Phil, if you haven't already, check out this week's article where I talk about the hero/villain dichotomy. You'd like to see Balance back because of the hero's applications, I simply see too much value--and repeated use, to the detriment of games--by the villain.
I've read the article and agree with most of your points of the cons. However I don't see much about the hero/villain dichotomy, what part are you referring too?
You also said too much mana too quickly is problematic but this happens daily with Rofellos, Llanowar Emissary, why did he get off the banlist? It's also weird that you follow it up with people thinking you need green to compete in EDH,..
Oh right, EDIT: I'm not in favor of banning rofellos, it was just a mere statement.
Phil, if you haven't already, check out this week's article where I talk about the hero/villain dichotomy. You'd like to see Balance back because of the hero's applications, I simply see too much value--and repeated use, to the detriment of games--by the villain.
+1
To add to that hero-villain dichotomy, I just wanted to point something out. That's the fact that there is really just one best use for a card. This use is really a lot more evident than people think, and people will not run a card unless they know what it does.
Take for example, Wrath of God. Its use is obvious to everyone now. Play this before you play your creatures. It's probably the de facto best way to deal with creatures, being essentially better than any 4cc, Sorcery spot removal could be. In the beginning of Magic's development though, it seems like devs had an idea that everyone would be playing creatures, since they would be the most efficient if not the only ways to win. The idea probably got thrown around that Wrath of God was balanced at 4 mana against stuff like Pyrotechnics because the player would be losing his stuff too. But, that turned out not to be the case at all. Any novice making such poor use of a Wrath is going to get a quick lesson from other players. And so of course by comparison, the mana premium on Plague Wind just isn't worth it. People just learn how to play the better card instead.
Same thing with Balance. It doesn't take a long time to figure out that you play differently when you have it in your opening hand. This situation where Hero draws out to make his land drops every turn, Villain Exploration player ramps out to infinity, and then Hero lays down this card... it just doesn't happen. At the very least, a Balance player is going to be holding a fist full of lands when it's played. And not long after, every player wanting to play Balance is going to play Zuran Orb and Greater Gargadon effects to turn it into a 2 mana Devastation. Which is, needless to say, very abusive in light of the fact that the obvious play is to float a bunch of mana then play anything.
Balance is just not the card that it seems to read as. And relying on players making poor use of a card in order to justify its legality is bad policy. That goes for any of these cards. Poor players with broken cards will often be policed by good players with good cards. Good players with broken cards are the only ones who can't be policed in game.
Same thing with Balance. It doesn't take a long time to figure out that you play differently when you have it in your opening hand. This situation where Hero draws out to make his land drops every turn, Villain Exploration player ramps out to infinity, and then Hero lays down this card... it just doesn't happen. At the very least, a Balance player is going to be holding a fist full of lands when it's played. And not long after, every player wanting to play Balance is going to play Zuran Orb and Greater Gargadon effects to turn it into a 2 mana Devastation. Which is, needless to say, very abusive in light of the fact that the obvious play is to float a bunch of mana then play anything.
Balance is just not the card that it seems to read as. And relying on players making poor use of a card in order to justify its legality is bad policy. That goes for any of these cards. Poor players with broken cards will often be policed by good players with good cards. Good players with broken cards are the only ones who can't be policed in game.
I don't get it, didn't you just give examples as to why this is good to combat fast ramp like Exploration? Then you mention it can be a two card-combo Devastation and go act like that's the worst people can do with two card-combo's?
Worth noting for players who want to reset the game, Cataclysm is pretty fabulous at doing that too. But it's also not on a 1W casting cost, making it substantially different.
I don't get it, didn't you just give examples as to why this is good to combat fast ramp like Exploration? Then you mention it can be a two card-combo Devastation and go act like that's the worst people can do with two card-combo's?
That's obviously not the worst people can do with 2-card combos. In fact, I wouldn't even call Balance + Zuran Orb/Squandered Resources a combo because it doesn't win the game and both cards are good by themselves. It's more like obvious, smart deck design, which is why I'm saying that Balance is an obvious broken card.
I am also fine with Devastation at 7 mana, while I would not be at 2. Someone with enough mana to cast Devastation or Jokulhaups while floating for something to win the game is on enough mana to deserve to win the game un-countered. Also if you see a Greater Gargadon or Squandered Resources open, you get ready. But Balance just makes this kind of game too easy. Kind of how a 7/7 flying hexproof for 1 mana would be overpowered, but Tarmogoyf is just fine. Doing something too efficiently is different from being able to do it at all.
