I'm adding the final vote against Helix Pinnacle. It's a cool idea, but we really have to go all-in on it and there's not as much support as I would like for it in the current list.
Voting against Lost in the Woods - between Disk, Savage Twister, Hurricane and the Fogs, I think we have a reasonable number of defensive options and I'm not sold on having one where we have to hope we have the right topdeck for it to work. Scouting Trek is basically the only tech we have for it at the moment.
On that note, also voting against Scouting Trek. The only synergies it has are letting us hide behind LitW for a while and letting us pretend to play turbofog with Constant Mists - having a two-of that only supports two other two-ofs is asking for it to be a dead card. Admittedly, the Constant Mists synergy is interesting, but we could get that with Crucible of Worlds too (and still draw cards then).
Axing Helix Pinnacle buys us a little bit more space. I'm going to add a Regrowth (since we're going with Vintage legality, only one is allowed) since there are a lot of cards in the deck I'd want to use a second time.
voting out lost in the woods because it is just very inconsistant as a defense and it only combos with scouting trek which only helps us if we go all in on it.
voting out the scouting trek because it messes up our draws pretty badly
adding 2 sphinx bone wand because it is a better win con than aladin's ring, we only need to play six spells to win the game, and we want to cast spells anyway.
voting out goblin cannon because we need a lot of mana to get it going and probably multiples to win
"If you knew anything about the lore you'd see that they were clearly hinting that the madness on Innistrad was caused by Uncle Istvan wearing Urza's Power Armor ... tainted with Phrexyian Oil"
Graham from Loading Ready Run
Turning Moment's Peace and Constant Mists into win cons is great!
If we tuck in some cantrips to help out our Buyback and Flashback spells we can really jump start the Bone Wand!
I am going all in on the Bone Wand plan.
Voting Down
-All Scouting Trek (out)- We've already dropped some support, and we have a new plan to burn with fog.
-All Darksteel Reactor - Slow win that was ok as once in a while back-up plan on the turbo-fog route. But now I just want to burn.
-All Alladin's Ring - I'm convinced we can burn faster with Wand.
-All Utopia Sprawl - I want a cantrippy effect in this slot now. Something like Explore to work early or after we have the Wand down.
-All Goblin Cannon - This is a less efficient but also painful Hurricane. I want to take the pain from Hurricane since it triggers the wand.
Vote Up
+2 Sphinx-Bone Wand - I'm trying to cut some alternate finishers, so I've got to up this one.
+2 Constant Mists - This combines with Wand to be a fast clock, or Wand/Bloom for what will be an auto-win most of the time.
I'll refrain from adding anything yet, but I'd like to explore a few possibilities with the group. Explore Manamorphose Cultivate
Alternate lifegain plan? Does G have flashbacking (or otherwise reuseable) lifegain that doesn't rely on critters?
Should we bother keeping the Hurricanes? Or just further reinforce our Fog wall?
Lots of votes here.
Seconding +2 on wand and mists. I have always wanted to find a good use for those wands I got!
Vote to remove the ring, fruition, desert twister, cannon (gone), reactor, bloom, sprawl (gone). Bramble Crush can replace twister in a fog deck. The rest are good suggestions for the original win conditions, but not so sure for the wand win.
Voting to add two Sphinx-Bone Wand so it's easier to find and, in turn, win with.
so, instead of relying on several damage sources, we're relying on one? Splinter where are you?
I'm wondering if Land Grant or Skyshroud Claim could be some needed ramp to get the :7mana:-cc artifact out early to start loading it up with counters.
and speaking of Life of the Loam- the already voted out [c]Scouting Trek[c] would have been awesome. Stack our deck, Dredge the Loam, get the lands back when cast the Loam.
I have no idea what to add to the deck; my last additions have already been axed- and as it stands, this deck is nearly dependant on the Constant/Loam/Wand combo...
I suggest we consider some more draw power - possibly Recycle or some artifact draw, and Fastbond for some ramp and to make Constant Mists easier to reuse. [/QUOTE]
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SELVAXRI! King of Misfortune & Master of Rocket Launchers "Do ya feel lucky? Because you'd better start runnin' while you still can." 375 Misfortune {+3 signed AP's} & 104 Rocket Launcher (41 AQ/ 63 Rev) Edgar Rice Burroughs, forgotten legend of the word.
