I was going to ask about, if anyone has tried using...
(1) Mother of Runes
(2) Moratorium Stone
I was thinking MOM backed by Jitte (+other creature) would just end the game quickly. Surprised I didn't see it mentioned.
The stone was just an idea, possibly SB in place of relic. I'm not sure how good it would be, but with all the hand disruption and destruction it seems like it could have some functionality. Probably crap, but just thought I'd throw it out there.
GWRUB[EDH] Reaper KingGWRUB
GW[Legacy] BEARS (#1 Threat in America)GW
UR[Legacy] Arcane MeleeUR
:symb::symw::symb:Deadguy Ale:symw::symb::symw:
EDH
:symb::symb::symb:Ink-eyes:symb::symb::symb:
legacy: Doomsday, Dredge, BUG (shard less and still)
modern: storm, woo dredge, U-tron
EDH: maelstrom wanderer, Gisela, krenko, lazav, sharrum, sheoldred/xiahou dun, norin the wary, Thrax, Mimeoplasm, GW legends
/this format seems to have a thing for stoneforge mystic...
I'm here to kick ass and play card games.
BZK Level 4 Bad Guy
i get that it is good, but does every deck really need one? i mean it got printed and the format got a hard on for it.
legacy: Doomsday, Dredge, BUG (shard less and still)
modern: storm, woo dredge, U-tron
EDH: maelstrom wanderer, Gisela, krenko, lazav, sharrum, sheoldred/xiahou dun, norin the wary, Thrax, Mimeoplasm, GW legends
I was going to use that terminology, but I thought I might get warned and it totally wasnt worth it.
Sooo... thanks
I'm here to kick ass and play card games.
BZK Level 4 Bad Guy
4 Swamp
2 Plains
Non-Basic Land: 16
4 Godless Shrine (Scrubland)
4 Marsh Flats
4 Wasteland
2 Bloodstained Mire
2 Windswept Heath
2 Sensei's Divining Top (Umezawa's Jitte)
Creature: 16
4 Dark Confidant
4 Jötun Grunt
4 Tidehollow Sculler
4 Vampire Nighthawk
4 Dark Ritual
4 Swords to Plowshare
Sorcery: 12
4 Duress
4 Hymn to Tourach
4 Vindicate
Unsure about how many lands to run. And, Stoneforge Mystic + Equipments looks interesting, although it kind of seems off (theme wise).
D3@D
:symb::symw::symb:Deadguy Ale:symw::symb::symw:
EDH
:symb::symb::symb:Ink-eyes:symb::symb::symb:
I'm here to kick ass and play card games.
BZK Level 4 Bad Guy
Cursed Scroll 1
Artifact
3 : Name a card. Then reveal a card from you hand at random, if that carded was the name card, cursed scroll deals 2 damage to target creature or player.
Your comment about the imediate impact is still correct though, but this is more for when there is a standstill (not the card, although...)
:symb::symw::symb:Deadguy Ale:symw::symb::symw:
EDH
:symb::symb::symb:Ink-eyes:symb::symb::symb:
:symb::symw::symb:Deadguy Ale:symw::symb::symw:
EDH
:symb::symb::symb:Ink-eyes:symb::symb::symb:
There is nothing wrong with Scroll, its just that there are not many slots that are open for personal tweaks. So feel free to use Scroll over SDT/Jitte etc.
4 Hippy
4 BoB
3 Shade
It was good when goblins was so big, but then again the deck ran 2 MB E. Plague when it T8'd at Philly. Scroll is too weak now. with creatures with an ass bigger than 2 running around.
SDT is bad in this deck because its a tempo black hole. I don't see why people havent noticed that yet and stopped advocating it.
I'm here to kick ass and play card games.
BZK Level 4 Bad Guy
What do you mean? SDT helps to control your own topdecks. I really want to hear about its disadvantages.
Seeing that the deck often play in top-deck mode, and could need its synergy with dark confidant, I think SDT is a good card for this deck.
Other may disagree, and there are for sure other cards to use in SDT's slot.
Meaning, SDT is a mana sink, pays 1 to cast, 1 to use. This deck is just full of hate and answers and spending that 2 mana, early game, is tempo disadvantage, because it doesn't do anything, or rather does nothing. You're fixing your draws and setting up to do something but you just spent 2 mana not doing anything. Confidant is CA, Hymn to tourach is tempo, and this is an aggressive deck. The benefit from top is mild at best and it does slow down your clock.
Maverick -- Storm
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