That's obviously not the worst people can do with 2-card combos. In fact, I wouldn't even call Balance + Zuran Orb/Squandered Resources a combo because it doesn't win the game and both cards are good by themselves. It's more like obvious, smart deck design, which is why I'm saying that Balance is an obvious broken card.
I am also fine with Devastation at 7 mana, while I would not be at 2. Someone with enough mana to cast Devastation or Jokulhaups while floating for something to win the game is on enough mana to deserve to win the game un-countered. Also if you see a Greater Gargadon or Squandered Resources open, you get ready. But Balance just makes this kind of game too easy. Kind of how a 7/7 flying hexproof for 1 mana would be overpowered, but Tarmogoyf is just fine. Doing something too efficiently is different from being able to do it at all.
I think that's much less offensive, due to its lack of hexproof. Many people have a problem with it, presumably because it's severely undercosted in this format, but it's far from the degeneracy of other cards. It takes seven turns of no removal or blockers to eliminate another player, and while the Ascendant's owner is certainly going to be doing other things, that player probably immediately became the target for two or more players. And while the lifegain may be inconvenient to an aggro deck, it shouldn't be game breaking. I think an argument could be made that Felidar Sovereign is a bigger threat, though I've never seen it win a game.
Side note: I like seeing Turn one Serra's Ascendant solely because everyone reacts to it like the player just told a mind blowing story, whereas Turn one Sol Ring or Sensei's Divining Top receive a golf clap. (I like to imagine a murmuring announcer.)
Yea I saw a turn 1 ascendant on mtgo last nite not a bad turn 1 better than nothing for sure. Unfortunately my turn 1 was Mox diamond imperial seal mana vault with a land in hand and top in hand. The Little bugger poked me once but he didn't get to poke me twice he didn't see a turn 3. You see had this guy instead been holding a Swords to plowshares I would be the one who didn't see a 3rd turn. In this format the fact that he's grossly under costed doesn't matter. Due to the card pool sol ring and mana crypt being grossly undetcosted is far worse ...
Yea I saw a turn 1 ascendant on mtgo last nite not a bad turn 1 better than nothing for sure. Unfortunately my turn 1 was Mox diamond imperial seal mana vault with a land in hand and top in hand. The Little bugger poked me once but he didn't get to poke me twice he didn't see a turn 3. You see had this guy instead been holding a Swords to plowshares I would be the one who didn't see a 3rd turn. In this format the fact that he's grossly under costed doesn't matter. Due to the card pool sol ring and mana crypt being grossly undetcosted is far worse ...
Yeah, I think I've seen you play your Ad Nauseam deck on MODO. It is true that Ascendant is not a problem when there are decks like yours running around. Too much energy talking about things that can just be policed out of the format by better decks. It's easy to build and better than Ascendant, but it's impossible to compete with Ad Nauseam.
Yeah, I think I've seen you play your Ad Nauseam deck on MODO. It is true that Ascendant is not a problem when there are decks like yours running around. Too much energy talking about things that can just be policed out of the format by better decks. It's easy to build and better than Ascendant, but it's impossible to compete with Ad Nauseam.
Ad naususm would be the card I normally pull with a mana vault hand but this wasn't my high tide ad naususm this was a DDLM deck playing add naususm I just cast DD tapp vault to top into gush into probe top into led into yawg win into troop led into prone into Labman tap that top one more time we are home free
Ad naususm would be the card I normally pull with a mana vault hand but this wasn't my highd naususm this was a DDLM deck playing add naseumm I just cast DD tapp vault to top into gush into probe top into led into yawg win into troop led into prone into Labman tap that top one more time we are home free
this is irrelevant. This deck would get played exactly once. ever. If we weren't convinced that you were purposely griefing us and they gave you the option to continue gaming with us.
this is irrelevant. This deck would get played exactly once. ever. If we weren't convinced that you were purposely griefing us and they gave you the option to continue gaming with us.
I don't care about you or your carebear club either champ. From the stuff you have said I can't belive anyone plays with you guys and your Gestapo rules. I sure never would. I prefer to play with people all with decks as fast as mine. You don't like how I play magic that's cool well **** your opinion too jackass
Ad naususm would be the card I normally pull with a mana vault hand but this wasn't my high tide ad naususm this was a DDLM deck playing add naususm I just cast DD tapp vault to top into gush into probe top into led into yawg win into troop led into prone into Labman tap that top one more time we are home free
this is irrelevant. This deck would get played exactly once. ever. If we weren't convinced that you were purposely griefing us and they gave you the option to continue gaming with us.