Something like Explore to work early or after we have the Wand down.
This pick is a good idea because of Loam/Mists.
Quote from "ThatRedwood" »
Alternate lifegain plan? Does G have flashbacking (or otherwise reuseable) lifegain that doesn't rely on critters?
No, here's the search. No buyback either. Looking to life gain more generally, Fruition has already been mentioned. It's kinda bad early and gets better late, though. I looked through every green life gain card, and here is every loosely plausible one:
so, instead of relying on several damage sources, we're relying on one?
Splinter where are you?
Well, we'll have Hurricane. But really, if people are playing that kind of artifact removal in one's meta, add more win-cons and/or it's not a good idea to try to win with a monogreen creatureless deck anyway.
I'm also voting down Desert Twister for being too expensive in a fog/sweeper deck and Fruition for preventing less damage on net than potential Fog variants.
I suggest we consider some more draw power - possibly Recycle or some artifact draw, and Fastbond for some ramp and to make Constant Mists easier to reuse.
I'll work on votes or additions later. For now, my concerns.
Hurricane doesn't hit the ground or opposing lock/combo pieces. If all goes well, Wand will let it keep us off a Hurricane draw. We've lost an important combo piece in Vernal Bloom, but since we no longer need to protect that, it might be better to run Oblivion Stones over Hurricane. Grants redundancy to disk, and can't hit anything important.
Without Vernal Bloom our life-gain and potential to combo out take a beating. We're down to 2 Fruition, which is almost strictly better than Stream without the doubling effect. I'm also tempted to drop Hurricane for Stone because of this. The loss of Bloom also cripples Mists and LftL interactions with our Wand.
Right now I'm thinking maybe we drop life-gain altogether to get room for more hard ramp and less conditional sweepers. We're going to need more land now if we want to win within a couple turns of dropping Wand.
Umm... I am kinda confused as to HOW we are going to cast all these sweet spells. We need more mana ramp I guess, but we also need steam. Restock will help with that as a 2 of. We only really want to hit 1 per game.
voting out fruition because it is not very good life gain and it won't help us enough to be worth a card
adding 4 cultivate because we need the ramp and it is a very good ramp spell, sphinx bone wand costs 7 mana and that is a lot
"If you knew anything about the lore you'd see that they were clearly hinting that the madness on Innistrad was caused by Uncle Istvan wearing Urza's Power Armor ... tainted with Phrexyian Oil"
Graham from Loading Ready Run
We can get more combo-potential with more risk than Bloom if we toss in Heartbeat of Spring. That will give the option of hit 7 land then Beat, Wand, and win if we untap. Our fogs and sweepers ought to buy a bit of time so we're only looking to combo that early against other combos or burn decks.
And since we wouldn't really need the Beat until the turn before we aim to combo, I think we can safely run those Stones I mentioned.
Vote Against :
-Desert Twister (out): For 2 more mana O-Stone blows the world. We miss the ability to hit specific lands with this change. I think that is a narrow enough concern to merit the mass wipe.
-Hurricane : Banking on O-Stone and Disk to keep us safe.
-Stream of Life : I'm looking to keep life up between 8 reusable fogs and 7 sweepers making up 25% of the deck. Cutting Stream ups consistency for combo and leaves us more vulnerable to burn. I think that is more an issue of bad match-ups existing for any deck than of poor building.
Adding :
4 Oblivion Stone : Wipes protection such as mask effects aside as well as most permanent based threats.
I am adding a card that I know is 32 dollars in med price but it is 26 low so it should be fine on the budget limit, (rules are meant to be broken) if you are against that part of the addition we can vote it out.
The aforementioned card is Karn Liberated which is a good finisher, if you pull of the ultimate you are getting back the bone wands that they removed with splinter and you basicallywin the game by card advantage with the ultimate, it can also be a repeated removal. It also makes great use of the fog combo in our deck. it is one of the best cards for this archetype adding 3.
voting to remove stream of life and because even on defense life gain is bad, and we need the spots to add more ramp and more fog effects.
voting out hurricane because it is just not the best removal and we probably won't be up on life even with defense so the card is just not worth it in my opinion.
I still don't want to hit the cutting phase because I want more ramp but I just don't want to put all our eggs into one basket so I added Karn.
