That is actually a good concept to talk about, personally I would like to hear about it more. To me at this moment it's like a phrase, a simple adjective towards the noun, but the meaning of the noun isn't taken out of place.
Japanese Jund is given credit for not only it's performance, but the simplicity of it. It has the same theme as regular Jund decks, massive card advantage. It takes this level with new adapted cards like Siege-Gang Commander and Rampant Growth.
So yea, I'd like to read more thoughts on this. I just feel at the moment that this UGRB deck is not Jund at all, whether you define it by a skeleton of cards or difference of playstyle, it doesn't seem to fit the definition of the archetype.
As long as there is arbitrary interpretation of Jund, it would seem several decks could be deemed Jund within reason. Awhile back in a different competitive Jund thread, I believe a consensus had come about as to what defines the skeleton of Jund.
* - Take note the amount of Bitunimous Blast and Broodmate varies.
While I agree "Sedraxis Jund" may be played slightly different than other Jund builds, much of SSJund is comprised of the competitive skeleton. It would seem fitting to identify the deck as Sedraxis Jund, as just thinking about it I can already name off 90% of that deck.
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Ban Broodmate Dragon, I guarantee you Jund will continue to dominate tournaments.
While all 33 1rst place Jund decks used Broodmate Dragon, I still think Jund could dominate without the dragon.
Absolutely not, Broodmate is not what makes Jund insane. Cascade is what makes Jund insane. Blightning is what makes Jund insane. Bloodbraid Elves is what makes Jund insane. Maelstrom Pulse is what makes Jund insane. Sprouting Thrinax, even, is what makes Jund insane.
Broodmate Dragon? Without the top-notch removal, massive card-advantage, hand disruption, etc... Jund would not be the deck it is today. Inexperienced (or players who think they're good... ) often see the Broodmate finisher and think "that's why Jund won". That's not why Jund won, Jund won because it has card advantage, Jund won because it has board control, Jund won because it can explode out of the gate and dominate the board.
Ban Broodmate Dragon, I guarantee you Jund will continue to dominate tournaments - Broodmate is replaceable. Ban Bloodbraid Elf, and you'll have done far more to weaken Jund. Without the insane plays like "T3 - Blightning, T4- Bloodbraid into Blightning" or "T2 - Rampant Growth, T3 - Bloodbraid into Thrinax" it will be easier for other decks to compete.
I'm of course not suggesting that Bloodbraid be banned, I'm simply pointing out the reality of the situation - if you believe Broodmate is the reason they win, try and make a Jund deck *without* Bloodbraid Elves, and run it against a Jund deck without Broodmate Dragon (run the Sedraxis build preferably). Tell me which one does better.
That is ridiculous, your argument is essentially that taking out a finisher, and taking out midrange capabilites to test what deck is better? Each serve the spot within the deck. Your basically saying "Take out Lightning bolt, and take out Hell's Thunder, play with crappy substitutes and see which deck works better in a RDW"
Broodmate Dragon is top deck hallapalooza, if you cannot understand that this is finisher of choice because of its pure evasion and 2 for 1, which puts players on less then a 3 turn clock. Then I have no idea what to say to you, and I hope the next major competitive event for some darn reason I run into you.
You can't simply analyze a cards power by taking out limbs from the deck then comparing it.
jund is the bread now spread it like butter. lol anyways I only have about 2 people play jund out of about 20 people and out of the last 3-4 times I have played standard I haven't had to play even 1 single jund (probably b/c I lost first round like all the time ). I can't really complain about jund but personally I would like to see them get hosed like faeries did.
Same here. I mean, I don't hate it. It doesn't get me emotional, but it is a problem.
I don't wish to burst your bubble, but Broodmate dragon is a finisher. Without it, they'll run siege gang commander or something akin. Jund wins because of the cascade mechanic and the ability to spit out more card advantage than other decks in the format because control decks have been hated out by wizards.
What I find disturbing is that everyone claims that fae was the stronger deck, or affinity was.