Want a cookie? This is what should be banned, bad attitudes.
I fail to see what the point of having banlist discussions for sol ring and the like. It was printed in commander product and sheldon commented on the forums saying it's not going anywhere.
I agree. We should all only play g/x decks because they are the most objectively fun and anyone who disagrees does not know the truth about EDH. Everyone should just play their decks because interaction beyond high fiving about how many land are in play is unfun and equivalent to casting Stasis while kicking puppies. I for one will never play with anyone who casts tutors, removal spells, blue cards, things I arbitrarily decide I don't like but will probably cast myself later.
I don't care about you or your carebear club either champ. From the stuff you have said I can't belive anyone plays with you guys and your Gestapo rules. I sure never would. I prefer to play with people all with decks as fast as mine. You don't like how I play magic that's cool well **** your opinion too jackass
Also, moxnix what the hell dude? How is this relevant? You're also doing the exact same thing you're getting angry about..
If the decks in your meta are all "as fast" as that and you like it, why keep suggesting all cheap mana rocks to be banned? When you stated you would've lost against counters/removal it's also very clear what "solitaire" minded deck building is going around and of-course those cards are running rampant, what did you expect?
Adapt and play answers, don't go acting like a 5 year old in a banlist discussion.
Let's say this again, powerhands have no business in a banlist discussion.
Also, moxnix what the hell dude? How is this relevant? You're also doing the exact same thing you're getting angry about..
If the decks in your meta are all "as fast" as that and you like it, why keep suggesting all cheap mana rocks to be banned? When you stated you would've lost against counters/removal it's also very clear what "solitaire" minded deck building is going around and of-course those cards are running rampant, what did you expect?
Adapt and play answers, don't go acting like a 5 year old in a banlist discussion.
He's probably mad that there are members of this format that feel certain play styles are not "the spirit of the format" and take it upon themselves to view the format as it should be vs how it is while being vocal about it and trying to remove them from any discussion. Point is certain cards have certain power levels in certain play groups. Serra ascendant is overpowered in craw wurm removalless metas.
aww, bad attidues, I'm sorry if you don't like his attitude, want a cookie?
-The definition of bad attitude.
It's not a bad attitude, i'm just trying to illicit a response!
I agree. We should all only play g/x decks because they are the most objectively fun and anyone who disagrees does not know the truth about EDH. Everyone should just play their decks because interaction beyond high fiving about how many land are in play is unfun and equivalent to casting Stasis while kicking puppies. I for one will never play with anyone who casts tutors, removal spells, blue cards, things I arbitrarily decide I don't like but will probably cast myself later.
Let's say this again, powerhands have no business in a banlist discussion.
Also, moxnix what the hell dude? How is this relevant? You're also doing the exact same thing you're getting angry about..
If the decks in your meta are all "as fast" as that and you like it, why keep suggesting all cheap mana rocks to be banned? When you stated you would've lost against counters/removal it's also very clear what "solitaire" minded deck building is going around and of-course those cards are running rampant, what did you expect?
Adapt and play answers, don't go acting like a 5 year old in a banlist discussion.
Edit:
aww, bad attidues, I'm sorry if you don't like his attitude, want a cookie?
-The definition of bad attitude.
I like good cards I like Brocken cards . If they banned a select few cards I think it would open the compeitive T1 decks to TONS more options as it stands. Then mr self empowered he pretty mych tells me that his way is the right way to play magic and I have no business playing a T1 deck he can shove it. The point I was trying to convey was that I simple removal
Spell is better than mr 6/6 when the format is easily turn 4 for multiple decks if you abuse the mana rocks.
I like good cards I like Brocken cards . If they banned a select few cards I think it would open the compeitive T1 decks to TONS more options as it stands. Then mr self empowered he pretty mych tells me that his way is the right way to play magic and I have no business playing a T1 deck he can shove it. The point I was trying to convey was that I simple removal
Spell is better than mr 6/6 when the format is easily turn 4 for multiple decks if you abuse the mana rocks.
I honestly don't know what you are saying half the time, and the other half I have to read twice to find the point you were trying to make.
Phil, if you haven't already, check out this week's article where I talk about the hero/villain dichotomy. You'd like to see Balance back because of the hero's applications, I simply see too much value--and repeated use, to the detriment of games--by the villain.