Please cut before hitting 75
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"If you knew anything about the lore you'd see that they were clearly hinting that the madness on Innistrad was caused by Uncle Istvan wearing Urza's Power Armor ... tainted with Phrexyian Oil"
Graham from Loading Ready Run
I am adding a card that I know is 32 dollars in med price but it is 26 low so it should be fine on the budget limit, (rules are meant to be broken) if you are against that part of the addition we can vote it out.
The aforementioned card is Karn Liberated which is a good finisher, if you pull of the ultimate you are getting back the bone wands that they removed with splinter and you basicallywin the game by card advantage with the ultimate, it can also be a repeated removal. It also makes great use of the fog combo in our deck. it is one of the best cards for this archetype adding 3.
voting to remove stream of life and because even on defense life gain is bad, and we need the spots to add more ramp and more fog effects.
voting out hurricane because it is just not the best removal and we probably won't be up on life even with defense so the card is just not worth it in my opinion.
Voting up Hurricane as essential T2-T3 sweeper against the worst aggro matchups.
Voting down Karn Liberated over price even if good card is good.
Voting down two copies of Cultivate because I suspect Loam, Nature's Lore, and Explore already provide decent ramp and Cultivate is the worst/least synergistic one on the list.
Voting down two copies of Cultivate because I suspect Loam, Nature's Lore, and Explore already provide decent ramp and Cultivate is the worst/least synergistic one on the list.
So the deck has a bit of shape now, awesome.
Cuts:
2 Cultivate: we have 8 2 drops that get us mana. 2 is plenty
All Hurricane : I don't think we need an air only sweeper at this point. We do need defense, this isn't the answer
All Cyclone: Again, this is just enchantment hurricane, which is just worse in this deck. It takes up our resources and slowly kills us. No go.
Adding:
4 Tranquil Thicket if we want life from the loam, then lets abuse it, by cycling and REcycling these lands.
So the deck has a bit of shape now, awesome.
Cuts:
2 Cultivate: we have 8 2 drops that get us mana. 2 is plenty
All Hurricane : I don't think we need an air only sweeper at this point. We do need defense, this isn't the answer
All Cyclone: Again, this is just enchantment hurricane, which is just worse in this deck. It takes up our resources and slowly kills us. No go.
Adding:
4 Tranquil Thicket if we want life from the loam, then lets abuse it, by cycling and REcycling these lands.
Cyclone is more than an "enchantment hurricane" since it hits all creatures. It does drain resources through and isn't particularly efficient. It does work with Sun Droplet. That might be a different deck though.
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I am looking for Date Stamped promos from Khans of Tarkir block so I can finish my set. Check my wants if you have any.
Currently offering 2 non-foil Kolighan's Command for a Date Stamped foil!
Moving forward: we had a discussion about using "for reasons stated above" as an explanation for cutting cards. There was a discussion that led to this conclusion.
From this point on, please give specific reasons. "As stated above" is not a clear reason, as the GMAD participants had a problem with that reasoning a while back.
EDIT: The tone of this post seems more curt than I would like it to be. Read this as "just a reminder," not "GRRRRAAAAR!"
Wow, this deck is a mess.
Voting to keep- Cyclone- it's our consistant "board sweeper" adn we have Restock/Regrowth there to get it back when things start going south again.
Voting to cut:
2 Hurricane- since it hits only flying creatures there's a slim chance that this'll hit multiple creatures. still, it's nice to hit after we ditch a Cyclone.
4 Oblivion Stone okay... a more convoluted and complicated Nevinyrral's Disk. are we really going to waste time trying to protect our "stuff' [which we have not a lot of], when we can just say "eh, screw it." and frag the entire field?
2 Karn, Liberated. my whole mentality with casual decks is, they should be fairly affordable. i'm not going to dump $90 into a casual deck. and since this deck has gone off the deepend more times than i can count, one will be fine as a "what the hell are they doing?" factor.
because I can, adding 1 Armageddon Clock. let's see an opponent waste mana to keep the damage to a minimum. it'll buy time for us to do something. what, given this deck, i have no idea.