The point is, for fae you needed at least some skill to play it right and it won because professionals knew how to play it, or better players than you. Jund is a deck that plays on autopilot most of the time. The second thing; the powerlevel in those formats was just a lot more evenly spread, and you had multiple viable decks. In this format not so much. The best cards are in RGB at the moment, UW doesn't have that much to say.
Does it seem like a healthy format to you when even the japanese at the end of year tournament Finals can't find a way to beat jund? Half of their top8 was Jund.
Banning just bloodbraid elf makes the format a lot fairer. I have no problem playing against a deck with blightning in it. I have a problem with a mid-range deck without any combo or control in the format, because control gets beaten by the mid-range deck, where it should usually triumph.
Agreed on every point. Jund will one day be exaclty what slivers are: The noobtube autopiloting deck of magic. I really don't understand why Wizards has taken a dump in blue recently. Maybe it was thier over reaction to faeries. Really though, Faeries weren't the monster they were because blue was too powerfull. They were terribly unbeatable because they could switch from Control to Aggro in a split second with that Falsh counter faery and Glen Elandra and bitterblosom.
I don't wish to burst your bubble, but Broodmate dragon is a finisher. Without it, they'll run siege gang commander or something akin. Jund wins because of the cascade mechanic and the ability to spit out more card advantage than other decks in the format because control decks have been hated out by wizards.
What I find disturbing is that everyone claims that fae was the stronger deck, or affinity was.
The point is, for fae you needed at least some skill to play it right and it won because professionals knew how to play it, or better players than you. Jund is a deck that plays on autopilot most of the time. The second thing; the powerlevel in those formats was just a lot more evenly spread, and you had multiple viable decks. In this format not so much. The best cards are in RGB at the moment, UW doesn't have that much to say.
Does it seem like a healthy format to you when even the japanese at the end of year tournament Finals can't find a way to beat jund? Half of their top8 was Jund.
Banning just bloodbraid elf makes the format a lot fairer. I have no problem playing against a deck with blightning in it. I have a problem with a mid-range deck without any combo or control in the format, because control gets beaten by the mid-range deck, where it should usually triumph.
Agreed, this is what I've been trying to say, perhaps not worded in such a way as you have done. Bloodbraid Elf is insane, thanks in part to Blightning, because it punishes any stumble so harshly, and allows Jund to pull of amazing plays even in topdeck mode.
No other deck in the format can pack the removal density to counter Jund. Your only hope is to beat them before their CA becomes overwhelming (RDW, BloodQuake, Boros), get a little lucky with a deck that can overwhelm their removal (WG Aggro), or throw their own spells back at them (Grixis, Team America). Even those decks, even with sideboards and mainboards built to hurt on Jund, don't always get it. I've seen Jund players completely misplay against Jacerator and still cinch the win.
The cascade mechanic simply allows the Jund player to stumble into wins at times.
That is ridiculous, your argument is essentially that taking out a finisher, and taking out midrange capabilites to test what deck is better? Each serve the spot within the deck. Your basically saying "Take out Lightning bolt, and take out Hell's Thunder, play with crappy substitutes and see which deck works better in a RDW"
Broodmate Dragon is top deck hallapalooza, if you cannot understand that this is finisher of choice because of its pure evasion and 2 for 1, which puts players on less then a 3 turn clock. Then I have no idea what to say to you, and I hope the next major competitive event for some darn reason I run into you.
You can't simply analyze a cards power by taking out limbs from the deck then comparing it.
I'm not taking cards out on a limb, I'm pointing out that without Bloodbraid Elf, Jund becomes a lot more "fair". What is a replacement for Bloodbraid Elf in Jund? Absolutely nothing. Suggest to any Jund player that they run less than the full four Bloodbraid Elf - there's just no way. No one, no one, takes Bloodbraid out of Jund.
There are tons of cards that could work as finishers in the format. Dropping a Siege-Gang Commander is equally devastating most of the time, or having Garruk's ultimate go off after getting the Thrinax tokens out, or even (though I consider it crappy) Master of the Wild Hunt with appropriate creature density could work.