In EDH i believe the hero/villain roll swings back and forth. Yes balance can save the day, and yes it can ruin a game at the same time. But there are other cards that are just one sided ruin game abuse me types that are still allowed to have homes in the format. No one plays time warp to give another guy an extra turn.
Loved the article, but let me hit some points so you can maybe see where I'm coming from.
I'm talking about what the folks who regularly play in the League see as fun, or I suppose in this case not fun. I don't want to restart the whole casual-competitive / fun-unfun debate. We're actually not talking about that in any way here. All (non-cheaty) play styles are equally valid. What we're addressing here is the dissatisfaction from enough players that they don't want to come play anymore, which you can understand is bad business for the shop
"I don't find X fun so I'm going to stop playing at the shop."
That's immature behavior. The great thing about this format is you're always in a learning curve. It's not like standard where you have to build jund or be Brian Kibler brew master to win games. Knowing the game, smart deck building, and being open to playing any strategy makes you a better pilot and deck builder in this format. EDH is for players who love discovering cards, brewing, and having an ever evolving deck. Making meta calls, tuning accordingly, and adding new cards to a deck is why we show up every week to play. When you decide X cards and X strategies are un fun and bad for the format, Just because you personally find them un fun, you're being selfish and taking away the enjoyment of the format for others.
"i built an animar deck deck with all creatures that auto looses to torpor orb, so i'm going to make the guy playing torpor orb feel like **** by *****ing the entire game."
Yes, The toropr orb guy is ruining the animar guy's fun. But the animar guy is an idiot for building a deck that looses to A card.
Yes, this is battlecruiser Magic, and yes, I want huge, epic things to happen—just not too fast (feel free to insert your own adult-oriented innuendo here). Broken thing on turn 12 is fine. Broken thing on turn 3 is a disappointment.
Broken thing on turn 3 looses to balance. There, balance isn't winning the game, It's returning it to turn three. Balance on turn 12? Probably breaking the game. It's turn 12. The table, at that point, should trying to be putting the game away anyway. But it annoys greedy "I want to win ASAP" decks. So it's bad for the format.
Balance is broken early thanks to god hands, bad plays, and a underdeveloped meta. Catering to the "Ban sol ring" crowd promotes these situations.
If you have to change your decks to play at the shop or change them when you play elsewhere, it creates an annoyance for you.
For me this is terribly wrong. I love having to hit the lab to tune my deck. The shop and guys I play with magically got a huge boner for combo? Awesome! I get to dig through my cards and make adjustments. A guy put Telemin Performance in his deck just to hose my creature less dromar deck! was I mad when he played it? **** no. I laughed.
so while I was typing all this SCG took a ****. I wanted to quote more of the article and continue one, but I can't.
"I don't find X fun so I'm going to stop playing at the shop."
That's immature behavior. The great thing about this format is you're always in a learning curve. It's not like standard where you have to build jund or be Brian Kibler brew master to win games. Knowing the game, smart deck building, and being open to playing any strategy makes you a better pilot and deck builder in this format.
EDH isn't really a standardized format, though. I mean, I could come into a meta full of T1 combo and build a deck that could compete but that kind of meta seems boring to me. I also don't enjoy a "Craw Wurm.dec" meta where everyone else is on strict budgets. Sheldon Menery's EDH, fast combo metas, and super-budget are practically different games. What's immature about not playing a game because you don't find it fun?
I've read the article and agree with most of your points of the cons. However I don't see much about the hero/villain dichotomy, what part are you referring too?
You also said too much mana too quickly is problematic but this happens daily with Rofellos, Llanowar Emissary, why did he get off the banlist? It's also weird that you follow it up with people thinking you need green to compete in EDH,..
Oh right, EDIT: I'm not in favor of banning rofellos, it was just a mere statement.
[Primer] Kozilek, Butcher with Juice.
+1
To add to that hero-villain dichotomy, I just wanted to point something out. That's the fact that there is really just one best use for a card. This use is really a lot more evident than people think, and people will not run a card unless they know what it does.
Take for example, Wrath of God. Its use is obvious to everyone now. Play this before you play your creatures. It's probably the de facto best way to deal with creatures, being essentially better than any 4cc, Sorcery spot removal could be. In the beginning of Magic's development though, it seems like devs had an idea that everyone would be playing creatures, since they would be the most efficient if not the only ways to win. The idea probably got thrown around that Wrath of God was balanced at 4 mana against stuff like Pyrotechnics because the player would be losing his stuff too. But, that turned out not to be the case at all. Any novice making such poor use of a Wrath is going to get a quick lesson from other players. And so of course by comparison, the mana premium on Plague Wind just isn't worth it. People just learn how to play the better card instead.