SELVAXRI! King of Misfortune & Master of Rocket Launchers "Do ya feel lucky? Because you'd better start runnin' while you still can." 375 Misfortune {+3 signed AP's} & 104 Rocket Launcher (41 AQ/ 63 Rev) Edgar Rice Burroughs, forgotten legend of the word.
according to the GMAD rules if a card has 1 @ -all and 2@-2 then that card goes down to by 2 and has 1@-all.
so by fixing the votes we are already down two karn and down two hurricane
I will vote to keep the last karn because it isn't that much ($2) over our budget and it does do great things for our deck.
voting to keep O-Stone, not because we are going to save our stuff but as more (and more expensive) disks, because it gets rid of planeswalkers we don't have a lot of other ways to do that early to mid game, which is dangerous because planeswalkers can go off fast.
adding four plow under because it is a way to slow the game down for our opponent which we need to survive long enough to cast bone wand and Armageddon clock.
"If you knew anything about the lore you'd see that they were clearly hinting that the madness on Innistrad was caused by Uncle Istvan wearing Urza's Power Armor ... tainted with Phrexyian Oil"
Graham from Loading Ready Run
Cyclone says hi. There are also hurricane variants like Squall Line and the portal 3k one.
Out with Fog. In with Moment's Peace.
4 Desert Twister
4 Harmonize
4 Fruition (1 @ -2)
4 Hurricane
4 Nature's Lore
2 Scouting Trek
2 Stream of Life
4 Moment's Peace
2 Constant Mists
Artifact (8)
3 Aladdin's Ring
2 Goblin Cannon
1 Darksteel Reactor
3 Nevinyrral's Disk
3 Vernal Bloom (-1)
4 Utopia Sprawl (-1)
2 Helix Pinnacle (-2)
2 Lost in the Woods (-1)
Lands (24)
24 Forest
I am still behind the idea of swapping the Ring for Obelisk of Alara...if we do not go mono forest. more versatile a card.
Currently offering 2 non-foil Kolighan's Command for a Date Stamped foil!
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Voting against Lost in the Woods - between Disk, Savage Twister, Hurricane and the Fogs, I think we have a reasonable number of defensive options and I'm not sold on having one where we have to hope we have the right topdeck for it to work. Scouting Trek is basically the only tech we have for it at the moment.
On that note, also voting against Scouting Trek. The only synergies it has are letting us hide behind LitW for a while and letting us pretend to play turbofog with Constant Mists - having a two-of that only supports two other two-ofs is asking for it to be a dead card. Admittedly, the Constant Mists synergy is interesting, but we could get that with Crucible of Worlds too (and still draw cards then).
Axing Helix Pinnacle buys us a little bit more space. I'm going to add a Regrowth (since we're going with Vintage legality, only one is allowed) since there are a lot of cards in the deck I'd want to use a second time.
4 Desert Twister
4 Harmonize
4 Fruition (1 @ -2)
4 Hurricane
4 Nature's Lore
2 Scouting Trek (-1)
2 Stream of Life
1 Regrowth
4 Moment's Peace
2 Constant Mists
Artifact (8)
3 Aladdin's Ring
2 Goblin Cannon
1 Darksteel Reactor
3 Nevinyrral's Disk
3 Vernal Bloom (-1)
4 Utopia Sprawl (-1)
2 Lost in the Woods (-2)
Lands (24)
24 Forest
voting out the scouting trek because it messes up our draws pretty badly
adding 2 sphinx bone wand because it is a better win con than aladin's ring, we only need to play six spells to win the game, and we want to cast spells anyway.
voting out goblin cannon because we need a lot of mana to get it going and probably multiples to win
4 Desert Twister
4 Harmonize
4 Fruition (1 @ -2)
4 Hurricane
4 Nature's Lore
2 Scouting Trek (-2)
2 Stream of Life
1 Regrowth
4 Moment's Peace
2 Constant Mists
Artifact (8)
3 Aladdin's Ring
2 Goblin Cannon(1 @-2)
1 Darksteel Reactor
3 Nevinyrral's Disk
2 sphinx bone wand
3 Vernal Bloom (-1)
4 Utopia Sprawl (-1)
Lands (24)
24 Forest
lets try not to hit the cutting phase yet
Graham from Loading Ready Run
If we tuck in some cantrips to help out our Buyback and Flashback spells we can really jump start the Bone Wand!
I am going all in on the Bone Wand plan.
Voting Down
-All Scouting Trek (out)- We've already dropped some support, and we have a new plan to burn with fog.