I've seen Jund run Malakir Bloodwitch in the SB and swap out the Broodmates for it against Bant, Naya, etc... and it works. Banning Broodmate would do nothing to the power of Jund as the clear champion of Standard. Banning Bloodbraid Elf would completely neuter them.
Ban it or make a card that hits cascade in general.
An Ethersworn Canonist that's an artifact, rather than creature. An artifact where you had to pay 2 for each spell played in a turn beyond the first, for example, would make early-game "insane" cascade a thing of the past.
But I don't see that happening, nor do I think it needs to happen. Jund can be balanced simply by other decks out there getting a few more cards. I don't know if I want to see the format become quite as explosive - it's odd when Standard becomes Extended.
I want to echo the sentiment that Broodmate Dragon is not what makes Jund tick. Once again, and I hate to bring him up once more, but the Nevada state champion pilots a SGC/Rampant variant of Jund with ONE Broodmate.
Broodmate is a fantastic card and a brilliant finisher, but Jund still works without it. If you honestly think Broodmate is the problem with Jund, you're letting your Timmy side blind you because it's a big, cool dragon. Take Broodmate out and Jund will still put up wins.
I have a proxy Jund deck that I've tested against for months. It's recently evolved from "traditional Jund" (Garruk, 2-3 Broodmates, Leech) to the Rampant/SGC Jund that's seemingly the next evolution of the build, and twice as lethal, IMO.
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Play Spread'em. Your Jund problem will be solved in two weeks.
Just wanted to echo this myself. If it's "that bad" convince one or two friends to put Spread'em together and end it. You can force people to tear Jund apart at FNM's if you simply say "No. It will not work." with Spread'em.
And if it doesn't change, you and a few friends are going to be raking in the Points/Packs/Promos...I see no downside.
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Multikicker could hurt Jund. In the same way it doesn't want to play X spells, it may not want to play Multikicked cards, even if they have good kicked abilities. It may not specifically stop Jund, but it could be used to make Vampires, Naya, RDW better. But then, RDW really doesn't need to get any better.
Although i find it pointless to discuss this further but it is obvious why Jund is the dominate deck in Standard right now, all its spells are either 2 for 1 or damage straight to the head. With Bloodbraid cascade mechanic, it is as good as a hand/board control on a stick. Decks that abuses such mechanic will usually be a all rounder in the meta when permission decks are at its weakest.
I wouldn't be surprised if Jund will still be dominating standard even after WWK, the card advantage for that deck is absurd. A simple cascade trigger might turn the table on you. A Broodmate Dragon is even strictly much better even than Baneslayer Angel in general circumstances, thus the reason of it being a stock maindecked card. Can Jund do without Broodmate Dragon ? Sure it could if there are better finishing cards that creates the same card advantage that the dragons did. If there is a card to ban to really stop Jund from getting played, it would be Bloodbraid Elf although i see no reason to yet.
Can Jund be beat ? Of course, it is a card game and draws are random but chances are against you.
Can Jund be beat consistently by a specific deck ? Yes of course, but that deck loses to the rest of the meta.
So what is the conclusion ? Any deck that abuses the Cascade mechanic usually generates more card advantage, Jund just had the better splash of colors in terms of board/hand control(which is what matters in this meta right now especially with a smaller card pool). If Naya had spells that could equate Blightning/Maelstrom that can be cascaded for free via Bloodbraid, do you not think that it would be as dominating as Jund is ? The point is not about a single card, but an assortment of cards that works together to give the win while being good even on their own.
He is so man, he is mario, and I will tell my opponents such. As and when I bounce their permanent I will exclaim "MARIO" as though he were stomped on by our mighty Jace. Every time someone kill him I will give them 99 USD (not AUS!!!) because their lightning bolt should cost 100 DOLLARS...
Jace even made it into the Teenage Super Hero Mutant Ninja Hero Turtles.
Banning just bloodbraid elf makes the format a lot fairer. I have no problem playing against a deck with blightning in it. I have a problem with a mid-range deck without any combo or control in the format, because control gets beaten by the mid-range deck, where it should usually triumph.
Banning bloodbraid would cripple jund and put it firmly below vampires.