Same thing with Balance. It doesn't take a long time to figure out that you play differently when you have it in your opening hand. This situation where Hero draws out to make his land drops every turn, Villain Exploration player ramps out to infinity, and then Hero lays down this card... it just doesn't happen. At the very least, a Balance player is going to be holding a fist full of lands when it's played. And not long after, every player wanting to play Balance is going to play Zuran Orb and Greater Gargadon effects to turn it into a 2 mana Devastation. Which is, needless to say, very abusive in light of the fact that the obvious play is to float a bunch of mana then play anything.
Balance is just not the card that it seems to read as. And relying on players making poor use of a card in order to justify its legality is bad policy. That goes for any of these cards. Poor players with broken cards will often be policed by good players with good cards. Good players with broken cards are the only ones who can't be policed in game.
I don't get it, didn't you just give examples as to why this is good to combat fast ramp like Exploration? Then you mention it can be a two card-combo Devastation and go act like that's the worst people can do with two card-combo's?
[Primer] Kozilek, Butcher with Juice.
GRW Mayael the Anima WRG
That's obviously not the worst people can do with 2-card combos. In fact, I wouldn't even call Balance + Zuran Orb/Squandered Resources a combo because it doesn't win the game and both cards are good by themselves. It's more like obvious, smart deck design, which is why I'm saying that Balance is an obvious broken card.
I am also fine with Devastation at 7 mana, while I would not be at 2. Someone with enough mana to cast Devastation or Jokulhaups while floating for something to win the game is on enough mana to deserve to win the game un-countered. Also if you see a Greater Gargadon or Squandered Resources open, you get ready. But Balance just makes this kind of game too easy. Kind of how a 7/7 flying hexproof for 1 mana would be overpowered, but Tarmogoyf is just fine. Doing something too efficiently is different from being able to do it at all.
What about a 6/6 flying lifelink for one mana?
I think that's much less offensive, due to its lack of hexproof. Many people have a problem with it, presumably because it's severely undercosted in this format, but it's far from the degeneracy of other cards. It takes seven turns of no removal or blockers to eliminate another player, and while the Ascendant's owner is certainly going to be doing other things, that player probably immediately became the target for two or more players. And while the lifegain may be inconvenient to an aggro deck, it shouldn't be game breaking. I think an argument could be made that Felidar Sovereign is a bigger threat, though I've never seen it win a game.
Side note: I like seeing Turn one Serra's Ascendant solely because everyone reacts to it like the player just told a mind blowing story, whereas Turn one Sol Ring or Sensei's Divining Top receive a golf clap. (I like to imagine a murmuring announcer.)
Damia http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=410191
DDFT Legacyhttp://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=505247
Domain Zoo http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=10212429#post10212429
Yeah, I think I've seen you play your Ad Nauseam deck on MODO. It is true that Ascendant is not a problem when there are decks like yours running around. Too much energy talking about things that can just be policed out of the format by better decks. It's easy to build and better than Ascendant, but it's impossible to compete with Ad Nauseam.
Ad naususm would be the card I normally pull with a mana vault hand but this wasn't my high tide ad naususm this was a DDLM deck playing add naususm I just cast DD tapp vault to top into gush into probe top into led into yawg win into troop led into prone into Labman tap that top one more time we are home free
Damia http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=410191
DDFT Legacyhttp://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=505247
Domain Zoo http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=10212429#post10212429
this is irrelevant. This deck would get played exactly once. ever. If we weren't convinced that you were purposely griefing us and they gave you the option to continue gaming with us.
I don't care about you or your carebear club either champ. From the stuff you have said I can't belive anyone plays with you guys and your Gestapo rules. I sure never would. I prefer to play with people all with decks as fast as mine. You don't like how I play magic that's cool well **** your opinion too jackass
Infraction for flaming. - cryogen
Damia http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=410191
DDFT Legacyhttp://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=505247
Domain Zoo http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=10212429#post10212429
Doesn't this lose to removal and counterspells?
Yes! That's why I originally said "if he had Swords to plowshares instead of ..."
Damia http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=410191
DDFT Legacyhttp://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=505247
Domain Zoo http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=10212429#post10212429
Sorry, I forgot you said that in an earlier post.
Want a cookie? This is what should be banned, bad attitudes.
I fail to see what the point of having banlist discussions for sol ring and the like. It was printed in commander product and sheldon commented on the forums saying it's not going anywhere.