-All Darksteel Reactor - Slow win that was ok as once in a while back-up plan on the turbo-fog route. But now I just want to burn.
-All Alladin's Ring - I'm convinced we can burn faster with Wand.
-All Utopia Sprawl - I want a cantrippy effect in this slot now. Something like Explore to work early or after we have the Wand down.
-All Goblin Cannon - This is a less efficient but also painful Hurricane. I want to take the pain from Hurricane since it triggers the wand.
Vote Up
+2 Sphinx-Bone Wand - I'm trying to cut some alternate finishers, so I've got to up this one.
+2 Constant Mists - This combines with Wand to be a fast clock, or Wand/Bloom for what will be an auto-win most of the time.
I'll refrain from adding anything yet, but I'd like to explore a few possibilities with the group.
Explore
Manamorphose
Cultivate
Alternate lifegain plan? Does G have flashbacking (or otherwise reuseable) lifegain that doesn't rely on critters?
Should we bother keeping the Hurricanes? Or just further reinforce our Fog wall?
4 Desert Twister
4 Harmonize
4 Fruition (1 @ -2)
4 Hurricane
4 Nature's Lore
2 Stream of Life
1 Regrowth
4 Moment's Peace
2 Constant Mists (1 @+2)
Artifact (8)
3 Aladdin's Ring (-1)
2 Goblin Cannon(2 @-2)
1 Darksteel Reactor (-1)
3 Nevinyrral's Disk
2 Sphinx-Bone wand (1 @ +2)
3 Vernal Bloom (-1)
4 Utopia Sprawl (-2)
Lands (24)
24 Forest
Moderator Help Desk
Sales Thread
Seconding +2 on wand and mists. I have always wanted to find a good use for those wands I got!
Vote to remove the ring, fruition, desert twister, cannon (gone), reactor, bloom, sprawl (gone). Bramble Crush can replace twister in a fog deck. The rest are good suggestions for the original win conditions, but not so sure for the wand win.
4 Desert Twister (-1)
4 Harmonize
4 Fruition (1 @ -2
4 Hurricane
4 Nature's Lore
2 Stream of Life
1 Regrowth
4 Moment's Peace
2 Constant Mists (2 @+2)
Artifact (9)
3 Aladdin's Ring (-2)
1 Darksteel Reactor (-2)
3 Nevinyrral's Disk
2 Sphinx-Bone wand (2 @ +2)
3 Vernal Bloom (-2)
Lands (24)
24 Forest
Taste of Paradise. like i said, can net us 1 more life than Stream of Life if we dump alot of mana into it.
so, instead of relying on several damage sources, we're relying on one?
Splinter where are you?
I'm wondering if Land Grant or Skyshroud Claim could be some needed ramp to get the :7mana:-cc artifact out early to start loading it up with counters.
and speaking of Life of the Loam- the already voted out [c]Scouting Trek[c] would have been awesome. Stack our deck, Dredge the Loam, get the lands back when cast the Loam.
I have no idea what to add to the deck; my last additions have already been axed- and as it stands, this deck is nearly dependant on the Constant/Loam/Wand combo...
4 Desert Twister (-1)
4 Harmonize
4 Fruition (1@-2, 1@-all)
4 Hurricane
4 Nature's Lore
2 Stream of Life
1 Regrowth
3 Life from the Loam
4 Moment's Peace
4 Constant Mists
Artifact (10)
3 Aladdin's Ring (-2)
3 Nevinyrral's Disk
4 Sphinx-Bone wand
3 Vernal Bloom (-2)
Lands (24)
24 Forest
I suggest we consider some more draw power - possibly Recycle or some artifact draw, and Fastbond for some ramp and to make Constant Mists easier to reuse.
King of Misfortune & Master of Rocket Launchers
"Do ya feel lucky? Because you'd better start runnin' while you still can."
375 Misfortune {+3 signed AP's} & 104 Rocket Launcher (41 AQ/ 63 Rev)
Edgar Rice Burroughs, forgotten legend of the word.
This pick is a good idea because of Loam/Mists.
No, here's the search. No buyback either. Looking to life gain more generally, Fruition has already been mentioned. It's kinda bad early and gets better late, though. I looked through every green life gain card, and here is every loosely plausible one:
Healing Leaves
Lifegift
Nourish
Quiet Disrepair
Respite
Elixir of Immortality is also an option that potentially helps Loam if this deck sees play in multiplayer games.