Banning broodmate requires Jund players to find a new finisher, SGC, thornling, bloodwitch being the best contenders, kaarthus, helion and maybe violent ultimatum being viable but not all that good.
The biggest advantage of removing broodmate is that it doesn't cripple the deck completely, doesn't impact any other top decks and adds a chink in junds CA armor.
If Naya had spells that could equate Blightning/Maelstrom that can be cascaded for free via Bloodbraid, do you not think that it would be as dominating as Jund is ?
Just to add, if Kiss of the Amesha had been unreasonably priced and the angel had shroud even bant could give Jund a run for it's money in the current meta.
With this all talk about how good spread'em is I would love to see how spread'em decks win some major tournaments. It just isn't a good deck. My cruel control / white control decks both thrash the deck and I wonder how the deck is going to put up an fight if jund player gets to pulse once. Spread 'em is annoying deck to play against, but not dangerous. On the other hand, I don't play jund so that might be the reason why I've lost only one single game to spread 'em, which I later won (2-1.).
Sure, jund is beatable, but it's not fun to play against and even new players can see that the deck works on it's own for most of the time. Cascade is a powerful mechanic.
You're right. Spread Em will never win top money because it just isn't good vs. the rest of the field and Vampires absolutely destroys it. However there is another deck that if played well, beats Jund decently. This deck is America Control and it was a joy to watch it played at the Starcitygames tournament and beating Jund. And yes, 1 Pulse gets rid of those nasty Seas.
Cascade is a powerful mechanic. I rank it up with Storm, Dredge, and Affinity for most powerful mechanics.
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You're right. Spread Em will never win top money because it just isn't good vs. the rest of the field and Vampires absolutely destroys it. However there is another deck that if played well, beats Jund decently. This deck is America Control and it was a joy to watch it played at the Starcitygames tournament and beating Jund. And yes, 1 Pulse gets rid of those nasty Seas.
Cascade is a powerful mechanic. I rank it up with Storm, Dredge, and Affinity for most powerful mechanics.
LSV wrote an article about URW control. Wherein he said that they ended up redoing the deck from about the ground up, and he had the deck maining four spreading seas and the like...basically you can beat jund by starting post board. And then having your normal cards to side in against anything else.
Not to mention that any jund list running multiple mind rots in the side for the mirror will side them in against you. And that just sucks to plow through.
Luis just won the Standard portion of SCG10K Los Angeles with RWU Control, beating the mirror in the top eight and Jund in semi-finals and finals. There are options, you just need to look harder.
I didn't say it was an autoloss. But to assert that something "beats jund" when its still really awkward to play against is a bit of a misrepresentation. Capable of beating jund and just beating jund have different connotations.
Also I'd bet he was playing the "boarded against jund for g1" version. -.-
EDIT: yeah, a turn two spreading seas in g1 means he was mained to best jund specifically.
I played through Cadaverous Bloom Combo, Urza's Saga and it brokenness, Afinity and Skull Clamp nonsense. Jund is nowhere near as powerful. Jund can be beaten, Spread em beats it a lot. Its just you will lose to other stuff if you use it, so it is rock paper scissors, just like t2 is supposed to me.
I'm somewhat new to magic, since I started in Alara block, but I'm enjoying the current meta a lot. It always leaves some possibility for a deck. Jund will obviously do well if 80% of the people are playing it, but a good variety can make for some fun games. At my lgs there are a lot of jund and vampire decks, but it doesnt mean other decks dont do well, it just means other decks have to be good. Jund is a good deck, and that's why it's played. You can't expect people to show up to fnm with a bunch of awful cards. Without good cards people would just complain more.
I'm somewhat new to magic, since I started in Alara block, but I'm enjoying the current meta a lot. It always leaves some possibility for a deck. Jund will obviously do well if 80% of the people are playing it, but a good variety can make for some fun games. At my lgs there are a lot of jund and vampire decks, but it doesnt mean other decks dont do well, it just means other decks have to be good. Jund is a good deck, and that's why it's played. You can't expect people to show up to fnm with a bunch of awful cards. Without good cards people would just complain more.
You sir have an amazing signature.