Also, moxnix what the hell dude? How is this relevant? You're also doing the exact same thing you're getting angry about..
If the decks in your meta are all "as fast" as that and you like it, why keep suggesting all cheap mana rocks to be banned? When you stated you would've lost against counters/removal it's also very clear what "solitaire" minded deck building is going around and of-course those cards are running rampant, what did you expect?
Adapt and play answers, don't go acting like a 5 year old in a banlist discussion.
Edit:
aww, bad attidues, I'm sorry if you don't like his attitude, want a cookie?
-The definition of bad attitude.
[Primer] Kozilek, Butcher with Juice.
He's probably mad that there are members of this format that feel certain play styles are not "the spirit of the format" and take it upon themselves to view the format as it should be vs how it is while being vocal about it and trying to remove them from any discussion. Point is certain cards have certain power levels in certain play groups. Serra ascendant is overpowered in craw wurm removalless metas.
It's not a bad attitude, i'm just trying to illicit a response!
Then act like an adult, maybe people will start listening more.
[Primer] Kozilek, Butcher with Juice.
I like good cards I like Brocken cards . If they banned a select few cards I think it would open the compeitive T1 decks to TONS more options as it stands. Then mr self empowered he pretty mych tells me that his way is the right way to play magic and I have no business playing a T1 deck he can shove it. The point I was trying to convey was that I simple removal
Spell is better than mr 6/6 when the format is easily turn 4 for multiple decks if you abuse the mana rocks.
Damia http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=410191
DDFT Legacyhttp://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=505247
Domain Zoo http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=10212429#post10212429
I honestly don't know what you are saying half the time, and the other half I have to read twice to find the point you were trying to make.
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Clan RepresentativeIn EDH i believe the hero/villain roll swings back and forth. Yes balance can save the day, and yes it can ruin a game at the same time. But there are other cards that are just one sided ruin game abuse me types that are still allowed to have homes in the format. No one plays time warp to give another guy an extra turn.
Loved the article, but let me hit some points so you can maybe see where I'm coming from.
"I don't find X fun so I'm going to stop playing at the shop."
That's immature behavior. The great thing about this format is you're always in a learning curve. It's not like standard where you have to build jund or be Brian Kibler brew master to win games. Knowing the game, smart deck building, and being open to playing any strategy makes you a better pilot and deck builder in this format. EDH is for players who love discovering cards, brewing, and having an ever evolving deck. Making meta calls, tuning accordingly, and adding new cards to a deck is why we show up every week to play. When you decide X cards and X strategies are un fun and bad for the format, Just because you personally find them un fun, you're being selfish and taking away the enjoyment of the format for others.
"i built an animar deck deck with all creatures that auto looses to torpor orb, so i'm going to make the guy playing torpor orb feel like **** by *****ing the entire game."
Yes, The toropr orb guy is ruining the animar guy's fun. But the animar guy is an idiot for building a deck that looses to A card.
Broken thing on turn 3 looses to balance. There, balance isn't winning the game, It's returning it to turn three. Balance on turn 12? Probably breaking the game. It's turn 12. The table, at that point, should trying to be putting the game away anyway. But it annoys greedy "I want to win ASAP" decks. So it's bad for the format.
Balance is broken early thanks to god hands, bad plays, and a underdeveloped meta. Catering to the "Ban sol ring" crowd promotes these situations.
For me this is terribly wrong. I love having to hit the lab to tune my deck. The shop and guys I play with magically got a huge boner for combo? Awesome! I get to dig through my cards and make adjustments. A guy put Telemin Performance in his deck just to hose my creature less dromar deck! was I mad when he played it? **** no. I laughed.
so while I was typing all this SCG took a ****. I wanted to quote more of the article and continue one, but I can't.
The EDH stax primer
When you absolutely, positively got to kill every permanent in the room, accept no substitutes.
EDH isn't really a standardized format, though. I mean, I could come into a meta full of T1 combo and build a deck that could compete but that kind of meta seems boring to me. I also don't enjoy a "Craw Wurm.dec" meta where everyone else is on strict budgets. Sheldon Menery's EDH, fast combo metas, and super-budget are practically different games. What's immature about not playing a game because you don't find it fun?
Nothing, if you don't complain about it.
[Primer] Kozilek, Butcher with Juice.
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StaffThis isn't a point, it's also wrong. In general what Mox says is perfectly understandable (unlike a few months ago when I would have agreed with you).
Also, Ya'll need to calm the hell down and play some EDH.