It's rarely a good idea to just rely on fogs. We should aim for a Feeling of Dread into Supreme Verdict style of play with Hurricanes and Nevinyrral's Disks.
Well, we'll have Hurricane. But really, if people are playing that kind of artifact removal in one's meta, add more win-cons and/or it's not a good idea to try to win with a monogreen creatureless deck anyway.
I'm voting out Aladdin's Ring for being slow and Vernal Bloom for being enchantment ramp. I'm adding in Explore.
I'm also voting down Desert Twister for being too expensive in a fog/sweeper deck and Fruition for preventing less damage on net than potential Fog variants.
4 Desert Twister (-2)
4 Harmonize
4 Fruition (1@-2, 2@-all)
4 Hurricane
4 Nature's Lore
4 Explore
2 Stream of Life
1 Regrowth
3 Life from the Loam
4 Moment's Peace
4 Constant Mists
Artifact (7)
3 Nevinyrral's Disk
4 Sphinx-Bone Wand
24 Forest
I'm a little bit late to the party, but with the addition of LftL wouldn't the cycling lands (Tranquil Thicket, Slippery Karst, Blasted Landscape) cover this?
EDH Decks:
2 out, 2 @ -2
4 Desert Twister (-2)
4 Harmonize
2 Fruition (-2)
4 Hurricane
4 Nature's Lore
4 Explore
2 Stream of Life
1 Regrowth
3 Life from the Loam
4 Moment's Peace
4 Constant Mists
Artifact (7)
3 Nevinyrral's Disk
4 Sphinx-Bone Wand
24 Forest
Hurricane doesn't hit the ground or opposing lock/combo pieces. If all goes well, Wand will let it keep us off a Hurricane draw. We've lost an important combo piece in Vernal Bloom, but since we no longer need to protect that, it might be better to run Oblivion Stones over Hurricane. Grants redundancy to disk, and can't hit anything important.
Without Vernal Bloom our life-gain and potential to combo out take a beating. We're down to 2 Fruition, which is almost strictly better than Stream without the doubling effect. I'm also tempted to drop Hurricane for Stone because of this. The loss of Bloom also cripples Mists and LftL interactions with our Wand.
Right now I'm thinking maybe we drop life-gain altogether to get room for more hard ramp and less conditional sweepers. We're going to need more land now if we want to win within a couple turns of dropping Wand.
Moderator Help Desk
Sales Thread
2 Restock
4 Desert Twister (-2)
4 Harmonize
2 Fruition (-2)
4 Hurricane
4 Nature's Lore
4 Explore
2 Stream of Life
1 Regrowth
3 Life from the Loam
4 Moment's Peace
4 Constant Mists
Artifact (7)
3 Nevinyrral's Disk
4 Sphinx-Bone Wand
Lands (24)
24 Forest
So Pro I have an alpha Volcanic Island
adding 4 cultivate because we need the ramp and it is a very good ramp spell, sphinx bone wand costs 7 mana and that is a lot
2 Restock
4 Desert Twister (-2)
4 Harmonize
4 cultivate
4 Hurricane
4 Nature's Lore
4 Explore
2 Stream of Life
1 Regrowth
3 Life from the Loam
4 Moment's Peace
4 Constant Mists
Artifact (7)
3 Nevinyrral's Disk
4 Sphinx-Bone Wand
Lands (24)
24 Forest
Graham from Loading Ready Run
And since we wouldn't really need the Beat until the turn before we aim to combo, I think we can safely run those Stones I mentioned.
Vote Against :
-Desert Twister (out): For 2 more mana O-Stone blows the world. We miss the ability to hit specific lands with this change. I think that is a narrow enough concern to merit the mass wipe.
-Hurricane : Banking on O-Stone and Disk to keep us safe.
-Stream of Life : I'm looking to keep life up between 8 reusable fogs and 7 sweepers making up 25% of the deck. Cutting Stream ups consistency for combo and leaves us more vulnerable to burn. I think that is more an issue of bad match-ups existing for any deck than of poor building.