But yeah, something like Stifle would be nice. Or how about this:
Deception Trap 3UU
Instant
If an opponent cast 2 or more spells this turn, you may pay U rather than pay Deception Trap's mana cost. Gain control of target spell.
I've seen Jund run Malakir Bloodwitch in the SB and swap out the Broodmates for it against Bant, Naya, etc... and it works. Banning Broodmate would do nothing to the power of Jund as the clear champion of Standard. Banning Bloodbraid Elf would completely neuter them.
Why would you SB out Broodmate Dragon for Malakir? Ever? Run both against Naya/Bant or whatever deck, and sub out the useless cards that have no targets. Like Bituminous Blast isn't going to do anything to stag, you should take out a few of those.
Broodmate is the best finisher at this current standard. Banning wouldn't ruin Jund, but Jund decks would have to adapt. Siege-Gang, Malakir, Thornling even? Seriously? Cards like that cannot replace BMD. Jund would have to adapt.
Nor am I disagreeing, because BBE is a core element of Jund. Yes, you are taking limbs apart and comparing them. We are talking about an Aggro-Control card with multiple elements that need to be filled best as possible, you are taking the best card in 2 different areas then comparing them. You are then using this argument as a tool to say that BBE is better then BMD, which is a highly subjective paper argument, when considering the entire deck in mind. No one goes less then 2 BMD without some amazing tech.
Oh BTW Starcity has decided to relabel the "Sedaxris" Jund as "Jund+Blue", if it meets certain elements. Slightly against it, but most of the relabeled decks meet my personal criteria.
But yeah, something like Stifle would be nice. Or how about this:
Deception Trap 3UU
Instant
If an opponent cast 2 or more spells this turn, you may pay U rather than pay Deception Trap's mana cost. Gain control of target spell.
BBE into Blightning? Steal your blightning then.
That can also be solved with Counterspells, or Swerve, or my personal favorite Silence at upkeep. Your trap is slightly overpowered for by itself and could be worded better, but agree i need to have a fighting chance of control with monoblue and not need white or red.
Swerve is usually a blowout if you land it on a blightning.
While I'll admit you're right about that, a decent Jund player won't let that happen for the most part.
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As long as there is arbitrary interpretation of Jund, it would seem several decks could be deemed Jund within reason. Awhile back in a different competitive Jund thread, I believe a consensus had come about as to what defines the skeleton of Jund.
* - Take note the amount of Bitunimous Blast and Broodmate varies.
4 Sprouting Thrinax
4 Blightning
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Verdant Catacombs
0 Bitunimous Blast
0 Broodmate Dragon
While I agree "Sedraxis Jund" may be played slightly different than other Jund builds, much of SSJund is comprised of the competitive skeleton. It would seem fitting to identify the deck as Sedraxis Jund, as just thinking about it I can already name off 90% of that deck.
While all 33 1rst place Jund decks used Broodmate Dragon, I still think Jund could dominate without the dragon.
That is ridiculous, your argument is essentially that taking out a finisher, and taking out midrange capabilites to test what deck is better? Each serve the spot within the deck. Your basically saying "Take out Lightning bolt, and take out Hell's Thunder, play with crappy substitutes and see which deck works better in a RDW"
Broodmate Dragon is top deck hallapalooza, if you cannot understand that this is finisher of choice because of its pure evasion and 2 for 1, which puts players on less then a 3 turn clock. Then I have no idea what to say to you, and I hope the next major competitive event for some darn reason I run into you.
You can't simply analyze a cards power by taking out limbs from the deck then comparing it.
Agreed on every point. Jund will one day be exaclty what slivers are: The noobtube autopiloting deck of magic. I really don't understand why Wizards has taken a dump in blue recently. Maybe it was thier over reaction to faeries. Really though, Faeries weren't the monster they were because blue was too powerfull. They were terribly unbeatable because they could switch from Control to Aggro in a split second with that Falsh counter faery and Glen Elandra and bitterblosom.
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Agreed, this is what I've been trying to say, perhaps not worded in such a way as you have done. Bloodbraid Elf is insane, thanks in part to Blightning, because it punishes any stumble so harshly, and allows Jund to pull of amazing plays even in topdeck mode.
