MTG Salvation

Although you include no commentary, I assume you are looking for a critique. Dragon is one of my favorite archetypes so, excuse my bias.

I think that Ambassador is outmoded as a kill method and that Eternal Witness is better. It's a bit complex and I can explain if needed. The Ambassador does not kill right away, and can be circumvented somewhat with Collusus, Proggy, Necro and a few other exotic items.

I think that Bazaar of Baghdad is required for Dragon to become even close to being tier one in Vintage. You need to be able to discard Dragons in hand, Buried Alive while nice - is slow and not aided by any rituals. BoB allows both drawing and discarding. If you are on a budget or card short (which doesn't appear to be so from the above listing), you could use Compulsion or Read the Runes but both are suboptimal for the most part.

Orim's Chant seems odd as a one of in White.

Defense Grid hinders you from going off on your opponents turn. I guess it's playable just seems that it hinders you at the same time.

I like Negate slighty better then Mana Leak, unless your meta is very aggro creature heavy, but it's more likely used to protect your combo then stop creature rushes.

I would say that 4 Force of Will's would be better then 3 and maybe up the blue count slightly as 17 blue spells is right on the edge of acceptable for pitching.

4 Dragons would be best.

Consider a U/B base for mana consistency and resiliency, which allows you to add black hand disruption to slow opponents and help force through your combo.

ona queen of fai is a good kill, cause it doesn't allow graveyard shenanigans

Quote from Beralt

Although you include no commentary, I assume you are looking for a critique. Dragon is one of my favorite archetypes so, excuse my bias.

I think that Ambassador is outmoded as a kill method and that Eternal Witness is better. It's a bit complex and I can explain if needed. The Ambassador does not kill right away, and can be circumvented somewhat with Collusus, Proggy, Necro and a few other exotic items.

I think that Bazaar of Baghdad is required for Dragon to become even close to being tier one in Vintage. You need to be able to discard Dragons in hand, Buried Alive while nice - is slow and not aided by any rituals. BoB allows both drawing and discarding. If you are on a budget or card short (which doesn't appear to be so from the above listing), you could use Compulsion or Read the Runes but both are suboptimal for the most part.

Orim's Chant seems odd as a one of in White.

Defense Grid hinders you from going off on your opponents turn. I guess it's playable just seems that it hinders you at the same time.

I like Negate slighty better then Mana Leak, unless your meta is very aggro creature heavy, but it's more likely used to protect your combo then stop creature rushes.

I would say that 4 Force of Will's would be better then 3 and maybe up the blue count slightly as 17 blue spells is right on the edge of acceptable for pitching.

4 Dragons would be best.

Consider a U/B base for mana consistency and resiliency, which allows you to add black hand disruption to slow opponents and help force through your combo.

Doesn't witness require another card to kill? Or I'm missing something =p Explain please

well you mill yourself with a bazzar, and then to stop the dragon from going in and out you animate witness instead of the dragon, then when witness comes into play, you get something back like a "fireball" or stroke of genius to win.


Im not sure if your makeing the argument that one card wins are better than two card wins, but if you are:

sure it takes two cards and not just one like ambassador, but when the one card gets the other card back from an infinitely large grave, its a one card win...

I've been building a reaminatior deck with the same worldgorger/animate dead combo. I would put an entomb in the deck for a cheap card to get any card you want in the graveyard. For the finish I would run stroke of genius or benefire. You might want to consider some cheap creatures such as putrid to chump block and for the added discard.

actually, with witness you don't need another card.

(with bazaar out) animate dragon

mill self/infinite mana.

when animate comes into play, return witness w/ animate, breaking the loop.

return either a cunning wish and go for the win, or return animate, animate dragon, and each time witness comes back into play, return ancestral to your hand and make them draw their library.

demonic consultation is too risky imo, you may remove one of your only win conditions from the deck. and you could probably cut down a little on the cunning wishes.

instead of the draw 7's, I'd run 2-3 deep anals and 1 mulldrifter. really good with intuition. It also doesn't allow your oponent to get new cards to potentially screw you over.

4 dragons are a must if you run bazaar. If you insist on running buried alive, run 4 dark rituals and some thoughtseize. but bazaar is much better. Here is a basic list that I would run:

4 bazaar

4 worldgorger dragon
3 animate dead
3 necromancy
1 eternal witness
1 oona/sundering titan

4 force of will
3 thoughtseize

3 intuition
3 deep anal
2 read the runes
1 vamp
1 demonic
1 cunning wish
1 mulldrifter
1 ancestral
1 time walk

and that would be the base of my deck, not including the mana. mulldrifter allows for breaking the loop and as card advantage when dragon is not in the grave. deep anal is also really good at putting cards into your hand. intuition or bazaar get it in the grave as well.

I play so many necromancy because they allow you to outplay your opponent. nothing is better than when they tap out eot and you animate for the win.

Quote from Cretaceous1987

I have a quick question and not sure if this thread has died.

But would a recommend creature to "Turn Off" the D.Combo would be Sliver Queen ? I do have a list that has served quite well and will post it. But was not sure if I reviewed it enough. I figure get the infininte going then select the Queen during the interaction after building up mana then flood the field with slivers.

Sliver Queen has been out of the combo for quite some time. Ambassader Laquatus was used for a while after that, but even he has been retired now.

The new win condition of choice if Oona, Queen of the Fae. Like the Queen, she makes 1/1s - that also fly, so are better than the Queen's 1/1s. Like the Ambassador, she mills your opponent's deck - but exiles the cards, so cards like Gaea's Blessing and the Eldrazi do not prevent you from winning.

Here is a more current list.

Crazy old thread necroed = locked