Adding :
4 Oblivion Stone : Wipes protection such as mask effects aside as well as most permanent based threats.
2 Restock
4 Harmonize
4 cultivate
4 Hurricane (-1)
4 Nature's Lore
4 Explore
2 Stream of Life (-1)
1 Regrowth
3 Life from the Loam
4 Moment's Peace
4 Constant Mists
Artifact (11)
4 Oblivion Stone
3 Nevinyrral's Disk
4 Sphinx-Bone Wand
24 Forest
Moderator Help Desk
Sales Thread
The aforementioned card is Karn Liberated which is a good finisher, if you pull of the ultimate you are getting back the bone wands that they removed with splinter and you basicallywin the game by card advantage with the ultimate, it can also be a repeated removal. It also makes great use of the fog combo in our deck. it is one of the best cards for this archetype adding 3.
voting to remove stream of life and because even on defense life gain is bad, and we need the spots to add more ramp and more fog effects.
voting out hurricane because it is just not the best removal and we probably won't be up on life even with defense so the card is just not worth it in my opinion.
2 Restock
4 Harmonize
4 cultivate
4 Hurricane (2@ -4)
4 Nature's Lore
4 Explore
2 Stream of Life (2@ -2)
1 Regrowth
3 Life from the Loam
4 Moment's Peace
4 Constant Mists
Artifact (11)
4 Oblivion Stone
3 Nevinyrral's Disk
4 Sphinx-Bone Wand
3 Karn Liberated
Lands (24)
24 Forest
I still don't want to hit the cutting phase because I want more ramp but I just don't want to put all our eggs into one basket so I added Karn.
Please cut before hitting 75
Graham from Loading Ready Run
Voting up Hurricane as essential T2-T3 sweeper against the worst aggro matchups.
Voting down Karn Liberated over price even if good card is good.
Voting down Stream of Life to complete its eviction.
Voting down two copies of Cultivate because I suspect Loam, Nature's Lore, and Explore already provide decent ramp and Cultivate is the worst/least synergistic one on the list.
2 Restock
4 Harmonize
4 Cultivate (1@-2)
4 Hurricane (1@-4)
4 Nature's Lore
4 Explore
1 Regrowth
3 Life from the Loam
4 Moment's Peace
4 Constant Mists
Artifact (11)
4 Oblivion Stone
3 Nevinyrral's Disk
4 Sphinx-Bone Wand
3 Karn Liberated (1@-3)
Lands (24)
24 Forest
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StaffIf you want to use Hurricane as a sweeper, how are you going to give all of your opponent's creatures flying?
Whoops, good point. Somehow I read that to be "without flying."
voting down 2 cultivate for reasons stated above.
Adding Cyclone as a damage source and sweeper. It is dangerous to play with out life gain though.
2 Restock
4 Harmonize
4 Cultivate (2@-2)
4 Hurricane (1@-4)
4 Nature's Lore
4 Explore
1 Regrowth
3 Life from the Loam
4 Moment's Peace
4 Constant Mists
Enchantment
2 Cyclone
Artifact (11)
4 Oblivion Stone
3 Nevinyrral's Disk
4 Sphinx-Bone Wand
3 Karn Liberated (1@-3, 1@-2)
Lands (24)
24 Forest
Currently offering 2 non-foil Kolighan's Command for a Date Stamped foil!
convert bulk into good cards? PucaTrade - https://pucatrade.com/invite/gift/21195
Ebay - decks/Promos/DVDs
Trade thread (constantly updated)
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/trading-post/details/337-pokerbob1s-casual-trading-emporium
Cuts:
2 Cultivate: we have 8 2 drops that get us mana. 2 is plenty
All Hurricane : I don't think we need an air only sweeper at this point. We do need defense, this isn't the answer
All Cyclone: Again, this is just enchantment hurricane, which is just worse in this deck. It takes up our resources and slowly kills us. No go.
Adding:
4 Tranquil Thicket if we want life from the loam, then lets abuse it, by cycling and REcycling these lands.
Also rec. snowlands and mouth of OMNOMNOMNOM
2 Restock
4 Harmonize
2 Cultivate
4 Hurricane (2@-4)
4 Nature's Lore
4 Explore
1 Regrowth
3 Life from the Loam
4 Moment's Peace
4 Constant Mists
Enchantment
2 Cyclone (1 @ -all)
Artifact (11)
4 Oblivion Stone
3 Nevinyrral's Disk
4 Sphinx-Bone Wand
3 Karn Liberated (1@-3, 1@-2)
Lands (24)
20 Forest
4 Tranquil Thicket
So Pro I have an alpha Volcanic Island
Emerald Medallion.