No other deck in the format can pack the removal density to counter Jund. Your only hope is to beat them before their CA becomes overwhelming (RDW, BloodQuake, Boros), get a little lucky with a deck that can overwhelm their removal (WG Aggro), or throw their own spells back at them (Grixis, Team America). Even those decks, even with sideboards and mainboards built to hurt on Jund, don't always get it. I've seen Jund players completely misplay against Jacerator and still cinch the win.
The cascade mechanic simply allows the Jund player to stumble into wins at times.
I'm not taking cards out on a limb, I'm pointing out that without Bloodbraid Elf, Jund becomes a lot more "fair". What is a replacement for Bloodbraid Elf in Jund? Absolutely nothing. Suggest to any Jund player that they run less than the full four Bloodbraid Elf - there's just no way. No one, no one, takes Bloodbraid out of Jund.
There are tons of cards that could work as finishers in the format. Dropping a Siege-Gang Commander is equally devastating most of the time, or having Garruk's ultimate go off after getting the Thrinax tokens out, or even (though I consider it crappy) Master of the Wild Hunt with appropriate creature density could work.
I've seen Jund run Malakir Bloodwitch in the SB and swap out the Broodmates for it against Bant, Naya, etc... and it works. Banning Broodmate would do nothing to the power of Jund as the clear champion of Standard. Banning Bloodbraid Elf would completely neuter them.
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Ban it or make a card that hits cascade in general.
An Ethersworn Canonist that's an artifact, rather than creature. An artifact where you had to pay 2 for each spell played in a turn beyond the first, for example, would make early-game "insane" cascade a thing of the past.
But I don't see that happening, nor do I think it needs to happen. Jund can be balanced simply by other decks out there getting a few more cards. I don't know if I want to see the format become quite as explosive - it's odd when Standard becomes Extended.
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Broodmate is a fantastic card and a brilliant finisher, but Jund still works without it. If you honestly think Broodmate is the problem with Jund, you're letting your Timmy side blind you because it's a big, cool dragon. Take Broodmate out and Jund will still put up wins.
I have a proxy Jund deck that I've tested against for months. It's recently evolved from "traditional Jund" (Garruk, 2-3 Broodmates, Leech) to the Rampant/SGC Jund that's seemingly the next evolution of the build, and twice as lethal, IMO.
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Just wanted to echo this myself. If it's "that bad" convince one or two friends to put Spread'em together and end it. You can force people to tear Jund apart at FNM's if you simply say "No. It will not work." with Spread'em.
And if it doesn't change, you and a few friends are going to be raking in the Points/Packs/Promos...I see no downside.
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I wouldn't be surprised if Jund will still be dominating standard even after WWK, the card advantage for that deck is absurd. A simple cascade trigger might turn the table on you. A Broodmate Dragon is even strictly much better even than Baneslayer Angel in general circumstances, thus the reason of it being a stock maindecked card. Can Jund do without Broodmate Dragon ? Sure it could if there are better finishing cards that creates the same card advantage that the dragons did. If there is a card to ban to really stop Jund from getting played, it would be Bloodbraid Elf although i see no reason to yet.
Can Jund be beat ? Of course, it is a card game and draws are random but chances are against you.
Can Jund be beat consistently by a specific deck ? Yes of course, but that deck loses to the rest of the meta.
So what is the conclusion ? Any deck that abuses the Cascade mechanic usually generates more card advantage, Jund just had the better splash of colors in terms of board/hand control(which is what matters in this meta right now especially with a smaller card pool). If Naya had spells that could equate Blightning/Maelstrom that can be cascaded for free via Bloodbraid, do you not think that it would be as dominating as Jund is ? The point is not about a single card, but an assortment of cards that works together to give the win while being good even on their own.
If they do that, i can see Jund not getting played at all.
Banning bloodbraid would cripple jund and put it firmly below vampires.
Banning broodmate requires Jund players to find a new finisher, SGC, thornling, bloodwitch being the best contenders, kaarthus, helion and maybe violent ultimatum being viable but not all that good.