We ramp and sweep until hitting 9 land. Medallion, Wand, pass, then untap, and Mists for the win.
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Cyclone is more than an "enchantment hurricane" since it hits all creatures. It does drain resources through and isn't particularly efficient. It does work with Sun Droplet. That might be a different deck though.
Currently offering 2 non-foil Kolighan's Command for a Date Stamped foil!
convert bulk into good cards? PucaTrade - https://pucatrade.com/invite/gift/21195
Ebay - decks/Promos/DVDs
Trade thread (constantly updated)
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/trading-post/details/337-pokerbob1s-casual-trading-emporium
Moving forward: we had a discussion about using "for reasons stated above" as an explanation for cutting cards. There was a discussion that led to this conclusion.
From this point on, please give specific reasons. "As stated above" is not a clear reason, as the GMAD participants had a problem with that reasoning a while back.
EDIT: The tone of this post seems more curt than I would like it to be. Read this as "just a reminder," not "GRRRRAAAAR!"
Thanks to GR @ Yavin IV Studios for the signature!
Voting to keep-
Cyclone- it's our consistant "board sweeper" adn we have Restock/Regrowth there to get it back when things start going south again.
Voting to cut:
2 Hurricane- since it hits only flying creatures there's a slim chance that this'll hit multiple creatures. still, it's nice to hit after we ditch a Cyclone.
4 Oblivion Stone okay... a more convoluted and complicated Nevinyrral's Disk. are we really going to waste time trying to protect our "stuff' [which we have not a lot of], when we can just say "eh, screw it." and frag the entire field?
2 Karn, Liberated. my whole mentality with casual decks is, they should be fairly affordable. i'm not going to dump $90 into a casual deck. and since this deck has gone off the deepend more times than i can count, one will be fine as a "what the hell are they doing?" factor.
because I can, adding 1 Armageddon Clock.
2 Restock
4 Harmonize
2 Cultivate
4 Hurricane (1 @ -2, 2@-4)
4 Nature's Lore
4 Explore
1 Regrowth
3 Life from the Loam
4 Moment's Peace
4 Constant Mists
Enchantment
2 Cyclone
Artifact (12)
4 Oblivion Stone (1 @ -all)
3 Nevinyrral's Disk
4 Sphinx-Bone Wand
1 Armageddon Clock
3 Karn Liberated (1@-3, [EMAIL="2@-2"]2@-2[/EMAIL])
Lands (24)
20 Forest
4 Tranquil Thicket
King of Misfortune & Master of Rocket Launchers
"Do ya feel lucky? Because you'd better start runnin' while you still can."
375 Misfortune {+3 signed AP's} & 104 Rocket Launcher (41 AQ/ 63 Rev)
Edgar Rice Burroughs, forgotten legend of the word.
so by fixing the votes we are already down two karn and down two hurricane
I will vote to keep the last karn because it isn't that much ($2) over our budget and it does do great things for our deck.
voting to keep O-Stone, not because we are going to save our stuff but as more (and more expensive) disks, because it gets rid of planeswalkers we don't have a lot of other ways to do that early to mid game, which is dangerous because planeswalkers can go off fast.
adding four plow under because it is a way to slow the game down for our opponent which we need to survive long enough to cast bone wand and Armageddon clock.
2 Restock
4 Harmonize
2 Cultivate
2 Hurricane (2 @ -2)
4 Nature's Lore
4 Explore
1 Regrowth
3 Life from the Loam
4 plow under
4 Moment's Peace
4 Constant Mists
Enchantment
2 Cyclone
Artifact (12)
4 Oblivion Stone
3 Nevinyrral's Disk
4 Sphinx-Bone Wand
1 Armageddon Clock
1 Karn Liberated
Lands (24)
20 Forest
4 Tranquil Thicket
Graham from Loading Ready Run
I disagree. People are working together nicely on this; that's what GMAD is supposed to do.
That being said, keep the tone friendly or don't participate in GMAD.
Thanks to GR @ Yavin IV Studios for the signature!