The biggest advantage of removing broodmate is that it doesn't cripple the deck completely, doesn't impact any other top decks and adds a chink in junds CA armor.
Just to add, if Kiss of the Amesha had been unreasonably priced and the angel had shroud even bant could give Jund a run for it's money in the current meta.
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You're right. Spread Em will never win top money because it just isn't good vs. the rest of the field and Vampires absolutely destroys it. However there is another deck that if played well, beats Jund decently. This deck is America Control and it was a joy to watch it played at the Starcitygames tournament and beating Jund. And yes, 1 Pulse gets rid of those nasty Seas.
Cascade is a powerful mechanic. I rank it up with Storm, Dredge, and Affinity for most powerful mechanics.
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Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me)LSV wrote an article about URW control. Wherein he said that they ended up redoing the deck from about the ground up, and he had the deck maining four spreading seas and the like...basically you can beat jund by starting post board. And then having your normal cards to side in against anything else.
Not to mention that any jund list running multiple mind rots in the side for the mirror will side them in against you. And that just sucks to plow through.
Also I'd bet he was playing the "boarded against jund for g1" version. -.-
EDIT: yeah, a turn two spreading seas in g1 means he was mained to best jund specifically.
Now playing:
T2: :symr::symg::symw:Boss Naya:symr::symb::symw:
:symr::symg::symb:Jund:symr::symg::symb:
T1.x :symw::symg::symr:Zoo:symw::symg::symr:
T1.5 :symw::symb:Reanimator:symw::symb:
T1 :symr::symb::symu:Stax:symr::symb::symu:
Heroes of the Plane Studios is awesome.
Decks
Mono black control
BUG :symb::symu::symg:
EXT:
Time Sieve :symw::symu::symb:
T1.5
Eva Depths :symg::symb:
EDH:
Glissa, the traitor :symb::symg:
Currently dreaming up:
T2- Eldrazi BUG :symg::symu::symb:
EXT- Superfriends 2.0 :symu::symw::symr:
"I'd like to buy a bowel" - wheel of torture
You sir have an amazing signature.
But yeah, something like Stifle would be nice. Or how about this:
Deception Trap
3UU
Instant
If an opponent cast 2 or more spells this turn, you may pay U rather than pay Deception Trap's mana cost. Gain control of target spell.
BBE into Blightning? Steal your blightning then.
Why would you SB out Broodmate Dragon for Malakir? Ever? Run both against Naya/Bant or whatever deck, and sub out the useless cards that have no targets. Like Bituminous Blast isn't going to do anything to stag, you should take out a few of those.
Broodmate is the best finisher at this current standard. Banning wouldn't ruin Jund, but Jund decks would have to adapt. Siege-Gang, Malakir, Thornling even? Seriously? Cards like that cannot replace BMD. Jund would have to adapt.
Nor am I disagreeing, because BBE is a core element of Jund. Yes, you are taking limbs apart and comparing them. We are talking about an Aggro-Control card with multiple elements that need to be filled best as possible, you are taking the best card in 2 different areas then comparing them. You are then using this argument as a tool to say that BBE is better then BMD, which is a highly subjective paper argument, when considering the entire deck in mind. No one goes less then 2 BMD without some amazing tech.
Oh BTW Starcity has decided to relabel the "Sedaxris" Jund as "Jund+Blue", if it meets certain elements. Slightly against it, but most of the relabeled decks meet my personal criteria.
That can also be solved with Counterspells, or Swerve, or my personal favorite Silence at upkeep. Your trap is slightly overpowered for by itself and could be worded better, but agree i need to have a fighting chance of control with monoblue and not need white or red.
-4C StuffUWGR
-Time SieveWUB
-Mass PolymorphUG
Extended:
-Looking Foward to new extended except people that will try and play Jund
Legacy:
-HypergenesisWUBRG
EDH:
Niv MizzetUR
Zur, The EnchanterWUB
Rhys, The RedeemedWG
While I'll admit you're right about that, a decent Jund player won't let that happen for the most part.
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/
Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me)